US Goverment secretly Sabotaging SETI at Areceibo

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Message 830304 - Posted: 14 Nov 2008, 10:45:46 UTC - in response to Message 830184.  
Last modified: 14 Nov 2008, 10:47:25 UTC

Second problem:
if US government cover-up Arecibo aliens...
are Dan Werthimer, David Anderson, Eric Korpela & Co.
that cover-up Arecibo aliens discovery!



The problem with some people is they are so stuck in one way of thinking that they cant see the wood for the trees. Im a SETI@home user because I do belive. Despite the fact that I belive UFO's have already been here, SETI could be a way to pinpoint what area of space they are comming from. Perhaps even give us a way to communicate with them at a closer range.

There is no need to insult the good work of SETI staff or any other people on here. Any goverment involvment to prevent alien signals being captured by Areceibo and other stations would itself be highly secret. As such it is very unlikely that the SETI staff would know anything about it. I would therfore be gratefull if you would refrain from making any such accusations against them.

I have already posted a mear fraction of the more credible reports involving credible witnesses. If you cannot be botherd to take the time to look at the evidence I have posted earlier in this thread then please dont bother to post your comments here again. If you want to share an objective opinion on the matter then educate yourself and look at the evidence that is available !!.
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Message 830317 - Posted: 14 Nov 2008, 10:53:27 UTC
Last modified: 14 Nov 2008, 10:53:48 UTC

For any people who wish to share an objective and inteligent point of view, look at the evidence below. This is just a mear "fraction" of the evidence available if you bother to look for it.


http://ufos.nationalarchives.gov.uk

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=S-rCdpmLq_o

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=sSXu3g2T-a8

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fC0ZBAjREOM
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Message 830887 - Posted: 15 Nov 2008, 18:01:56 UTC
Last modified: 15 Nov 2008, 18:31:29 UTC

Viking, the problem is that the people who actually invented and currently maintain the very project you're participating in right now disagree with you.

Not only does the SETI@Home team disagree with your original post (they've posted multiple times shooting down conspiracy theories about the government censoring their data), but the SETI Institute also disagrees with you.

Aside from that, my understanding is that SETI researchers don't necessarily put much merit in UFOs as ET; if they honestly thought there was a remote chance of UFOs being ET *RIGHT HERE ON EARTH ALREADY*, I can assure you that they would stop SETI and devote 100% of their time to studying UFOs rather than listening to the sky for years and years with the slimmest of chances of ever hearing a single thing.

For any people who wish to share an objective and inteligent point of view, look at the evidence below. This is just a mear "fraction" of the evidence available if you bother to look for it.


http://ufos.nationalarchives.gov.uk

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=S-rCdpmLq_o

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=sSXu3g2T-a8

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=fC0ZBAjREOM



....but you do realize that none of that stuff, not ONE SINGLE BIT of it, is evidence of aliens from another planet, right?

Even if we assume that sightings and footage of unexplained phenomena in the sky are actually mechanical flying objects to begin with, the notion that those objects are aliens who traveled thousands of light years to our planet just to float around in the clouds to be spotted by cameras and human eyeballs is an idea that you're coming up with out of your own head.

Even if UFOs are really flying machines, why is the idea that they are aliens from another planet the most likely or even remotely plausible?



I remember posting a link to an article on these forums before about cloaking technology being developed right now; this technology would make an object or a person essentially 100% optically invisible. This technology is basically a decade or two away from being a reality.

Even before that technology becomes a reality, we already have stealth bombers designed and shaped specifically to be 100% invisible to all radar; not only are they invisible to radar, but our recon and stealth aircraft fly at such heights and speeds that they are 100% invisible to the naked eye on the ground, and they are perfectly able to obtain DETAILED and PRECISE reconnaissance information from extreme heights above the Earth, far far away from anyone on the ground. We've had spy planes with these kinds of technologies since the 1960s!!

Now if we have that kind of technology RIGHT NOW, can you imagine what kind of surveillance technology we'll have in 100 years? Or 500 years? Or 1,000 years?....How about 100,000 years????

Given that the typical ages between any two stars (and their planets) differ on the order of millions or hundreds of millions years, it seems to me that to suggest that UFOs which are visible to radar, visible to the naked human eye from the ground, have big flashy shiny lights, to suggest that these things are vehicles built by an alien race which is so much more technologically advanced than us as to have the INCREDIBLE, physics-defying capability to travel between stars at presumably faster-than-light speed, to suggest that these things are built by them seems to me to be extremely naive if not laughable.


You're telling me that these guys are so ADVANCED that they can travel between stars, something we can't even DREAM of doing, something that we won't have the technology to do perhaps even in a 1,000 years..... yet they don't have cloaking technology so they're 100% visible to the naked eye, they don't have the technology to be invisible to radar, and their optics and sensors are SO unbelievably primitive that they need to come down into our atmosphere and float in the clouds to be close enough to study our planet (which is funny, since we have the technology to study and scan the surface in full detail from outer space with TODAY'S TECHNOLOGY; hell, even Google maps does that) oh and by the way, they have big shiny lights like some freaking amusement park ride, even though our stealth aircraft which can travel faster than the speed of sound don't have a single visible light source on them.



Obviously you're free to your opinion, and I don't presume that videos and eyewitness accounts of UFOs are all fakes or that witnesses are liars; it could all be 100% TRUE.

.....but of all the possible explanations (including the one that they don't exist in the first place), the idea that these things are aliens from another planet seems the #1 most unlikely to me. Just my two cents.


It seems to me that if aliens wanted to study our planet and every single molecule on its surface, they probably wouldn't need to come anywhere near Earth. I imagine we ourselves would have the technology to do it in the not-to-distant future with nothing more than an invisible probe at the edge of the solar system.

We ourselves have just taken the first confirmed photographs of planets orbiting other stars light years away; using TODAY'S technology!
http://www.space.com/scienceastronomy/081113-hubble-exoplanet.html

Can you imagine what kind of technology we'll have in 100 or even 1,000 years?

Heck, if they're *millions* of years more advanced than we are, they may never need to leave their own planet to study us.
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Message 830903 - Posted: 15 Nov 2008, 18:58:16 UTC

Ok, now I write science fiction and fantasy. And I believe in aliens; otherwise I wouldn't be here at this project, right? Otherwise I wouldn't get all emotional sometimes at the thought that someday, maybe, we'll have a first contact scenario, and it's because I played some small part in it.

However, I think Taurus hit the nail on the head: whether or not you do or do not believe that aliens have already visited us, the entire SETI program -- specifically designed to help us find them and hopefully contact them in some way -- does not believe so. It's kind of why we have seti@home; the SETI folks are trying to broaden their search.

Believe me, I'd love to think aliens are here, that they've been here, and so on. I desperately want to think so sometimes. But there's nothing that says it.
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Message 830914 - Posted: 15 Nov 2008, 19:44:54 UTC

Very good summary Taurus
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Message 830934 - Posted: 15 Nov 2008, 20:52:04 UTC - in response to Message 830887.  
Last modified: 15 Nov 2008, 21:05:59 UTC

Viking, the problem is that the people who actually invented and currently maintain the very project you're participating in right now disagree with you.

Not only does the SETI@Home team disagree with your original post (they've posted multiple times shooting down conspiracy theories about the government censoring their data), but the SETI Institute also disagrees with you.



As far as I am aware not one person who has posted on this thread had anything to do with inventing or maintaining the SETI@Home project. Seccondly why are you getting so hept up about it ?. What should it matter to you if I or anyone else belives that UFO's exist. I belive they do and I belive the US Goverment is covering up their existance. I share my views with many millions of Americans and many millions more from other Countries. As for the Seti@home project you have to ask why it is that with so much computing power and so much data being processed why have SETI still found nothing. That question is even more relavent if as do I and many millions of others belive that UFO's and Alien life have been visiting us for thousands of years ?. The conclusion can only be that the equipment has been tampered with in some small way. But I certainly do not belive the SETI staff would have any knowledge of such tampering. Besides there are plenty of other Secrets of far lesser significance held by the US Goverment for which they are prepared to go to still greater extremes to cover up.

Try to think out of the box for a moment. Imagine that UFO's do visit us and the Goverment do know about it, perhaps even work with them. The effects on world Religions would be devestating. Military hardware posessed by other countries would suddenly be reguarded as useless. War could even break out because of fear for the unknown. So do you honestly belive for a single moment they would allow that knowledge to become public domain ?... Can you not imagine the kind of steps the Goverment may take to prevent it !.
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Message 830955 - Posted: 15 Nov 2008, 23:12:53 UTC
Last modified: 15 Nov 2008, 23:16:39 UTC

Having worked with Air Force (tactical) satellite communication terminals, I can offer one word why such elaborate "Independence Day virus trickery" isn't required: encryption. (Also, to a lesser extent: spread spectrum)


Ameature radio operators can easily find not only the beacons, but user carriers, of DoD satellites. Other than being pretty spikes on their spectrum analyzers, they aren't useful to them though.

With the very high volume of UFO sightings throughout the deccades,


"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence", Carl Sagan. Or, as a little old lady once said, "Where is the beef?"

There is no hard physical evidence of extraterrestrial visits. There are only testimonies and "Big Foot" quality photos/video. UFO'logy is more of a religion than it is a science.

it seems very very odd that SETI have made no discoveries whatsoever


Ten out of ten astronomers and cosmologists agree that space (and time) is a really, really, really, really, really, big place.
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Message 830967 - Posted: 16 Nov 2008, 0:01:12 UTC - in response to Message 830955.  

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence", Carl Sagan. Or, as a little old lady once said, "Where is the beef?


The day I saw a program on TV news program with an expert UFO-ologist claiming the footage he was showing was proof of a group of three UFO's I realized exactly what the people behind the UFO movement were. He was explaining how these three spacecraft were moving in unison as they jumped around. He swore up and down that we were being visited and the tape was proof.

My issue was that if you turned the brightness up you saw the rest of the airplane. Once you saw that you knew the footage was a hand held shot zoomed in way to close of a commercial airliner. There is absolutely no way this expert didn't know exactly what he was doing!

That is the creditability I think should be assigned to the people who claim to be expert in UFO's.
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Message 831018 - Posted: 16 Nov 2008, 2:23:26 UTC - in response to Message 830304.  

The problem with some people is they are so stuck in one way of thinking that they cant see the wood for the trees.

[sarcasm]Because, obviously, anyone would have to be nuts to disagree.[/sarcasm]
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Message 831116 - Posted: 16 Nov 2008, 10:40:36 UTC - in response to Message 830967.  
Last modified: 16 Nov 2008, 10:42:34 UTC

"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence", Carl Sagan. Or, as a little old lady once said, "Where is the beef?


The day I saw a program on TV news program with an expert UFO-ologist claiming the footage he was showing was proof of a group of three UFO's I realized exactly what the people behind the UFO movement were. He was explaining how these three spacecraft were moving in unison as they jumped around. He swore up and down that we were being visited and the tape was proof.

My issue was that if you turned the brightness up you saw the rest of the airplane. Once you saw that you knew the footage was a hand held shot zoomed in way to close of a commercial airliner. There is absolutely no way this expert didn't know exactly what he was doing!

That is the creditability I think should be assigned to the people who claim to be expert in UFO's.



As I have said before 99% of UFO reports are either honest mistakes or are bogus fakes. However the remaining 1% stil accounts for a very large number of sightings which cannot be explained by man made or nautual phenomena. Im about done with this now as it seems I am preacing to a bunch of very closed minded individuals. Ive provided evidence for you to look at, some collected by the UK Ministry of Defence. But you have refused to read or look at it. Personaly I realy dont care if you belive or not. Only it seems like a pitty that for people prepeared to use thier computers and large quantities of electricity searching for ET. The realy cool evidence you have been seacrching for has been right there in front of you all the time. Like I said earlier in this thread, some people just cant see the wood for the trees.

Im not going to post any more to this thread because im fed up with trying to have an inteligent conversation with closed minded people. Perhaps if you took a little time to research what you are dissing, then you might start to be a little more open minded. Until then, its been interesting peeps :0)

Happy Crunching with Seti@Home
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Message 831414 - Posted: 17 Nov 2008, 2:56:56 UTC

What do they eat ?
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Message 831433 - Posted: 17 Nov 2008, 4:38:53 UTC - in response to Message 831414.  

What do they eat ?


"To Serve Man" :)

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Message 831618 - Posted: 17 Nov 2008, 19:51:09 UTC

to summarize the opposition:
If you see Hoof prints in North America you should be thinking Horses not Zebras. Or better, If you see something flying in the sky its most likely a man made object. There is always the chance of meteors and comets and such.

Ancient sightings were clearly not alien craft. most could be explained as weather phenomenon or afformentioned space debis hitting the atmosphere.


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Message 831728 - Posted: 18 Nov 2008, 3:47:06 UTC - in response to Message 831414.  

What do they eat ?

Mealworms.
me@rescam.org
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Message 832556 - Posted: 20 Nov 2008, 21:55:46 UTC - in response to Message 829814.  

The US Goverment are almost certainly sabotaging the SETI project and the ideal place to do it is at the source of SETI data. Places such as Areceibo used to collect data could be easily sabotaged by the NSA. They dont need to do any damage, just introduce a small virus into the base code software that operates the telescope. The same has also most likely been done at other stations around the world. We all know that UFO's exist and we already know Aliens have visited us on multiple occasions.
............snip.......


Actually a virus is not needed to do this. All that is required is to turn on the military radar that transmits into the receiver at Areceibo thus overwhelming the receiver and then SETI has to blank it out. Neat and easy as pie. No problem.

But that would require a new conspiracy theory.


Boinc....Boinc....Boinc....Boinc....
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Message 832944 - Posted: 21 Nov 2008, 18:31:33 UTC
Last modified: 21 Nov 2008, 18:40:05 UTC

This is the official position of science & SETI@home:

"First, our alien friends could travel in a space ship and visit us. That would be a great method of communication -- face to face. Unfortunately, despite all the alleged Roswells and alien abductions and UFO sightings, there is not a single shred of scientific evidence that aliens have ever visited the earth. Not one. The amount of energy and time necessary to travel between the stars is so immense that a more "economical" method is mandated. Doing some simple calculations, you can prove that even if someone could invent a ship with the most efficient type of engine ("Star Trek" fans will be happy to know that this involves matter and antimatter!) that a trip to the nearest star, Alpha Centauri, with a twenty-year round-trip travel time would use enough energy to power over a million houses for over thirty million years! And this trip would only take a few people as passengers! This is not an economical method to communicate because this amount of energy, at today's costs, would cost well over $30 quadrillion. Can you imagine any alien government allocating this kind of resource to send a few of their people for a friendly visit? Of course, they could send out thousands or millions of lightweight probes announcing their existence and the probes could report back their findings, but this would still be very costly in both time and energy. Even though we would like to believe in warp drive, interdimensional shifting, and all the other wonders of science fiction, they are just that, fiction.
[...]
Any data collected will be made available to the scientific community for further analysis. As you can see, in spite of all the "conspiracy theories" that abound in the science fringe communities, there will be no attempt to hide any data or keep it from the public eye.
With a little luck, we may know within our lifetime if we are alone in our galaxy. I'm hopeful that we will find many friends out there."

Source: SETI@home
http://seticlassic.ssl.berkeley.edu/about_seti/radio_search_1.html



73 & clear skies from Bruno IK2WQA
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Message 832968 - Posted: 21 Nov 2008, 20:50:51 UTC

can I get an AMEN!!!


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Message 833710 - Posted: 23 Nov 2008, 21:10:48 UTC - in response to Message 831116.  
Last modified: 23 Nov 2008, 21:21:42 UTC

Thanks viking tens of thousands of people agree with you ,including those who make up the gorv. I think as humans we have to keep our minds open just because
we cant detect et does not mean that there not there or visting us as everyone
knows "the universe is a tricky place" with all our math and science of physics
and astronomy there is only very little that we can explain and for that reason
until we can answer questions like what gravity is , what is beyond the universe and many others we should be trying to find out why we cant detect them .i dont think any one is covering anything however gorv cant risk a situation that the cant properly explain to the public its political suicide but statistical given the size and age of the universe and the time its estimated for life to have evolved on earth its very unlikely that we are alone. one thing is for sure seti
should have a dream of independance its not in the interest of a research body like seti to be in closure cohabitation with gorvement.
We choose to go to the moon and to do other things, we choose to go to the moon not because its easy but because its hard. kennedy
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Message 835395 - Posted: 29 Nov 2008, 11:13:44 UTC

What are we doing here if not looking for signs of intelegent life?
Doesn't it stand to reason that in universe, which is yet to be proved infinate or not, there are infinate possibilities.

Yes there are a lot of people who have seen things, filmed things, claim to have first hand experience of things.

Yes there is no physical evidence in the public domain that can substanciate visitations from other worlds.

Although I am running SETI home I suspect it will not find anything dispite the high number of visual 'sightings' that people report. This can only be due to misinterpretation of what is flying in the sky, mass delusion and false memory syndrome or massive governmental cover up, or we are not looking on the correct frequencey.

Personally I would like to keep an open mind and belive the latter. If you can manipulate time, space dimentions you can probably do a load of other quite extrordinary work too. Creation? World leader installation? Memory manipulation on a global scale? Time? Matter? In an infinate universe/multiverse anything is possible, no?

Are you who you think you are?

Don't let any aspect of unproven life consume you.
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Message 837217 - Posted: 5 Dec 2008, 15:55:09 UTC

Viking, I think you need to replace your tinfoil hat.

This has to be one of the stupidest threads I have seen anywhere on these boards.
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