There has been a lot of speculation and misinformation on why Astro got banished, so I'll put an end to it. The reason is actually quite simple: Astro created a new account for the purpose of insulting and antagonizing another user. That account was banished. It is our policy that when a user creates multiple accounts, if one account gets banished they all get banished. To do otherwise would open the doors for people to just create multiple accounts for posting offensive material so their main account isn't at risk.

I'm sure there are a lot of people who think an exception should be made in the case of "people we like." I have made exceptions in moderation policy in the past, and have always come to regret it. I'm not going to be making such exceptions in the future.

As long as the forums are moderated, there will be people who have issues about where the lines are drawn and what is offensive. One person's joke is another persons endorsement of animal cruelty. There are also always going to be people who do their best to push the limits. Worse, there are going to be people who deliberately harass the moderators both on and off of the forums. Those people should not be surprised when they find themselves on the wrong side of the line.

We're rapidly approaching the first anniversary of the day the forums became "my problem". They became "my problem" because I was the only member of the staff who felt that we shouldn't just get rid of them. If the options were returning to where they were a year ago or closing them, I'd choose closing them.

A year later, and even though some things have improved (IMHO), I'm still the only member of the staff who thinks the forums serve a useful purpose.

Perhaps the rest of the crew is correct. The purpose of SETI@home is not to have forums, and every minute I spend dealing with them is a minute diverted away from the science. I'm not ready to abandon them yet, but every time someone raises a stink because they didn't like where the lines were drawn I get closer to that point.

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Phew!

Has everyone really missed the point of the (deliberate) banishment?

(OK, so bad pun for cat lovers but then again, the 'offending item' was soo faar out that it couldn't possibly be mistaken for anything other than a joke, could it?! There's far worse on "Tom and Jerry" cartoons! OK, so still a furry/grey area...)

I've followed the threads on the forums and on the mail list. The sequence of events very nicely showed that some parts of the Boinc forums infrastructure need tidying up.

All low priority for the science, yet very high priority for user feelings when modded for whatever reasons.

I myself just today had the various spread of semi-auto mod mailings and I agree that they do indeed need tidying up. To a sys-admin geek type, they read gruff but ok. To a new user they read arcane and imply "you never come back"!


My reading of events is that our friend engineered to gently test the mods group to run through the responses. It worked (too personally perhaps) and has highlighted a few aspects, perhaps including understandable bias on what gets modded and what doesn't. (No surprises, all very Human.)

The mods have very much a thankless task and even more thankless to try to balance values across the world and across cultures. I guess UK humour doesn't always work in the USA (nor vice versa).

The aspect highlighted is that there is no 'obvious' anonymous route to discuss with the mods in public or in private (as a group). The positive maillist discussion suggests this may be fixed. So, overall looks good.


Sorry, in short:

Good test, the furr has been ruffled, time to reflect and tidy up?

I just hope that a certain user doesn't feel that an engineered test has become too personal.

And perhaps the forums and the people on the forums have become at least some part of the science effort.

Regards,
Martin

Just a participant sharing his own views.



(And I think the Banishment should be shortened. Statement has been made by all already ;-) )

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See new freedom: Mageia Linux
Take a look for yourself: Linux Format
The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3)

I would even go as far as suggesting that at least half of all banishment votes have been started rather out of personal reasons than out of the content of the posts.
While some posters get away with real heavy insults and racial remarks, other users are banished for easily considerable jokes, for reacting on others flames, for things happening besides the boards via email. Where is the justice?

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Account frozen...

...than bad apples are to be found on both sides of the fence?

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Account frozen...

I'm still the only member of the staff who thinks the forums serve a useful purpose

Thanks Eric . . . seriously Sir! it is Much Appreciated - more than You could ever know . . .

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BOINC Wiki . . .

Science Status Page . . .

Hi Eric, thanks for the updates you have been providing in Technical News, much appreciated. Please pass my thanks to the rest of the team also.

In the nearly 6 months since my return to S@H, I have found the forums a godsend, especially the Number Crunching members.

All I can say to those who are causing the problems is to realise that if this happens WE all lose out.

I, for one respectfully request that you please hold off & let the new moderators find their voices, & maybe they can help take the pressure off you.

I hope & trust that they will, because if not, they will lose out also.

Kind regards to you & the team.

PJ

PS: If the forum does close, a lot of crunchers will miss the battle between you & the racoons. Please keep Angela posting, I believe a lot of us are awaiting the outcome!

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Most of the problems occur in the Cafe and Politics forums. The threads in these two forums would just be deleted as off topic anywhere else on the boards.

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BOINC WIKI

Most of the problems occur in the Cafe and Politics forums. The threads in these two forums would just be deleted as off topic anywhere else on the boards.

But the threads would still find their way to the other forums if Politics and the Café were closed. I don't know if that is what you were suggesting.

Well the forum is really good tool besides crunching. If in the institute majority is considering forum running is wrong then they are not respecting the international community which they themselves drew in. Any international project supposed to have forum to give a chance to all levels/types of people to get developed. (but in our case it is very or little bit muddy path)

Maybe it is inevitable process of one planet type of intelligence needs to reach to complete mutual understanding point before they (instinctively) touch with other planet types.

I mean technically we are on the right track. ;)

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Mandtugai!

Most of the problems occur in the Cafe and Politics forums. The threads in these two forums would just be deleted as off topic anywhere else on the boards.

But the threads would still find their way to the other forums if Politics and the Café were closed. I don't know if that is what you were suggesting.

It is probably worth the attempt. For a while, the moderators would be busy deleting off topic threads, but I believe that would subside over the course of a couple of weeks. Most of the users would figure out quickly enough.

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BOINC WIKI

Most of the problems occur in the Cafe and Politics forums. The threads in these two forums would just be deleted as off topic anywhere else on the boards.

But the threads would still find their way to the other forums if Politics and the Café were closed. I don't know if that is what you were suggesting.

It is probably worth the attempt. For a while, the moderators would be busy deleting off topic threads, but I believe that would subside over the course of a couple of weeks. Most of the users would figure out quickly enough.

You shouldn't have to do that - people should use their common sense - Yes I know your reply & I'll probably agree with you.

Should those boards be closed, & shift to the others, then after a while, their accounts should be closed -Permanently - I'm pretty sure that there are enough genuine crunchers out there for the admins & mods not to worry about.

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Most of the problems occur in the Cafe and Politics forums. The threads in these two forums would just be deleted as off topic anywhere else on the boards.

But the threads would still find their way to the other forums if Politics and the Café were closed. I don't know if that is what you were suggesting.

It is probably worth the attempt. For a while, the moderators would be busy deleting off topic threads, but I believe that would subside over the course of a couple of weeks. Most of the users would figure out quickly enough.

You shouldn't have to do that - people should use their common sense - Yes I know your reply & I'll probably agree with you.

Should those boards be closed, & shift to the others, then after a while, their accounts should be closed -Permanently - I'm pretty sure that there are enough genuine crunchers out there for the admins & mods not to worry about.

I just wasn't going to say it:)

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BOINC WIKI

I know, which is why I did.

It had to be said & it was best if a poster said it rather than an admin/mod.

As all my posts have proven, when I have been in the wrong, I have publically admitted it.

Unfortunately, I have been caught out by not being sure of the actual rules - however, I should have used my common sense.

I have a pretty wicked sense of humour, but I do know where to draw the line.

I personally think that a lot of these idiots think that because they are stuck behind a keyboard & not face-to-face, they can get away with anything.

I have come across some fantastic crunchers who are always there to help & advise. Because of these very welcome people, the forum should not be closed but the idiots concerned should be permanently banned.

Once the word got around, I'm pretty sure that other idiots would stay away & join forums that allow anything!

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If in the institute majority is considering forum running is wrong then they are not respecting the international community which they themselves drew in. Any international project supposed to have forum to give a chance to all levels/types of people to get developed.

No project has to have a forum. It's completely optional and up to the developers/administrators/etc.

It has nothing to do with respect or lack thereof. It has everything to do with cliques, politicking and tantrums.

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And once again we see the " We don't need you " attitude. Something that I was just very recently told that simply doesn't exist except toward those who are " disruptive ".

So much for that then, eh?

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Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

So much for that then, eh?

Nothing that a friendly game of Jewels wouldn't cure. ;)

Labbie's score is too high to even bother with it...lol

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Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

And once again we see the " We don't need you " attitude. Something that I was just very recently told that simply doesn't exist except toward those who are " disruptive ".

So much for that then, eh?

It is not a matter of we don't need people to crunch the data, the project does need people. It is just that if the forums get to be so disruptive that they are a large drain of resources, the forums are expendable. We keep hoping that tranquility (or at least a reasonable facsimilie of tranquility) will reign on the boards.

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BOINC WIKI

No project has to have a forum. It's completely optional and up to the developers/administrators/etc.

It has nothing to do with respect or lack thereof. It has everything to do with cliques, politicking and tantrums.

I checked maybe 10-15 boinc projects and they all have forums. If in Seti institute certain "scientists" consider forum is useless then they need to compare seti development with other dc projects development and recommended to learn few things on effective internet usage (despite their occasional porn surfings).

I am wondering any antiforum minded person is quite XXth century type or backward minded.

It is true that numbers of thugs almost freely terrorize here and some mods support them and that ignite all kinds of complaints, disruptions and etc.

Maybe if all mod's actions were visible to everyone then we would not doubt on mods and mods too supposedly improve their judgement skill through this transparency hence the forum with more positive atmosphere.

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Mandtugai!

You shouldn't have to do that - people should use their common sense - Yes I know your reply & I'll probably agree with you.

Should those boards be closed, & shift to the others, then after a while, their accounts should be closed -Permanently - I'm pretty sure that there are enough genuine crunchers out there for the admins & mods not to worry about.

I just wasn't going to say it:)

Sorry JM7. You are now trying to waffle a bit on what you just said.

That sure looks like a " We don't really need you " to me.

What " drain on resources " would you be referring to?? I really don't see ( since we have all these wonderful moderators, how the forums could be considered a " drain ". After all....that's what you all are here for....right??

You agreeing with what Sirius said only indicates that you agree with the feeling he has that the people using the Cafe and Politics forums aren't " genuine crunchers ".

Pray tell...what is it about me that makes you think I am not " genuine " ??

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Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

No project has to have a forum. It's completely optional and up to the developers/administrators/etc.

It has nothing to do with respect or lack thereof. It has everything to do with cliques, politicking and tantrums.

I checked maybe 10-15 boinc projects and they all have forums. If in Seti institute certain "scientists" consider forum is useless then they need to compare seti development with other dc projects development and recommended to learn few things on effective internet usage (despite their occasional porn surfings).

I am wondering any antiforum minded person is quite XXth century type or backward minded.

It is true that numbers of thugs almost freely terrorize here and some mods support them and that ignite all kinds of complaints, disruptions and etc.

Maybe if all mod's actions were visible to everyone then we would not doubt on mods and mods too supposedly improve their judgement skill through this transparency hence the forum with more positive atmosphere.

...I once used the term transparency here before...but it got stomped on in the mists of time.

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Account frozen...