I mean, if our team got together and donated some drives for the server, does that mean that we could demand that it be named SetiUSA/Calm Chaos?

I'll throw a few pennies their way and combine the name to Calm Synergy.USA

Only problem I can see with that...

Calm Chaos and Boinc Synergy are both listed as International teams....

How about the International States of America.

---

me@rescam.org

Ok....with all due respect to Eric & Matt and the crew at UB. Let me summarize the relevant concern...and someone other than Poppa (no offense)-preferably Eric or Matt-please respond...

1) You need a server...

Yes, we do.

2) Dr Dan has one and it was researched by Dr. Dan to fit your needs as closely as possible.

I spoke on the phone to Dr. Dan this morning and I'm looking into whether it can be done.

3rd logical step---JUMP AT IT-SAY YES AND TAKE IT REGARDLESS OF WHO'S NAME IS OR ISN'T ON IT! Name it Kryten Jr for all I care. Stop waiting for everyone to be in one place---if it fits a need-take it!

It's not quite that simple. I wish it were, but its not. We have to consider not only the 220V issue, but whether it will tax the total power that can be put into the server closet without tripping a breaker and whether the amount of waste heat it produces will overload the air conditioning unit. Then there's the issue of having enough physical space. There's a reason we call it a closet.

This is a massive machine, and it would cost Dr. Dan a significant amount of money to ship it here. If it gets here and there's something that prevents us from using it, I'd feel pretty bad about putting him to the trouble.

As is, it doesn't immediately fit an immediate need. In order to use it, assuming the power supplies aren't easily switched, we'll need 220V in the closet or a replacement power supplies, and we'll need 12 or more GB of additional compatible RAM, we'll need to decide which disk array to use and how to drive it. Dr. Dan will have to ship it across the country. Those things will take a little while to come together (assuming they can come together). There's no point in shipping it until we're sure that we won't hit a show stopper.

In the same conversation he mentioned another machine that is significantly smaller and might do just as well for what we need, so I'm looking into that, too.

We have to check things out because we have received machines that we weren't able to use as we intended because we didn't take a close enough look at the specifications and come up with the right plan.

[edit]
And I don't care about naming. We can call it whatever the donor wants or doesn't want.
[/edit]

Well, I for one hope that things with the server that Dr. Dan has offered do work out... Combined with the offer I had made prior to Dr. Dan's; together, we could hammer out many issues that Eric, Matt, et. al. have within the Server Closet that keep this project from peak efficiency at the moment.

My offer still stands; I plan on coming up this month, driving up from Southern California, (Riverside County, CA), to Northern California, (Danville, Fremont, and then Berkeley, CA), just to get the hardware from a Bankrupt company to the home of SETI@Home. I have not asked, (nor did or do I), expect anything special in return for my efforts other than a polite "thank you"... However, in Dr. Dan's original post of offer pertaining to the powerful Server in question; the exact word used that has sparked this rant session on all sides is "required" instead of "requested" pertaining to the name of the Server to replace Kryten. Had Dr. Dan chosen in his original post to use the word "requested" instead of "required" I do not believe we would be having this battle about naming conventions in the first place.

However; naming conventions aside, and "requests/requirements" also aside, the fact remains, (as stated here by Eric, Matt, et. al.), that the Server Closet at Berkeley for SETI@home is not set up, (and may not be able to be set up), to accommodate the Server offered by Dr. Dan. I sincerely hope that accommodations can be made, this offered Server does sound like it would truly answer many prayers for this Project. However; it still remains an issue of physical limitations, electrical load limitations, bringing up fire code limitations and building permit issues... Has anyone, (after reading the many posts here and elsewhere in the Forums), besides the Berkeley Team, (Eric, Matt, et. al.), considered these issues??? Or, are we just after recognition for petty reasons?

Fact: The cost to update the closet for proper air conditioning, electrical load, etc. means obtaining building permits, hiring a General Contractor, (licensed), Electrical Contractor, (licensed), and more... Also, for those whom are unaware of city and county red tape; Berkeley is one of the HARDEST, (if not the hardest), cities to deal with in obtaining Building Permits for anything. (I know this because my Father is a licensed General Contractor in the commercial field. He has done jobs in Berkeley.) UCB, (who most likely owns the space where this Server Closet resides), would be the one(s) to hire said contractors, agree to a time table for construction modifications to take place, and more... All for one donated Server??? Is this reasonable??? Do you think that, (even if UCB agrees to the proposal of upgrades for one piece of donated equipment), UCB will make this set of updates an easy/simple task; that they will make sure that the job is done on an efficient time table? I say no... They would hire the cheapest General Contractor, abide by the Contractor's schedule, and this means shutting down the whole SETI@Home Project during the construction upgrades. (Anyone give this any thought whatsoever???)

In close, let's give Eric, Matt, et. al. a break here. They have stated many times that they "would look into" the easiest way to implement the proposed donation made by Dr. Dan. Let's all hope for the best here, and if it is reasonable and feasible, they will find a way to make things work to accept the proposed donation by Dr. Dan.

If the answer turns out to be "no" then we have to let it rest. If the answer turns out to be "yes", then we let Eric, Matt, et. al. get the Server Closet prepared for the arrival of Dr. Dan's Server. Once in place, then Eric, Matt, Pappa, et. al. can discuss the name/naming convention with Dr. Dan.

In the meantime, I would like to confirm my update on my ETA. I will be leaving SoCAL the morning of the 12Th to arrive in the Bay Area in the late afternoon on the 12Th. I will then be going to Fremont where the equipment still resides waiting for me to inspect it. Once inspected, I will then call Eric with the details of what I find pertaining to the hardware within the three available Servers in Fremont. One Server will go to Berkeley with the APC Rack Mount Backup Battery, the other two Servers go with me back to SoCAL to update my own outdated farm and put two more crunchers into service for this Project.

Eric, if you have any questions for me in the meantime, call me at home. If the long distance call is a factor; just call me for a minute stating you would like to talk, I will then call you back. I have Vonage; thus a call for me from SoCAL to NorCAL is free.

I look forward to hearing from you. I look forward to seeing you and Matt during the week of the 12Th.


Sincerely,

---

TimeLord04
Have TARDIS, will travel...
Come along K-9!
Join Calm Chaos

Hi TimeLord04:

What are the specs of the server you are driving here to get to donate to S@H?

Just curious and BTW just to clarify we can switch out the power supply for a 110v model if necessary.

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Hi TimeLord04:

What are the specs of the server you are driving here to get to donate to S@H?

Just curious and BTW just to clarify we can switch out the power supply for a 110v model if necessary.

Unfortunately, at the moment, I don't have the complete specifications on the three available Servers. The company that owned them went Bankrupt, an auction for all of the other assets at said location has already occurred, the Landlord has been working closely with the Creditors' Attorneys. Until the 29Th of January, I couldn't even make a tentative promise that this would be possible. I got word from my contact there on the 30Th stating that the Servers were still unclaimed but that we had to wait for the Attorneys to grant permission for a day that I would go up and get the Servers and the Backup Battery.

All I know is one is labeled as an AMD, (possibly an Opteron), 2.2 GHz machine, another is labeled as an Intel P4, and the third is completely unlabeled. So, I will not have a full list of the equipment until I get up there the week of the 12Th of this month.


Sincerely,

---

TimeLord04
Have TARDIS, will travel...
Come along K-9!
Join Calm Chaos

A "requirement" is hardly a demand

A rose by any other name....

A requirement IS a demand. If you require that they put the name you want on it, then it's a demand being placed on them.

I have no personal prejudices ( as you put it ) against anyone or any team.

One of the people on your team had a real problem with the way I work for my team and had no problem at all stating his opinion about it. Well, I have a problem with this particular idea, and I have no problem stating my opinion about it.

It is not a personal prejudice against Seti.USA

It's just my opinion.

Now...that being said...

I believe I saw that the offer of the server was still valid even if they chose not to name it in the manner that was " required ". If that is the case, then that changes things a bit because it no longer is a " requirement " but a request. There is a huge difference. A requirement leaves them no option but to do things the way they are told. A request leaves them the option of not naming using the team name if they choose not to.

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

Just an observation...if you give a kid a puppy, you let the kid name it.

As far as gift giving/donations are concerned...once it is given it becomes the property
of the receipient for them to do with as they wish...

...otherwise it is called "with strings attached."

Giving should be selfless.

---

Account frozen...

Just an observation...if you give a kid a puppy, you let the kid name it.

As far as gift giving/donations are concerned...once it is given it becomes the property
of the receipient for them to do with as they wish...

...otherwise it is called "with strings attached."

Giving should be selfless.

Well said, DB; I and many others here concur.

---

TimeLord04
Have TARDIS, will travel...
Come along K-9!
Join Calm Chaos

dark angel see link below for the list of bowl games and the name of the staduim they where held at.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_football_bowl_games%2C_2004-05#GMAC_Bowl

also check out the Allen telescope (you know the one named after one the guy who paid for half of the thing)

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dark angel see link below for the list of bowl games and the name of the staduim they where held at.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA_football_bowl_games%2C_2004-05#GMAC_Bowl

also check out the Allen telescope (you know the one named after one the guy who paid for half of the thing)

Wow...thanks for backing me up on this one...lets see...didn't see a single bowl game named after a person....check

as for the stadiums...well...

Amon G. Carter Stadium
Named after Amon G. Carter, Sr. 12/11/1879-06/23/1955 (I'd call that dead)

Sam Boyd Stadium
Named after Sam Boyd 04/23/1910-1993 (I'd call that dead too)

Ford Field
Naming rights purchased by none other then the Ford Motor Company (I'd call that a corporate acquisition and should be noted that it is not named after a person)

Chase Field
Naming rights purchased by Chase Bank aka the BOB for it's original name Bank One Ballpark (I'd also call this a corporate acquisition and should also be noted that it is not named after a person)

Reliant Stadium
The entire complex is named for Reliant Energy under a 32-year, $300 million naming rights deal in 2000. (again a corporate acquisition and not named after a person)

Alamodome
(self explanatory but I will again point out it's not named after a person)

Bank of America Stadium
originally known as Carolinas Stadium, opened in 1996, as Ericsson Stadium after the Swedish telecom company purchased naming rights to the stadium. The stadium received its current name after Bank of America purchased the naming rights for 20 years. (oh look at that...still not named after a person...and is rather a corporate acquisition.

AT&T Park (formerly SBC Park and Pacific Bell Park)
(Again corporate acquisition and not named after a person...)

QUALCOMM Stadium (a.k.a. "The Q"), formerly known as San Diego Stadium and Jack Murphy Stadium
corporate acquisition
Jack Murphy (born February 5, 1923, died September 24, 1980) (dead)

Spartan Stadium
Named for the San Jose Spartans (again not a person)

LP Field
LP was previously named Adelphia Coliseum from 1999 to 2002 and The Coliseum from 2002 until 2006. The current naming rights deal with Nashville-based Louisiana-Pacific was inked on June 6, 2006. (not a person but rather a corporate acquisition)

Sun Bowl Stadium
Named for the Bowl game played there...go figure.

Liberty Bowl Memorial Stadium
It was dedicated to the citizens of Memphis who had served in World War I, World War II, and the Korean War.

Please let me know if you are missing the trend here; because I could continue, but like I stated in my previous post...

Got news for you most schools buildings are named after significant people sometimes large donors usually as a memorial for people that have passed away. Most stadiums are named after major corporations which pay big bucks to pin their name on a building; bowl games on the other hand aren't typically named after people. Rose bowl, orange bowl, pro bowl, super bowl, gator bowl, to name but a few or am I loosing you here. So in following with the "standard" it would make sense that the status quo remain the same...in other words it should be up to the SETI staff to name it like I stated in my earlier post.

As for the telescope...yep...The Allen Telescope Array, named after its most generous donor, Paul Allen

I doubt very much that he demanded to have his name on it though....The ATA is being funded by private donations through the SETI Institute. The major donor is Microsoft cofounder Paul G. Allen. The SETI Institute is also funded by many smaller donors; $50 gets you a one-year membership. A donation of $100,000 gets your name on a dish.

I believe this would be one of the rare instances that would fall under my aforementioned statement that they can be "named after significant people sometimes large donors". I would mention that this is a fairly rare occurrence.

I'm glad to see someone doing a little research before presenting data but I would recommend reading the original post and actually reading the data that you throw out lest you find yourself eating crow.

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When a team buys 5 acres of land, constructs the appropriate buildings, loads it with $2,000,000 dollars of equipment, pays the electric bill 10 years in advance, and sets up a trust fund to pay wages from... I'm sure they can call it anything they like including their team name. I'll provide the plaque out of my own pocket.

But guess who then gets to control the shots...? I thought we were talking about a gift/donation, not an acquisition.

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Account frozen...

When a team buys 5 acres of land, constructs the appropriate buildings, loads it with $2,000,000 dollars of equipment, pays the electric bill 10 years in advance, and sets up a trust fund to pay wages from... I'm sure they can call it anything they like including their team name. I'll provide the plaque out of my own pocket.

But guess who then gets to control the shots...? I thought we were talking about a gift/donation, not an acquisition.

That was what I was originally speaking of when a few SETI.USA members took exception to my well stated argument (team fervor)...proving once again that logic and reality do not dictate one another, and don't apply at all if a person is not at least grounded in one of the two.

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I really wanted to stay out of this, but seem to be left no choice because of my nature. I cannot believe the audacity of many of the posters here. Here we have a project that it has been said may end up folding (read many of Poppa's recent donation posts) due to lack of funds/equipment. We also have a team that is "willing" to try to help with an extremely generous offer from one of it's members. Heck even if you consider the request a requirement (keep in mind that you may sometimes not totally understand someones intent due to social/economic differences), the fact remains that we were trying to "HELP" the project. And what did we get in return?? The usual BS, belittlement and rancor that we almost always seem to get on these fora. Well, despite this treatment, we will move forward with our offer and continue to try to help the project, which by the way, will benefit all of you, even those who seem to want to do nothing but mistreat us.

"nuff said"!!

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@TimeLord04: Thanks for offering a server as well.

@Everyone else: If you have something constructive that will help the project post after this message. If all you want to do is complain about naming, I get the point now.

Move on and let those who are using this thread to organize a server donation post. If you posted more than two posts over naming the server after a team shame on you!! Eric will be reading this entire long winded thread. He will now have to sift through your long winded posts as well.

I had hoped someone would be interested in my offer to pool donations for a server. Instead, I wake up to see everyone fighting like little kids on MIRC.

I can purchase 4Gb of 667FSB ECC Registered Ram and send it to Eric. Or we can unify and purchase a server that has my donation of 4Gb of Ram in it already.

*I speak for myself. Any comments or suggestions do not necessarily reflect the views of SETI.USA*

---

Overclock with the MSI G31M3-L and Intel E8600 3.33Ghz
Intel D865GLC Socket 478 Motherboard
~How To Overclock The Eee ASUS 1005HA Netbook To 1.9Ghz~

1. @Dogbytes: "But guess who then gets to control the shots...?"
Matt and Eric or whoever "they" decide as in the end it's their project! The only thing Dan was requiring was it be named as he asked.
"otherwise it is called "with strings attached." Giving should be selfless"
Sorry I did'nt see this in the rules or the requets for donations

2. @ Misfit: "A donation is a gift that is freely given without anything expected in return.

Well, that would be a way of raising money. Have companies bid for the right to name one of the computers.

And if they want to do that fine. But let's not hide what that really is - a business transaction."

Actually I believe this was discussed and even recomended as a means to get he hardware and\\or operting funds needed. At SETIUSA we've explored this option with considerable time and effort and no positive results. It would be great if SETI@home could continue on only freely given donations but this is not working. How many times have we seen posted on these boards and others that cpu cycles donated are all a lot of participants are willing to give, and even these need to be "paid for" with credits!


3. @Knightmare: I mean, if our team got together and donated some drives for the server, does that mean that we could demand that it be named SetiUSA/Calm Chaos?

No, however if you were to supply a server then you should be able to call it whatever you wish


"Pappa

BTW as I see Derek 66's post about a Free Board, one of the first things that will disappear is the Forum's Matt recently stated that... Go Figure... Free Speach Costs Everyone Something..."

This would be another possible "team" contribution, the funding or donation of forum space for these message boards that could be named under the donating teams name as long as overall control rested with seti@home admin. Of course this will require more than a few cents but should be well with-in some members reach. This would also free up more server space and time for the staff at seti@home. Of course this is just a suggestion for a means to an end and I realize that it's biased by my USA background.


Yep, as this project which I truly do love slowly sinks in the morass and quagmire of lack of legitimate funding scources many of our more vocal participants continue to place new restrictions on possible rescources based purely on their own personal opinions of right and wrong.
As important as these personal opinions are to the continuation of this project they need to IMO be kept in perspective with the loss of participants due to equipment malfnctions. We're all seeing team members and others leaving seti for other boinc projects that are better funded.
The willingness to accept equipment that would be named by a corporation but not a team is IMO bordering on inane? I personally would much rather be running my WU's through Calm Chaos or BOINC Synergy than Nabisco foods or GMC. Coporations are not interested in donating equipment or funds with out some type of recognition and obviously from our lack of funding scources a small blurb on a web page nobody views is not enough. One of the more interesting things about our corporate sponsors is they're all USA based for some unfathomable reason.
As has been stated many times, the responsibility for funding seti@home falls squarely on the shoulders of Matt and Eric as long as they stay with-in Berekely's, the IRS's, the USA's, and California's rules. Many of the rules and bussiness practices they have to deal with are based on the United States as that's were their based out of.
To ignore or refuse to acknowledge this and or insist that seti@home use only practiices accepted by the international conventions places seti@home even further "behind the eight ball" so to say.

I think the most interesting part of this whole thread is how few members of our community have posted any opinion either way on this subject, and I think that the majority realy don't care what you call the servers or were they came from as long as the wu's keep comming!

---

SETI, ONLY SETI, ALWAYS SETI!!

@ Dr. Dan . . . do you have 'DETAIL' SPECs on Both Systems and other Relevant INFO's

that would assist Eric / Matt in their Decisions re: the Following Donation Suggestions . . .


1. HP enterprise xlr 8500 8 cpu xeon 700 mhz computer - the unit has 4 geg memory and twin 16 geg 10,000 scsi drives, and needs 220 vac to run

2. supermicro with two xeon 3.06 dp 80 geg hard drive and 2 geg of ram. this unit is a 1u rack mount. And runs on 110 vac


> [imho] RE: equipment donation - one should be allowed to "name" the Donation whatever 'their preference is . . .'

This single thread has generated so much heated debate and several offers of equipment, apparently in a positive feedback manner.
Just think what could be achieved for S@H if this sort of donation fever spread to the main message boards or the home page!

However, Eric has already mentioned (7 Feb 2007 23:44:11 UTC) that S@H have received many similar well-intentioned but unusable equipment donations in the past.

To get the maximum benefits from this donation fever, wouldn’t it make sense for the S@H project administration team to post a wish-list of the equipment they would like (kind of like a wedding gift list), so that kind-hearted individual/team donators know exactly which specifications to match.

This would have added benefits: Wouldn’t it create a much stronger sense of engagement with S@H if people could identify some “thing” they had donated (no matter how small) and realise how it is an important part of the whole project; rather than the potentially disconnected feeling of wondering what their cash donation actually got spent on?
They would also be more likely to spend additional money to maintain an item if they had donated it and therefore felt some sense of connection with it. In this respect I really liked the proposed idea of team sponsorship for particular servers: “there’s our baby – look at her go!”

Anyway, how about letting us know what’s on the S@H shopping list?

---

Questions and Answers : Wish list

Donate Hardware to SETI@home

@ Dr. Dan . . . do you have 'DETAIL' SPECs on Both Systems and other Relevant INFO's

that would assist Eric / Matt in their Decisions re: the Following Donation Suggestions . . .


1. HP enterprise xlr 8500 8 cpu xeon 700 mhz computer - the unit has 4 geg memory and twin 16 geg 10,000 scsi drives, and needs 220 vac to run

2. supermicro with two xeon 3.06 dp 80 geg hard drive and 2 geg of ram. this unit is a 1u rack mount. And runs on 110 vac


> [imho] RE: equipment donation - one should be allowed to "name" the Donation whatever 'their preference is . . .'

He is already in touch with Eric and hashing those things out with him.

---

@ Dr. Dan . . . do you have 'DETAIL' SPECs on Both Systems and other Relevant INFO's

that would assist Eric / Matt in their Decisions re: the Following Donation Suggestions . . .


1. HP enterprise xlr 8500 8 cpu xeon 700 mhz computer - the unit has 4 geg memory and twin 16 geg 10,000 scsi drives, and needs 220 vac to run

2. supermicro with two xeon 3.06 dp 80 geg hard drive and 2 geg of ram. this unit is a 1u rack mount. And runs on 110 vac


> [imho] RE: equipment donation - one should be allowed to "name" the Donation whatever 'their preference is . . .'

He is already in touch with Eric and hashing those things out with him.

Excellent SargeD . . . glad to hear (i hadn't spoken lately to Eric - so i

wasn't sure) - just thinkin' it safer to Mention this matter - just in case ;)

ps - Just Joined SETI.USA TeAm - Hope i am a Welcomed Cruncher ;)

Excellent SargeD . . . glad to hear (i hadn't spoken lately to Eric - so i

wasn't sure) - just thinkin' it safer to Mention this matter - just in case ;)

ps - Just Joined SETI.USA TeAm - Hope i am a Welcomed Cruncher ;)

Excellent - make sure you come and sign in to the Teams MB - you are more than welcome!

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