Repeatedly over the past several years on 'Whacky radio'. www.coasttocoastam.com has been an audio recording taken of 'hell' with people screaming in agony and torment. Supposedly this was due to Russian oil drillers. The new claim to this is now purported to be a hoax perpetuated by dubbers from very old horror movies.....

Just thought I'd toss this out as it has been bandied about as 'proof' of hell in earth and so forth...enjoy....commentary desired!

---

Founder of BOINC team Objectivists. Oh the humanity! Rational people crunching data!
I did NOT authorize this belly writing!

[quote]* announcers voice * Ahem.....

Ladies and gentlemen I have JUST been handed this correction.....

The audio was supposedly taken from an OIL WELL in Russia....We apologize for the misunderstanding.

Now back to your program.

Hang on! Geeting back to 9/11 we need some closure!

Was just a newsflash. Regular programming was resumed.

So what are we saying?

Let's see if we can straighten things out here.

1. 70 tons of Aluminium (note 747) pile into WTC I and II

I think that is a safe assumption.

2. 100 tons of fuel (with sulphur) ignites

Did we determine that the fuel contains sulfur?

3. Concrete re-enforcing from steel beams breaks down due to heat (30 mins)

That is the general consensus among the people who investigated.

4. Aluminium melts into large pools (possibly surroundind some support beams)

This is where we have a slight difference of opinion in the thread. Aluminum ( according to H.B. ) is very difficult to melt when in large size pieces. Aluminum POWDER ignites pretty easily, and burns very hot for a short period of time.

5. Sulphur attacks iron in beans, producing Fe-2-O-3 iron oxide

6. Iron oxide reacts with aluminimum (at heat levels) - thermite reaction

7. 2000C from thermite causes steel support beams to liquify

I don't know enough about the chemistry to say one way or the other.

8. Building collapses

Again, pretty much a given.

At the end of the day, it most likely depends on building design and we dont have any blueprints.....

Would having the blueprints really help us? lol

Most things add up as far as what happened. Some things don't. We still haven't gotten an answer as far as what happened to Building 7 lol.

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

* announcers voice * Ahem.....

Ladies and gentlemen I have JUST been handed this correction.....

The audio was supposedly taken from an OIL WELL in Russia....We apologize for the misunderstanding.

Now back to your program.

Hang on! Geeting back to 9/11 we need some closure!

So what are we saying?

1. 70 tons of Aluminium (note 747) pile into WTC I and II
2. 100 tons of fuel (with sulphur) ignites
3. Concrete re-enforcing from steel beams breaks down due to heat (30 mins)
4. Aluminium melts into large pools (possibly surroundind some support beams)
5. Sulphur attacks iron in beans, producing Fe-2-O-3 iron oxide
6. Iron oxide reacts with aluminimum (at heat levels) - thermite reaction
7. 2000C from thermite causes steel support beams to liquify
8. Building collapses

At the end of the day, it most likely depends on building design and we dont have any blueprints.....

---

Belief gets in the way of learning

* announcers voice * Ahem.....

Ladies and gentlemen I have JUST been handed this correction.....

The audio was supposedly taken from an OIL WELL in Russia....We apologize for the misunderstanding.

Now back to your program.

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

* announcers voice *

NEWS FLASH - This just in.....

The " Sounds From Hell " audio that was supposedly recorded in a mine in Russia has been EXPOSED as actual audio from an old Pornographic movie titled " The Devil In Mrs. Jones "

Now back to our regularly scheduled programming

ha ha ha!

* wipes brow *

I was HOPING that one would pass the " objectionable content " test.

That kind of thing is what I get for listening to Coast to Coast AM....lmao

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

* announcers voice *

NEWS FLASH - This just in.....

The " Sounds From Hell " audio that was supposedly recorded in a mine in Russia has been EXPOSED as actual audio from an old Pornographic movie titled " The Devil In Mrs. Jones "

Now back to our regularly scheduled programming

ha ha ha!

---

* announcers voice *

NEWS FLASH - This just in.....

The " Sounds From Hell " audio that was supposedly recorded in a mine in Russia has been EXPOSED as actual audio from an old Pornographic movie titled " The Devil In Mrs. Jones "

Now back to our regularly scheduled programming

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

Anyone know a chemist that specializes in aluminum and alloys? lol

Metallurgist might be a better find.

congrats on your 1000th post!

---

Anyone know a chemist that specializes in aluminum and alloys? lol

Metallurgist might be a better find.

Ummmmm....yeah....what you said.

* sits back and shuts up * Figure I may as well quit while I am behind. lol

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

Anyone know a chemist that specializes in aluminum and alloys? lol

Metallurgist might be a better find.

Anyone know a chemist that specializes in aluminum and alloys? lol

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

Take into account that at the start of the event we had a several dozen feet of aircraft compressing into a relatively small volume along the long axis of the airframe. That would release a great deal of energy as all of the kinetic energy of the moving aircraft is converted into heat. And the event took place over a much longer interval than a bullet impact.
Maybe Sleestak can let us know if enough heat would be released in such an event?

LOL. The number of variables are beyond me without it being my full time job. The aluminum does not need to be a powder.

---

TEAM
LL

How fast was the aircraft moving when it hit the building? I believe that the impact released enough energy to vaporize the skin of the aircraft...instant finely divided aluminum powder.

Alledgedly around 450mph. Not hardly enough to vaporize any metal be it thick or thin. A 150 gr.bullet of lead and copper fired from a .30-06 rifle travels at about 3000 fps or about 2000 mph. When it hits a quarter inch steel plate it fragments but it doesn't vaporize. With a .45 Colt auto firing a bullet at a speed of maybe about 900 fps or about 600 mph against the same steel plate the bullet only flattens.

[edit]My husband was giving me this gun/bullet info.[/edit]

Contrary to popular belief, aluminum is not brittle but is really quite flexible.

Take into account that at the start of the event we had a several dozen feet of aircraft compressing into a relatively small volume along the long axis of the airframe. That would release a great deal of energy as all of the kinetic energy of the moving aircraft is converted into heat. And the event took place over a much longer interval than a bullet impact.
Maybe Sleestak can let us know if enough heat would be released in such an event?

The worst part is that there is a healthy amount of magnesium in that metal....

thermite and the igniter (e.g. magnesium ribbon) ...
Because of the high temperature necessary to ignite the thermite, a magnesium strip is needed. Use a blowtorch, butane torch, or similar to light the magnesium strip, which will in turn light the thermite in a ladder-up reaction. Place the strip alongside the thermite. A potentially safer method if materials are available is to place ground potassium permanganate in a small crater in the thermite and pour glycerine on top.

It is also possible to use certain types of sparkler fireworks and probably magnesium road flares. The magnesium fire starters used for camping will ignite thermite. A small (1cm3) crater should be dug in the mixture and filled with the filings scraped away from the magnesium block.

Think jet fuel can get as hot as a butane torch?... It's a reasonable assumption.

---

TEAM
LL

7050 aluminum MSDS

Aluminum Balance
Chromium 0.04 max
Copper 2 - 2.6
Iron 0.15 max
Magnesium 1.9 - 2.6
Manganese 0.1 max
Remainder Each 0.05 max
Remainder Total 0.15 max
Silicon 0.12 max
Titanium 0.06 max
Zinc 5.7 - 6.7
Zirconium 0.08 - 0.15

Melting Point (Deg F) 920

Pure Aluminum MP is 1220 F or 660C and the 7050 alloys are around 920 F or 493 C. So, it's actually 167 C lower. Impurities often lower the melting points where alloys are effectively impure metals. This is not a rule and depends on the bonding.

---

TEAM
LL

It appears and is more likely that the aluminum got a jump start. i.e. it melted and established it's burn before it even got to the iron.

Just playing devil's advocate here... But what melted the aluminum?

1000-1200 F it will melt.

Very good. But how much Jet-A fuel burning in an oxygen poor environment at a temp. of 600F would it take to melt even a pound of aircraft aluminum or for that matter any kind of aluminum? Somehow I get this strange feeling that no amount of fuel burning at that temp. would even melt a 1oz. chunk. But then again I may be wrong. On second thought... Nah! I don't think so.

However the Aluminium used in aircraft constuction will definately an alloy of some kind, possibly a titanium/magnesium composite?? For improved strength and durability

However likely different physical properties like melting point.

Any more info?


Aerospace Aluminium Alloy 7050-T7541??

Why THanks! Ya got there before I did.

(pause for Humour break)

How to build a 747 - Part 1.

---

However the Aluminium used in aircraft constuction will definately an alloy of some kind, possibly a titanium/magnesium composite?? For improved strength and durability

However likely different physical properties like melting point.

Any more info?


Aerospace Aluminium Alloy 7050-T7541??

---

Belief gets in the way of learning

The melting point of aluminum is 660 C/1220F Aluminum MSDS, which is very reasonable for an exploding jet since it put's it at the middle of the kerosene fire range.

---

TEAM
LL