i do not care how many green (or whatever color) stars anyone gets.
please enjoy them very much.

i would like to have a black smear instead of a green star.

since i only DONATE cpu time. and cpu time seems to be of no value at all anymore.

so a black smear for people who have the nerve to only DONATE cpu time seems appropriate.

i do not care how many green (or whatever color) stars anyone gets.
please enjoy them very much.

i would like to have a black smear instead of a green star.

since i only DONATE cpu time. and cpu time seems to be of no value at all anymore.

so a black smear for people who have the nerve to only DONATE cpu time seems appropriate.

I don't know what you have been reading, but the vast majority of people in this thread say that crunching is just as important as cash. In fact, even the folks who don't want the stars only say that it might cause problems (it's too soon to tell). But they may be wrong; maybe the green stars will cause no problems--they won't with me.

A slightly edited version of my post in the sticky donations thread...

If I have correctly picked out azwoody's argument, he feels that some would take offense that non-CPU donations are recognized in a more visible manner than CPU donations. One might get the impression at first glance that the SETI project values monetary donations above CPU donations, since the monetary recognition is "flashier" (is that a word?).

Most organizations that solicit donations have levels of recognition. SETI@home even ranks its corporate sponsors in levels. I really doubt that eBay can claim to have invented the idea of combining stars and rankings.

My initial ideas for donation icons would be:

• Radio Dish icons for credits
  
• Coin icons for money
  
• Gear icons for equipment (dedicated PCs as well as in-kind donations)
  
• Hourglass icons for time since joining the project
  
• Cartoon Text Balloon icons for forum and Q&A posts
  
• Stars for a politically correct grand total formula
  

These totals can be updated in the participant account when they change, so that the database isn't pummeled with calculating things every time a thread is viewed. The "Gear" icons may have to rely on the honor system... a PC's designation as "dedicated" may rely entirely on participants.

Each icon would come in a range of colors (bronze, silver, gold, platinum, diamond seems to be a popular sequence).

Just some thoughts.

Well I see that the party lines are forming and all I can say is typical....



Now I do my donating by paying a lot for electricity and my 3 new computers, plus I subscribe to the planetary society.
If there is to be an icon system, it must not be limited to those who give cash.
I feel I am one of the fortunate ones, that if I choose, I could donate $100, $500 or a $1000, but I have already stated my avenue of donations.

Because without the donation of electricity and computers you have no need to donate cash..

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And the beat goes on
Sonny and Cher

BOINC Wiki

Sometimes I even wonder why I bother trying to introduce reason.

People are saying donators will use stars to be mean to people.

THIS HASN'T HAPPENED YET. YOU ARE ACCUSING US OF DOING SOMETHING THAT WE HAVE NOT DONE AND MAY NEVER DO.

Then, you tell us that we shouldn't have recognition for giving away some of our hard-earned money. Apparently you live in a magical fairy-world where everyone has to "feel good", so there can't be any distintions between people who have donated money and those who haven't.

If you don't like my star, too bad.

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crunching is crunching...and fundraising is fundraising...seems to me that both must have a place here to keep this project going...as for the large contributions of computer time and the cost of electricity...that form of donation is readily apparent when one looks at the number of cobblestones crunched...seti has been counting that form of contribution for a long time...now to generate another form of contribution...they have instituted the "green stars"...to recognize those who contribute monetary donations...i do not see how this notation degrades the contributions of those who crunch for seti...we all know that the use of our computers is the thing that makes this project, and others like it possible...
but there are other needs which need addressing too...things only cash donations can buy...and if putting a green star besides someone's name gets the cash flowing...then i think it's something that should be done...

i'm not here to argue about what cause that people should contribute to...that's a personal thing...it should be up to the individual to make that decision...not up to someone elses estimation of what cause needs the money most...i don't think anyone who contributes monetarily to seti is better or greater in any way, than those who crunch without making an monetary donation...both kinds of contributions help seti...and isn't that what we're trying to do here?...
____________

i originally posted this in the "donations to the seti project" thread...i guess i should have posted it here instead...so i did.

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PROUD TO BE TFFE!

Regarding the star: We figured we didn't want a monetary symbol, but some kind of acknowledgement that was positive when people donated to our project. We also didn't want to rank people based on amount - some people can afford $100, some people can only afford $10 - they both deserve a star for helping out. Maybe the ranking will happen on a separate donor page that lists usernames in groups separated by orders of magnitude (0-9 dollars, 10-99 dollars, 100-999 dollars, etc.). That's still up for debate.

I personally quite like the idea of other acknowledgement, because (a) long time users, (b) big-time crunchers, (c) those with classic SETI@home credit, etc. all deserve a positive nod. It should be easy to implement. Discussions will happen about that when I'm back in the lab (working at home today).

As for the argument about "why donate money to SETI when we are already donating computer cycles?" Here's an analogy: There's a new Indian restaurant near my house I really like. I'm a regular customer, so they are already getting a small but consistent profit from my business. However, I am concerned their business isn't so great as they are in a tough location. So once in a while I order a beverage which I may not exactly want, but I know has a high profit margin. Not only do I get the beverage, but I increased their chance of sticking around so I could enjoy their food in the future. Granted, it's a very very small increase in chance, but it's the best that I, one customer, could do. But if I didn't buy the beverage, I'm still a loyal customer.

Speaking personally, I could not care less if someone has three green. two red and one gold star next to their name. If you want to measure contribution to SETI, total WU and RAC should tell you all you need to know, and they are already displayed.

Again speaking personally, and reading Matt's message, I wouldn't want a mark next to my name saying "Top 100 producer" or "Super guy - has loads of CPUs" or any other variant of the above. The top 100 producers are populated by harmless loonies (like me) who spend disproportionate amounts of money, time and electricity$ on SETI, and the majority who use someone else's (read a company/enterprise/conglomerate) CPU's and hijack them when not in use. These guys do not commit the same purchase or running cost dollars as the likes of me. Comparisons, therefore, are groundless.

If the above sounds like "I'm brilliant and I should be rewarded for my personal efforts" then I'm sorry but you have me wrong. I really don't care. I volunteer what I do - end story. As I have said on these boards before, I am interested in ETI. Without this project, having no deep-space telescope and recording equipment, or the knowledge to decode and analyse what such might produce, then I am lost. So I give what I give gladly - SETI gains a cruncher, I gain access to one of my interests.

Please don't let a few poxy graphics next to an avatar become YET ANOTHER reason for division...... we have enough of those.

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Response:
"Quit whining. I see from your profile that you haven't contributed. If you make a contribution maybe they'd be able to fix your problem. Since you haven't contributed you have no right to complain."

Fear not Tekwyzrd I'll not be holding back my help from people who genuinely want it regardless of credit or cash.

Response:
"Quit whining. I see from your profile that you haven't contributed. If you make a contribution maybe they'd be able to fix your problem. Since you haven't contributed you have no right to complain."

Fear not Tekwyzrd I'll not be holding back my help from people who genuinely want it regardless of credit or cash.

Good for you. How about withholding help from someone whose political views you don't like? Or who has passed you in: RAC, total credit, etc? Or how about someone who you just don't like, or your friend doesn't like?

It is possible that the star may make a difference to some, but it's a little premature to think it will. The bottom line is, based on the sentiments being expressed here, those little stars or stats will not affect how people will be treated, so until it becomes a problem . . . there's no problem.

Couple of points:

Remember when Matt the sysop endorses this whole green star thing, it's not exacly an unbiased opinion. He and the other sysops are one of the places that project funds are spent. (they are paid). I doubt that Dr Dave is paid minimum wage. I'd also bet that his take home pay is more than that of all the syspos combined.

Also note that seti, seti under boinc and boinc itself are receiving funds from the US Government's National Science Foundation.

Here's a link to one of the grants to UCB for the work we see here - http://www.nsf.gov/awardsearch/showAward.do?AwardNumber=0221529

For this one alone, about $1m (us) - was donated by US taxpayers. Most who have never even heard of seti@home! Seems that all crunchers in the US should be given a green star, as any taxpayer in the US has provided monitary support to boinc and seti/boinc!

It's only one of the grants. Boinc and seti/boinc (both run by Dr Dave) don't seem to want to mention the fact that they have substantial grants from the US government.

"we're poor so help us" seems to be the UCB way. Is there another boinc project requesting (and awarding) money as a donation above and beyond crunching resources?


You'll notice on the Einstein website, there's a line at the very bottom of their pages which says

"This material is based upon work supported by the National Science Foundation (NSF) under Grant NSF-0200852 and by the Max Planck Gesellschaft (MPG)."

From the latest LHC newsletter:

"Thanks once again to all our supporting crunchers and to all the experienced people out there who answer many (if not all) of the questions posed by newcomers."


They seem to be truthfull!

The green star is a joke.

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Ned

Unfortunately there are those that are "frustrated" at the moment for whatever reason.

Sadly, it appears that you can't recognize anyone for anything without creating some division between the "recognized" and "unrecognized."

Right now I fall into a lot of categories, I have donoted, as near as I can calculate I have around 419,xxx hours of donated computer time (Seti Classic and Seti BOINC)... I have posed questions/things that might help troubleshoot the problem (along with SunGrid). I have reached Third Place in Negative ratings (Thank you MattDavis)... Yes I have opinions about Seti Management and am not afraid to express them (have expressed them).

For the topic of MattDavis (he is spewing negative Karma) I would presume that for someone working to get his PHD, he would be more tolerant and tend to chosse his wording more carefully. To me, out of the last several hundered(s) posts (other than the Congratulations to Paul Buck for being the User of the Day in Einstien) has nothing postive to add... He is very good at inciting discontent! Hopefully after he gets his degree and a reality check, his attitude will improve... A couple of decades from now he may even be Human...

R/

Al

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Please consider a Donation to the Seti Project.

@ Azwoody


Boinc Home Page
BOINC is supported by the National Science Foundation through award SCI/0221529. Any opinions, findings, and conclusions or recommendations expressed in this material are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the views of the National Science Foundation.

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And the beat goes on
Sonny and Cher

BOINC Wiki

I'm intolerant of crybaby-ism.

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I'm intolerant of crybaby-ism.

My Star is bigger than yours! My self serving Avatar!

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@ Azwoody


Boinc Home Page
BOINC is supported by the National Science Foundation through award SCI/0221529. Any opinions, findings, and conclusions or recommendations expressed in this material are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the views of the National Science Foundation.

Ok.. I missed that one reference.. I signed up for this project well over a year ago. Also, you'll note that its on the BOINC site and not the SETI/BOINC site!

So BOINC has a link to the fact that they have US Gov funding, but where's this info on the seti/boinc site? (along with the NSF funding for seti/Boinc? - It's a different grant)

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Ssshh, Captain Avatar, you can't say "green star" here. It's unfair to those without them, and they feel stigmatized!

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I'm intolerant of crybaby-ism.

And I'm intollerant of dolts that don't have a clue! (but they have a green star!)

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Just wanted to see my star.

Hey, where is it?

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Ssshh, Captain Avatar, you can't say "green star" here. It's unfair to those without them, and they feel stigmatized!

Does anyone NOW doubt that the existance of a green star will inspire some to use it as a reason to flame others?

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I'm intolerant of crybaby-ism.

And I'm intollerant of dolts that don't have a clue! (but they have a green star!)

You can't be speaking of me, since I have 13 green stars.

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Ssshh, Captain Avatar, you can't say "green star" here. It's unfair to those without them, and they feel stigmatized!

Does anyone NOW doubt that the existance of a green star will inspire some to use it as a reason to flame others?

Brilliant detective work, Sherlock. The green star obviously transformed me from a polite and constructive Seti-citizen into the disrespectful person I am now.

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