My FEAR and CONCERN:

Bobby and Charp Existing and People As Bobby and Charp Existing.

There are Many Bobby[s] and Charp[s].

The Existence of These People, CONCERN Me. And I FEAR Their Existence is Harmful to All Peoples Not Them.

The Above is VALID. And [Source] is Me.

Yap.

Then stop procreating. ;)

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Capitalize on this good fortune, one word can bring you round ... changes.

My FEAR and CONCERN:

Bobby and Charp Existing and People As Bobby and Charp Existing.

There are Many Bobby[s] and Charp[s].

The Existence of These People, CONCERN Me. And I FEAR Their Existence is Harmful to All Peoples Not Them.

The Above is VALID. And [Source] is Me.

Yap.

Quite, though, to the best of my knowledge, you are not "the american people". You may be representative of the group, though I do not believe we have data to support such a proposition. Please remain on topic.

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

One person's valid is another person's irrational. wink wink ;^)

val·id

[ˈvaləd]

ADJECTIVE

1.(of an argument or point) having a sound basis in logic or fact; reasonable or cogent: "a valid criticism"

synonyms: well founded · sound · reasonable · rational · logical

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...

I Always Stop when Ahead, but...I can't help myself, on This Memorial Day.

...of The American People

[Source] a definition of of

I Am on Topic.

I don't need to [source] Meaning of 'Bobby' or 'Charp'.

Self-Evident, 'is' EVIDENCE.

The {Source] is Evidently Obvious to Any Fact Checker or Data Sourcer. And Reader Here.

CONCERN and FEAR is Now A TRUTH for All To Read.

TeeeHeeeHeee

Yap

Shall I PROVE I came to Existence-some call life-In a Hospital in Arlington, Virginia. A Very Very Very Short Distance from Arlington National Cemetary and, also, A Very Very Very Short Distance from The [SOURCE] of ALL TROUBLES of The American People-Washington, DC.

I Feel OSMOSIS from, heck, before and after Conception 'is' A Valid Concern of Mine.

---

May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

I Always Stop when Ahead, but...I can't help myself, on This Memorial Day.

...of The American People

[Source] a definition of of

I Am on Topic.

I don't need to [source] Meaning of 'Bobby' or 'Charp'.

Self-Evident, 'is' EVIDENCE.

The {Source] is Evidently Obvious to Any Fact Checker or Data Sourcer. And Reader Here.

CONCERN and FEAR is Now A TRUTH for All To Read.

TeeeHeeeHeee

Yap

Shall I PROVE I came to Existence-some call life-In a Hospital in Arlington, Virginia. A Very Very Very Short Distance from Arlington National Cemetary and, also, A Very Very Very Short Distance from The [SOURCE] of ALL TROUBLES of The American People-Washington, DC.

I Feel OSMOSIS from, heck, before and after Conception 'is' A Valid Concern of Mine.

The thread title is not "the valid fears and concerns of an american person" or "of individuals that are american", and while you may be "of the american people" this does not mean your fears and concerns are shared with them all (or even a significant proportion). Please remain on topic.

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I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Fears of Americans:

• Dismantling the Affordable Care Act
  
• Restricting women's reproductive rights
  
• Reversing marriage equality and LGBT rights
  
• Gutting Social Security
  
• Gutting Medicare
  
• Packing SCOTUS with far right ideologues
  
• Opposing an increase in the minimum wage
  
• Obstructing comprehensive immigration reform
  
• Denying the existence of climate change
  
• Refusing to handle international affairs diplomatically
  
• Inability to compromise
  
• Gender gap in pay
  
• Environmental protection
  
• Reforming criminal justice
  
• Lack of world class education
  
• Expanding voting rights
  
• Closing tax loopholes
  

The list comes from Debbie Wasserman Schultz, so I'm sure it was collected from opinion polls and thus the valid fears of those Americans sampled.

---

Fears of Americans:

• Dismantling the Affordable Care Act
  
• Restricting women's reproductive rights
  
• Reversing marriage equality and LGBT rights
  
• Gutting Social Security
  
• Gutting Medicare
  
• Packing SCOTUS with far right ideologues
  
• Opposing an increase in the minimum wage
  
• Obstructing comprehensive immigration reform
  
• Denying the existence of climate change
  
• Refusing to handle international affairs diplomatically
  
• Inability to compromise
  
• Gender gap in pay
  
• Environmental protection
  
• Reforming criminal justice
  
• Lack of world class education
  
• Expanding voting rights
  
• Closing tax loopholes
  

The list comes from Debbie Wasserman Schultz, so I'm sure it was collected from opinion polls and thus the valid fears of those Americans sampled.

While you may be sure of the validity of these fears, there doesn't appear to be much data here.

---

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Fears of Americans:

• Dismantling the Affordable Care Act
  
• Restricting women's reproductive rights
  
• Reversing marriage equality and LGBT rights
  
• Gutting Social Security
  
• Gutting Medicare
  
• Packing SCOTUS with far right ideologues
  
• Opposing an increase in the minimum wage
  
• Obstructing comprehensive immigration reform
  
• Denying the existence of climate change
  
• Refusing to handle international affairs diplomatically
  
• Inability to compromise
  
• Gender gap in pay
  
• Environmental protection
  
• Reforming criminal justice
  
• Lack of world class education
  
• Expanding voting rights
  
• Closing tax loopholes
  

The list comes from Debbie Wasserman Schultz, so I'm sure it was collected from opinion polls and thus the valid fears of those Americans sampled.

While you may be sure of the validity of these fears, there doesn't appear to be much data here.

Why do you need data?
Opinion polls like this only show what the public are thinking in generally about politics and how it is handled.
There are lots of issues not handled by the government that the public think they should do.
The Valid Fears and Concerns of The American People are very much like The Valid Fears and Concerns of The People In The Western World.

Fears of Americans:

• Dismantling the Affordable Care Act
  
• Restricting women's reproductive rights
  
• Reversing marriage equality and LGBT rights
  
• Gutting Social Security
  
• Gutting Medicare
  
• Packing SCOTUS with far right ideologues
  
• Opposing an increase in the minimum wage
  
• Obstructing comprehensive immigration reform
  
• Denying the existence of climate change
  
• Refusing to handle international affairs diplomatically
  
• Inability to compromise
  
• Gender gap in pay
  
• Environmental protection
  
• Reforming criminal justice
  
• Lack of world class education
  
• Expanding voting rights
  
• Closing tax loopholes
  

The list comes from Debbie Wasserman Schultz, so I'm sure it was collected from opinion polls and thus the valid fears of those Americans sampled.

While you may be sure of the validity of these fears, there doesn't appear to be much data here.

If you want fears ranked with error bars, you might see what Pew has or commission a poll yourself.

I hate to tell you this bobby, fear is an emotion and like an opinion, all are valid to the person holding them. If you were trying to get a sense of what fears a majority of American's share, then I understand, but that isn't quite how you worded the OP, nor if you wanted to see how American's rank their perception of each fear they hold.

#1 would be the fear of death, but as that is near universal, I don't think it need be mentioned.

You have mentioned sharks, that same could be said of terrorist attack on a plane flight, or any kind of aircraft accident. If we ranked that correctly every car would have an ignition interlock to prevent drunk driving, considering the airport security we do.

We humans are terrible at ranking risk. Our failure to teach risk ranking in school is a fear I hold.

---

I hate to tell you this bobby, fear is an emotion and like an opinion, all are valid to the person holding them. If you were trying to get a sense of what fears a majority of American's share, then I understand, but that isn't quite how you worded the OP, nor if you wanted to see how American's rank their perception of each fear they hold.

#1 would be the fear of death, but as that is near universal, I don't think it need be mentioned.

You have mentioned sharks, that same could be said of terrorist attack on a plane flight, or any kind of aircraft accident. If we ranked that correctly every car would have an ignition interlock to prevent drunk driving, considering the airport security we do.

We humans are terrible at ranking risk. Our failure to teach risk ranking in school is a fear I hold.

Would you be surprised by a finding that between 1972 and 2010 fear of violent crime was "strongly related to annual change in TV violence" rather than rates of violent crime? (source). Would you suggest that a fear of violent crime based on the prevalence of violence on TV is just as valid as one based on the prevalence of violent crime? After all, in both cases, the people having such fears could make the claim that the fear was "valid to me". If not, why not?

The OP also noted the provision of solutions, and while the possibly ubiquitous fear of death may rank fairly highly amongst fears held by the american people, unless there's been a discovery I'm unaware of, it's an insolvable one and thus not interesting in context of this thread.

Going back to the fear of violent crime example, would proposed solutions for fears based on the prevalence of TV violence be the same as proposed solutions for fears based on the prevalence of violent crime? If not, why not?

---

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Would you be surprised by a finding that between 1972 and 2010 fear of violent crime was "strongly related to annual change in TV violence" rather than rates of violent crime? (source). Would you suggest that a fear of violent crime based on the prevalence of violence on TV is just as valid as one based on the prevalence of violent crime? After all, in both cases, the people having such fears could make the claim that the fear was "valid to me". If not, why not?

The OP also noted the provision of solutions, and while the possibly ubiquitous fear of death may rank fairly highly amongst fears held by the american people, unless there's been a discovery I'm unaware of, it's an insolvable one and thus not interesting in context of this thread.

Going back to the fear of violent crime example, would proposed solutions for fears based on the prevalence of TV violence be the same as proposed solutions for fears based on the prevalence of violent crime? If not, why not?

Basic engineering. To solve a problem you have to know what the problem is.

We could take the ACA as an example. The problem is poor people do not have access to medical treatment. However that is not the problem the ACA addressed. Someone who did not correctly study the problem made an assumption that to get medical treatment is the same as medical insurance or the problem of hospitals not getting paid for treating patients. They are not the same problem. So we now have a solution to a problem, that wasn't the problem we needed solved.

I'm sure a solution to a problem that does not exist will not solve a problem that does exist except by pure happenstance. So solving the "problems" that Rupert Murdoch's opinion posits will not solve any problem that exists in America. But it can get you elected as repeating a lie often enough makes it the truth.

I recently saw a news spot, which I can't find ATM, that said today there are more people quitting jobs than there were a couple years ago, and that was because people were more confident they could quickly find new employment. This would apply to the fear of losing job that has been tossed out, indicating that fear may not be being stated correctly. Survey bias?

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Seems we're a little stuck, perhaps it's time to ask whether you think the two statements:

1) The fears and concerns of American people.

and,

2) The valid fears and concerns of the American people.

are equivalent and interchangeable

If they are interchangeable, are they also interchangeable with the statement:

Fears of people.

?

If not:

a) does the word "valid" change the meaning?

b) does the definitive article between "of" and "American" change the meaning?

---

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

1) The fears and concerns of American people.
and,
2) The valid fears and concerns of the American people.
are equivalent and interchangeable

As MK correctly understood:

Validity is a matter of personal experiences, observation, opinion, and 'numbers'.

Anyone, on either side of this discussion. Can pick-and-choose 'numbers'.

If certain 'numbers' do not correlate with what people are stating are happening to them, their spouses, children, parents, friends, acquaintances, neighbors, co-workers, etc.

One can safely dismiss those 'numbers'.

Does this mean you that you believe the word "valid" does not alter the meaning of the two statements?

Is that true for use of the word valid in all circumstances? If not, what differentiates the set of circumstances in which "valid" alters meaning, from the set where it does not?

BTW, I do not believe you are correct about the safety of dismissing numbers based on the criteria you provided.

---

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

All fears are Valid.

It's the reasons behind the fears that are the real question,

All fears are Valid.

It's the reasons behind the fears that are the real question,

If the probability of bad thing >0 then fear is valid.

Ranking fear, or the amount of fear between different bad thing events is where humans fall flat. Say fear of spider bite vs. fear of drunk driver hitting you.

---

All fears are Valid.

It's the reasons behind the fears that are the real question,

If the probability of bad thing >0 then fear is valid.

Ranking fear, or the amount of fear between different bad thing events is where humans fall flat. Say fear of spider bite vs. fear of drunk driver hitting you.

If we accept "all fears are valid", then "valid fears" is tautological (and "invalid fears" oxymoronic). Is there a set of bad things where the probability is 0? If so, they are not interesting for the purposes of this thread as there's no need for solutions to them, they'll never happen. So applying the probability rule we are still left with a set in which all items are "valid", and thus "valid" is no longer a useful qualifier.

Valid certainly has meaning in other contexts, and in some, it's certainly not opinion based. A valid drivers license is identifiable, there is such a thing as an invalid drivers license, and it's not the opinion of the license holder that influences its validity, or lack thereof. Should the SETI@Home project ever produce positive results from its search, the validity of those results will not be a matter of an individual's opinion. Nothing here is to say that individuals are not entitled to their opinions, just that this entitlement does not make the content of any particular opinion valid (and by "opinion", I mean the term as it is commonly used, "a view not necessarily based on fact", rather than, say, an "informed opinion").

At least one poster to this thread appears to have taken "fears and concerns of the American people" to mean "fears and concerns of American people". I also asked whether the definitive article changes the meaning of the phrase. So far nobody has addressed this question. In my view it seems that "fears and concerns of American people" is the collection of all fears and concerns that any American may have, whereas "fears and concerns of the American people" is some subset of the collection, and that some measure is used to determine whether any particular fear or concern is to be included in the subset.

Of course, you may believe I am as just as wrong about the definitive article as I am about "valid". Further, as the person making an assertion it's on me to provide the basis for the assertion, (perhaps over-)simplistically put, my basis is "words have meanings".

If we accept that, as the originator of the phrase in this thread's title has stated on a number of occasions, political solutions are needed for the items described by the phrase, then surely the phrase does not refer to all the fears of all the individuals that happen to be American, or does it?

---

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Nobody Thinks As You and No One Wants to Think As You.

No One Wants A Conversation With You. Your Gibberish is On A Par with Mine.

In A 'Valid' Reality, two 'Gibberish' Speakers can Have A Conversation and All Words of Each are 'Accepted' As 'Valid'. Since Both have 'Concern' for each other and Fear Animosity which can Destroy an Otherwise Useless 'Relationship'.

Why Anyone wants to Participate in Verbal Gymnastics with You ia a Complete Mystery to me.

I'm Lying 'bout dat. Brainiacs LOVE to Banter.

It's A Sickness. With No Cure. Fortunately, Most 'American' 'People' are Immune to This Particular Disease.

Yaparooo.

---

May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

All fears are Valid.

It's the reasons behind the fears that are the real question,

If the probability of bad thing >0 then fear is valid.

Ranking fear, or the amount of fear between different bad thing events is where humans fall flat. Say fear of spider bite vs. fear of drunk driver hitting you.

If we accept "all fears are valid", then "valid fears" is tautological (and "invalid fears" oxymoronic). Is there a set of bad things where the probability is 0? If so, they are not interesting for the purposes of this thread as there's no need for solutions to them, they'll never happen. So applying the probability rule we are still left with a set in which all items are "valid", and thus "valid" is no longer a useful qualifier.

Valid certainly has meaning in other contexts, and in some, it's certainly not opinion based. A valid drivers license is identifiable, there is such a thing as an invalid drivers license, and it's not the opinion of the license holder that influences its validity, or lack thereof. Should the SETI@Home project ever produce positive results from its search, the validity of those results will not be a matter of an individual's opinion. Nothing here is to say that individuals are not entitled to their opinions, just that this entitlement does not make the content of any particular opinion valid (and by "opinion", I mean the term as it is commonly used, "a view not necessarily based on fact", rather than, say, an "informed opinion").

At least one poster to this thread appears to have taken "fears and concerns of the American people" to mean "fears and concerns of American people". I also asked whether the definitive article changes the meaning of the phrase. So far nobody has addressed this question. In my view it seems that "fears and concerns of American people" is the collection of all fears and concerns that any American may have, whereas "fears and concerns of the American people" is some subset of the collection, and that some measure is used to determine whether any particular fear or concern is to be included in the subset.

Of course, you may believe I am as just as wrong about the definitive article as I am about "valid". Further, as the person making an assertion it's on me to provide the basis for the assertion, (perhaps over-)simplistically put, my basis is "words have meanings".

If we accept that, as the originator of the phrase in this thread's title has stated on a number of occasions, political solutions are needed for the items described by the phrase, then surely the phrase does not refer to all the fears of all the individuals that happen to be American, or does it?

I'm going to pound upon you again, because of the imprecision of the language.

Yes the definitive article changes the meaning of the phrase, but that does not help define the meaning. As speaker you need to be sure you communicate what you mean. I think it is obvious you mean a fear held collectively by some subset of Americans. However the language does not indicate if that subset you refer to is any 2 or more Americans or all Americans. Thus there is no answer to your question as your question can be interpreted to mean anything the person responding wants.

If you mean a fear held in common by all Americans to be valid, then I posit that is the empty set. Even an ubiquitous fear such as death, there will be a few Americans who do not fear death, hence there is no fear that is common to all Americans.

If you mean a fear held by at least two Americans, then I posit that all fears are valid as with the number of Americans, I believe an exhaustive search would find a second person who held any given fear.

Therefor it is upon you to further define what your definitive article means. Does it mean a majority? Does it mean a statistically significant number, which I would take as above the error bar of a survey? Do you have some set level in mind such as 10%?

So as it seems you wish to be pedantic then it is upon you to correctly define what subset you wish to discuss.

Again I point you at the Pew Research Center to see what surveys they have done upon the fears of Americans and what percent of Americans hold a particular fear.

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Thanks all for participating in this thread. It appears I was operating under a misapprehension that "the valid fears and concerns of the American people" meant something other than "the fears and concerns of American people".

---

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

Thanks all for participating in this thread. It appears I was operating under a misapprehension that "the valid fears and concerns of the American people" meant something other than "the fears and concerns of American people".

You have run into the issue of language being fuzzy. Mathematics is precise. If you intended for people to "use common sense" common sense is not common. If you were looking for the mythical standard America, she doesn't exist.

Perhaps what you wanted is what items concern 25% of more of Americans. Studies of such are done by firms like PEW so that candidates know what topics to rail about and where geographically it will play best. Obviously what they are will change with the demographics of any population, age, sex, party affiliation, ethnicity, etc. Again much money is spent researching this.

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