Windows 10 - Yea or Nay?

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Profile Siran d'Vel'nahr
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Message 1926737 - Posted: 26 Mar 2018, 14:31:35 UTC - in response to Message 1926604.  

So, please, don't call me a fanboy
I didn't. I called you a fanboi, with a link to the site explaining what that was, just in case you mistakenly thought I couldn't spell fanboy.
A fanboi is someone who is unusually attracted or devoted to a particular technology or tech company.

You went from flat out against to this is better than sex in back to back posts in this thread. No warning in between that you were neighing in the other direction, no blog that you were going to go for it. I can't wait for you to find a Linux distribution that does what you want from it, as that'll make interesting reading.

Fanboy|fanboi, potato|potahto, tomato|tomahto... It's all the same to me. I did read the definition of fanboi. I don't care what it says, it's all fanboy to me.

These are just a few of Jerry's videos I watched. He worked for Microsoft for 15 years. Jerry can be a little out there sometimes, but believe me the guy knows. He just does things for his audience.:
1st video Pay close attention to what he says about 8:56 into the video.
2nd video Pay attention to what he talks about starting about 5:38 into the video.
3rd video Just another of Jerry's videos I watched.

This is Carey Holzman. He does live YouTube builds of PCs for his customers. He's had his business for over 25 years. Carey has many, many more videos and it would take way too long for me to find exact videos. These are just about Windows 10.:
1st video Unless a customer explicitly asks for Windows 7, Carey installs Windows 10 on all current computers.
2nd video Windows 10 Creators Update.

This in no way makes me a Microsoft fanboy or fanboi. Watching these 2 YouTuber's video have change my attitude about the OPERATING SYSTEM Windows 10. I still do not like Micro$oft's tactics or what they do WITH the OS by adding the junk files ( PUPs ) and all the spying.

Siran
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Windows 10 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker

Microsoft wants us to "Imagine life without walls"...
I say, "If there are no walls, who needs Windows?"
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Profile Cliff Harding
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Message 1927961 - Posted: 4 Apr 2018, 14:26:09 UTC

I had a total meltdown on my 7700K on Monday morning and the Win10 Pro install stick would not work, it kept aborting with a missing or corrupted file msg. I have an old Win 10 Pro system builder disk that was never used and even it didn't work. After several frustrating hours I was able to get an old Win 7 to install by disconnecting all drives SSD (2) and the HDD, leaving just the system drive and the Blu-ray drive connected. Everything went well until I after the SP 1 update. I kept getting this popup stating that the OS was outdated and would not work on your machine. After I reconnected the drives, and had a more or less stable system and activating Win 7, the Win 10 install stick still aborted. I eventually got the system builder Win 10 disk to work without supplying a key, late Monday night. I finally got the system back up to a more or less stable yesterday morning, with the event viewer is showing a lot of major errors that I don't understand and don't know how to fix. But right now I'm standing on this side of the grass, vertical, and sucking air; and the machine is up and running and crunching. God, or whoever it is who is the main spokesperson up there, I would give my left one to have Win 7 back.


I don't buy computers, I build them!!
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Profile Siran d'Vel'nahr
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Message 1927977 - Posted: 4 Apr 2018, 17:04:33 UTC - in response to Message 1927961.  

Hi Cliff,

I watched a couple YouTube videos about installing Win7 on 6th, 7th and 8th generation Intel powered PCs. I have linked them below.

Video 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VTC4k6SLWY

Video 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxvNUXnN9hY

Cary Holzman has had a business building and maintaining computers for 27 years. I mentioned earlier in this thread 25 years, but I have watched recent videos where he states 27 years. This guy knows his stuff. I built a Z370 8th gen PC and did a BIOS update for the first time since I started building computers. I followed what Carey does and it was no sweat.

I'm sure that the above videos will help you get Win7 installed and stable on the current generation you have.

Good luck with this. :)

Siran
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Windows 10 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker

Microsoft wants us to "Imagine life without walls"...
I say, "If there are no walls, who needs Windows?"
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Profile JaundicedEye
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Message 1928095 - Posted: 5 Apr 2018, 13:16:45 UTC

Isn't it wonderful we don't have to spend all our time fixing and maintaining our systems now that Win10 has saved us?

As the old Greyhound commercial used to say, "Leave the driving to us"..............

Thanks for the links Siran, I'm sure they will be very helpful to those among us unwilling to take on the 'Mark of the Beast'.

All hail Redmond.

"Sour Grapes make a bitter Whine." <(0)>
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Al Crowdfunding Project Donor*Special Project $75 donorSpecial Project $250 donor
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Message 1928610 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 14:09:55 UTC
Last modified: 7 Apr 2018, 14:10:10 UTC

Well, it's finally happened. I actually own a computer that is running Win 10 Pro. It came on a refurbed WS that I bought from Dell, that I was going to pull the CPU out of to use in the build for my RAID system, and sell the rest of the bits to make back my money and break even (other than the cost of the CPU), because that specific CPU pretty much can't be found right now, and is 3-5 weeks out if ordering it and I needed it right now.

Anyways, for giggles, I booted it up to see what the deal was, because honestly my only true experience with 10 was very close to the initial release date, and it didn't take me long to realize what a POS it was, and nuke the drive to start over with 7 (of course). Now that its been out in the real world for while and had a chance to bake a bit, I thought I would see what it looked like today. Pretty much my opinion is the same, there is so much sh*t on it, it's truly amazing. Especially in a business environment.

When I did the initial setup, I turned off/disabled anything and everything I could that had anything to do with this Cortina thing, and made sure I set it to be at a business, which I think disabled the store crap and having to have a ridiculous MS account on your computer. I found the program, which I learned is no longer being supported by the orig author, but has been tossed out to the community for any future improvements/incompatibilities, that makes it look like a reasonable semblance of the Win 7 desktop. I know that most of the junk is still in there, lurking below the surface, but at least it isn't shoved in my face.

With that installed, it didn't seem to be _tooo_ bad of an OS, but I do believe that there are a couple more things that I need to install on it to remove/disable much of the telemetry garbage and privacy violations that Win 10 is inherently built on. Have to google it, I know they're out there.

I do have a question though, it came with a Quadro P4000 video card installed, and of course I am thinking of installing BOINC on it, but I haven't researched if this card is supported for crunching, and if it is even a good idea to use it. The card is about 3/4" thick, and I don't recall seeing a cooling fan on it, but as the case it's in isn't all that big, I couldn't get a complete look at it. If not, it doesn't seem like a good idea to run such a taxing program on it, with what appears to be inadequate cooling. Anyone have any positive results using one of these cards without damaging it longer term?

Last comment on Win 10, I can't believe that businesses, especially those with more than say 10 or so systems, haven't been Screaming at MS to release that LTSB version for general business use, because there is so much #(*$* in that new OS that has NOTHING to do with actually running a computer in a business setting, it's actually mind blowing. If only Linux could get their poop in a group so to speak, and give MS a real run for their money.. Chicken and egg thing though, unfortunately.

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Profile Wiggo "Socialist"
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Message 1928615 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 14:39:06 UTC
Last modified: 7 Apr 2018, 14:40:12 UTC

The Quadro P4000 is a Pascal card and probably performs about the same as a 1060, but a bit slower than a 1070.

Cheers.
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Profile Siran d'Vel'nahr
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Message 1928622 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 14:58:55 UTC

Greetings,

From the information I just got, the new version of Windows 10 will be released on Tuesday, April 10, 2018. This new version will have a build number of 1804, presumable. The current version is 1709 which came on in September (09) 2017 (17), hence 1709.

This version will be a complete replacement of 1709.

Siran
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Windows 10 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker

Microsoft wants us to "Imagine life without walls"...
I say, "If there are no walls, who needs Windows?"
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Profile Clyde "Liberal" Crowdfunding Project Donor*Special Project $75 donorSpecial Project $250 donor
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Message 1928669 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 18:56:00 UTC

From the information I just got, the new version of Windows 10 will be released on Tuesday, April 10, 2018

Having my first Windows 10 computer last month and 'tamed' some of the problems.

What can I expect will happen?
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
--- George Santayana
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Profile Keith Myers Special Project $250 donor
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Message 1928680 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 20:14:48 UTC - in response to Message 1928610.  
Last modified: 7 Apr 2018, 20:40:48 UTC

I do have a question though, it came with a Quadro P4000 video card installed, and of course I am thinking of installing BOINC on it, but I haven't researched if this card is supported for crunching

Why not, it is Pascal based with 1792 CUDA cores, so somewhere between a 1060 and 1070. Oooohh, and it is single slot wide with a thin blower fan. You could plug a lot onto of them into a motherboard.

[Edit] Been reading reviews that mostly pair it against similar workstation cards. Did find one comparison of TimeSpy results against a 1080 and it had about 75% of the performance of the 1080.

So I think it would do respectfully well crunching for BOINC.
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Profile Keith Myers Special Project $250 donor
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Message 1928681 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 20:19:46 UTC

Get the O&O ShutUp application and run that to sanitize the privacy and telemetry configurations. Also run the Group Policy Editor and set some of the parameters to that only you control what and when Windows tries to do updates and send apps and drivers you don't want automatically installed.
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Message 1928692 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 21:30:03 UTC

The advantage of WIn10 pro is you can defer updates for up to 3 or so months, which gives them a time to release updates for the updates if there are issues, without them affecting you.
You can also select the branch you use for updates, Current branch is what everyone gets, Current Branch for Business is pretty much the same, but delayed from the Current branch release. So if you go with the Current Branch for Business, and Delay Feature & Quality updates for 90 days, it gives them 4 or so months to get things sorted before it ends up on your system.
Grant
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Al Crowdfunding Project Donor*Special Project $75 donorSpecial Project $250 donor
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Message 1928703 - Posted: 7 Apr 2018, 22:00:15 UTC
Last modified: 7 Apr 2018, 22:08:08 UTC

Thanks for the advice guys. I think I might as well try running BOINC on it, see how it likes it. While weaseling around in the settings somewhere, I did find a spot to push out at least one kind of update 365 days, and the other I believe if I remember correctly 30 days, or maybe 90, I can't remember, it was getting late last night, but I thought it said something about delaying till mid May when it will be absolutely required. Would def prefer 3 months, but actually would prefer Only security updates, and just the ones I approve, but I know we're in a brave new world now... Friggin M$

Will def get O&O ShutUp installed this afternoon, is the install pretty self explanatory, or are there good settings that aren't obvious that shouldn't be overlooked? I will have to take a look at the branch thing again, but first I think I need to grab a beer, because after I get done puttering with this one, I am going to be starting working on my RAID box, and that's going to be Linux. And you know how exciting it is for me to work with that loverly OS... :-O

I might just need a couple.

*edit* Well, that was easy! Just disabled everything other than Windows Defender, hopefully I can use my system in peace, at least till the next update that Siran just mentioned, which apparently is coming out on Tuesday.

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Message 1928798 - Posted: 8 Apr 2018, 12:40:17 UTC - in response to Message 1928703.  

*edit* Well, that was easy! Just disabled everything other than Windows Defender, hopefully I can use my system in peace, at least till the next update that Siran just mentioned, which apparently is coming out on Tuesday.

Greetings Al,

When it comes to these major upgrades of Windows 10, you may not get it until Summer. Microsoft portions out pushing the upgrades to users so their servers don't get overwhelmed. Tuesday is just the release date that they start pushing the upgrade out. I never thought that watching YouTube videos would be such a learning experience. I did my first ever BIOS flash a few weeks ago from watching some build videos. I've been building my own PCs since about 99ish. :)

Siran
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Windows 10 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker

Microsoft wants us to "Imagine life without walls"...
I say, "If there are no walls, who needs Windows?"
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Message 1928799 - Posted: 8 Apr 2018, 12:46:31 UTC

Despite the claim that the resource overhead in 10 is less than in 7, I am very leery about switching over and taking the chance of screwing up a computer that is running very well on 7. And I very much doubt that I would see any improvement with a new OS.
I think this is one of the few areas in which I shall stay with the 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' strategy.
I am not convinced that there is sufficient reason to change.

Meow7.
"The secret o' life is enjoying the passage of time." 1977, James Taylor
"With cats." 2018, kittyman

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Message 1928802 - Posted: 8 Apr 2018, 14:17:00 UTC - in response to Message 1928799.  

Despite the claim that the resource overhead in 10 is less than in 7, I am very leery about switching over and taking the chance of screwing up a computer that is running very well on 7. And I very much doubt that I would see any improvement with a new OS.
I think this is one of the few areas in which I shall stay with the 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' strategy.
I am not convinced that there is sufficient reason to change.

Meow7.


I totally agree Mark.
Sadly it will get harder for some new hardware to get win 7 installed.
With each crime and every kindness we birth our future.
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Message 1928808 - Posted: 8 Apr 2018, 15:14:16 UTC

I totally agree Mark.
Sadly it will get harder for some new hardware to get win 7 installed.
Also agree, Mark.
I run 7, 8.1 and 10 on various platforms(10 on a Surface Tablet), I find all three to be basically the same when configured for my use(same bells and whistles just different control locations and interfaces), but 10 is particularly hard to use. I don't know if that's just endemic to all OSs on Tablets or just me.

I just prefer 7, it's like that old pair of jeans that always just 'feel good and comfortable'.

"Sour Grapes make a bitter Whine." <(0)>
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Message 1928818 - Posted: 8 Apr 2018, 16:23:17 UTC

Greetings,

The question you have to ask yourself is: "What happens when January 2020 comes around and I won't get any more security updates for my Windows 7."

Upgrade to Windows 8 (not sure when it's end of life is scheduled for)?

I see 2 choices:
1) Upgrade to Windows 10 and be assured of receiving security updates for the foreseeable and unforeseeable future
2) Hope beyond hope that Linux catches up and can run what we want to run that ONLY runs on Windows or that the manufacturers of what only runs on Windows will see the light and port their stuff to Linux

Later this month I will be ordering the last 2 pieces I need for my Z370 build, RAM and an M.2 NVMe drive. I already have Windows 10 v1709 burned to a bootable flash drive. I won't be going through the headache of trying to get Win 7 to run reliably on a i7 8700 for less than 2 years. As much as I like Win 7, I am going to byte the bullet and put it out to pasture ( that is not a typo ;) ).

And, for those that think I am a fanboy ( or fanboi ) of Micro$oft, believe me, I am not. I do not like their practices. Until Micro$oft goes back to thinking of the customer first and money second, I will not be a fan of them. The biggest mistake was for Bill Gates to leave Micro$oft, in my opinion.

FFT

Siran
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USS Vre'kasht NCC-33187

Windows 10 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker

Microsoft wants us to "Imagine life without walls"...
I say, "If there are no walls, who needs Windows?"
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Message 1929036 - Posted: 9 Apr 2018, 15:42:36 UTC

Did I mention that I am getting an ever more serious disdain for M$ seemingly every week?

Avoid Windows 10 crapware: How to get rid of Candy Crush and all the rest

And according to MS's #1 uber cheerleader at zdnet.com, Mr. Bott, even following his own suggestions, he admits that it doesn't really solve the crapware problem, it best case just substitutes another, potentially more 'useful' set of crapware instead. And admits that this is the situation for pretty much for any business that isn't large enough to have an IT dept staffed with people who will be creating their own versions of it to roll out, with only what _they_ want their users to be exposed to, and what they want to expose to M$ as well. Funny how that isn't allowed for us mere mortals, huh?


Wonder if these have anything to do with it?

Crapware: Why manufacturers install it, what you can do about it, and why it's not going to go away

Running Windows 10? Here's how Microsoft plans to milk more profits out of its cash cow

And and of course, what they've become infamous for:

Windows 10 telemetry secrets: Where, when, and why Microsoft collects your data



And yeah, we'll see if this actually does any good:

Windows 10: Microsoft rolls out new privacy tools for telemetry data

I'm not holding my breath. And a weird thing about all of these articles, it appears that they all have 0 comments, which I have to believe means that they've disabled comments for all them. Pretty interesting choice, because I'd be willing to guess that there are more than a few people who have opinions on all of them.

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Message 1929049 - Posted: 9 Apr 2018, 16:33:39 UTC - in response to Message 1929036.  
Last modified: 9 Apr 2018, 16:54:41 UTC

... he admits that it doesn't really solve the crapware problem, it best case just substitutes another, potentially more 'useful' set of crapware instead.

Hi Al,

I watched a YouTube video about removing most, if not all, of the Micro$oft crapware in Windows 10. I remember that Candy Crush was one of them, but don't remember the rest. I also don't remember the YouTuber mentioning anything about replacements. If memory serves, I believe he mentions something about a utility that will take care of that for you so you don't have to waste your time with the actual crapware removal. I'll see if I can find the video and link it here.

The YouTuber worked for Micro$oft for 15 years and was "fired" just prior to the "free" release of Windows 10 in 2016.

Have a great day, Al. :)

Siran

Crapware removal video #1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgKJMsJ-6XU

Unwanted apps uninstall video #2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnAzCnbDNr8

I found that there are many more videos about crapware removal on YouTube.

Hope this helps. :)

Siran
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USS Vre'kasht NCC-33187

Windows 10 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker

Microsoft wants us to "Imagine life without walls"...
I say, "If there are no walls, who needs Windows?"
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Message 1929412 - Posted: 11 Apr 2018, 13:57:20 UTC

The Spring Creators update (Redstone 4/ ver. 1803) has been delayed until....?

http://news.softpedia.com/news/windows-10-spring-creators-update-reportedly-delayed-520622.shtml


I don't buy computers, I build them!!
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