I would think your old LaserJet drivers would still work (I have a 4000N, 8100DN, and DesignJet 600) that are all working in 7-64. The two LaserJets were installed through finding the drivers via Windows Updates, but the DesignJet was tricky. I had to track down the 64-bit win2k drivers for that one.

64-bit drivers for really old hardware are basically universal, though they won't be signed and "trusted" by newer OSes, but they will still work just fine. Regarding the fact that the 4000 and the 8100 both got the drivers via Windows Update, I would have to assume they'll still be there and available for Win 10, as well.

(all three of my printers have JetDirect cards in them, so they are all network printers, and installing them is not specifically straightforward like plugging a USB printer in, or running the 800MB bloatware software suite for modern printers and selecting how the printer is connected.

To manually add a printer: control panel > devices and printers > Add Printer Wizard > add local printer > create a new port > type of port > TCP/IP > enter IP address, and then it should be pretty self-explanatory from that point. I should also note that my printers do use DHCP, but have reserved addresses. If you can't reserve a DHCP address for them, you should configure them to a static address, otherwise they might stop working because their IP changed.)

Yes, for both LaserJet Printers I did install them as you state here... "Manually add a printer..." Win 7 and XP Pro x64 all installed the proper drivers for each printer. The Netgear PS-101 Printserver for the 4ML is static, and so is the JetDirect Card in the 4000TN. I just didn't want Win 10 "breaking" those existing drivers, and then telling me it can't print to each printer.

Win 8 on a tablet, (my uncle's tablet), saw the 4000TN on the Network; however, refused to find a proper PCL-6 driver for it. I was/still am concerned that Win 10 will be similar, unless it keeps the Win 7 drivers for each printer.


TL

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I would think your old LaserJet drivers would still work (I have a 4000N, 8100DN, and DesignJet 600) that are all working in 7-64. The two LaserJets were installed through finding the drivers via Windows Updates, but the DesignJet was tricky. I had to track down the 64-bit win2k drivers for that one.

64-bit drivers for really old hardware are basically universal, though they won't be signed and "trusted" by newer OSes, but they will still work just fine. Regarding the fact that the 4000 and the 8100 both got the drivers via Windows Update, I would have to assume they'll still be there and available for Win 10, as well.

(all three of my printers have JetDirect cards in them, so they are all network printers, and installing them is not specifically straightforward like plugging a USB printer in, or running the 800MB bloatware software suite for modern printers and selecting how the printer is connected.

To manually add a printer: control panel > devices and printers > Add Printer Wizard > add local printer > create a new port > type of port > TCP/IP > enter IP address, and then it should be pretty self-explanatory from that point. I should also note that my printers do use DHCP, but have reserved addresses. If you can't reserve a DHCP address for them, you should configure them to a static address, otherwise they might stop working because their IP changed.)

A driver that has been signed by MS for an older OS will have a compatible signature for all newer OS. Until they removed the ability to do so. We were only submitting our Wind 7/8 drivers for Windows XP digital signatures. Now we just submit for Windows 7 & there are check boxes to include the older OS such as XP & Vista. If a driver has only been signed for one platform you can get the unsigned driver message in the other platform. Such as an x86 signed driver in an x64 OS.

We haven't had any issues with our printer drivers in Windows 10, but they haven't really changed anything in the printing subsystem since some new things added in Windows 8.x. XP, Vista, & 7 drivers should continue to work with any issues. Miscellaneous software, from those 800MB bloatware packages, on the other hand may need an update. I do know the scanner software we provide with our MFPs does not care for Windows 8 or 10. So the overlords at the head office have finally decided to replace it.

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The way I understand that is that a "full retail" license is bound to an owner. It can be moved from one computer to another as long as the computer, it was previously activated for, is retired (or reinstalled with another license/OS).

Is it your wishful thinking or did you try such transfers of license indeed?

Did it BOTH ways.

In the past, Telephone Activation Worked.

In the last 30 Days, my old OEM Win 7 died. Possible MOBO failure.

'Pulled' an old Vista Desktop. And installed the OEM Win 7 from a backup (Acronis). Different MOBO, New Hard Drive (in closet), etc. and of course, got 'Activate within 30 Days' Message.

'Pushed' The Link, expecting to have to attempt a Telephone Activation.

To my Surprise: It Activated!!!!

Just one persons experience.

Similar for me with sons computer, mobo died, replaced mobo, cpu and RAM, did new install from the Win7 Pro CD (I've only got one for 5 pc's), used his license number (one of a batch I bought), online registration without the expected phone call.

I'm not worried about printer driver as Samsung universal driver still works with my colour laser.

For those that are curious like me, I found that what Microsoft is calling OS as a Service simply means they will push all updates to your computer automatically. No more Service Packs. Possibly no more Patch Tuesday. When an update is ready, it goes out.

I know that many here will be very skeptical of that approach. Few here might remember the Windows NT 4.0 Service Pack 6 fiasco that rendered some computers unbootable, prompting Microsoft to release a Service Pack 6a to fix that problem.

However, that was 20 years ago, and the software update mechanism/process has greatly improved. Most people who have tested 10 have experienced the new OS-aaS and have had no major problems thus far.

You can still opt out of getting the updates just as you can today on Windows 7. Or if you don't like the idea that certain features or functions of your OS could change over time, then you may want to reconsider 10.

Personally, I'm going full bore ahead. I don't mind changes to the OS, but I will stop once they start charging a monthly or yearly fee.

For those that are curious like me, I found that what Microsoft is calling OS as a Service simply means they will push all updates to your computer automatically. No more Service Packs. Possibly no more Patch Tuesday. When an update is ready, it goes out.

-[ snip ]-

Greetings OzzFan,

Are you saying that we will have NO control over updates as we do now? I have Win7 inform me that there are updates and that I will deal with them at my leisure, meaning I don't want the update system rebooting my PC "automagically" without my consent or me having a hand in it.

The update system does not know my password to finish the boot process. At 1am, my PC would be sitting here waiting for it. BOINC would not be running until I get up and realize the M$ sent an update and tried rebooting my PC. BOINC would miss out on hours of crunch time.

I certainly hope that M$ is not planning on taking FULL control of the updates and allows me to continue as I have for the past couple decades.

Keep on BOINCing...! :)

---

CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\//
Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker
"Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath

For those that are curious like me, I found that what Microsoft is calling OS as a Service simply means they will push all updates to your computer automatically. No more Service Packs. Possibly no more Patch Tuesday. When an update is ready, it goes out.

-[ snip ]-

Are you saying that we will have NO control over updates as we do now? I have Win7 inform me that there are updates and that I will deal with them at my leisure, meaning I don't want the update system rebooting my PC "automagically" without my consent or me having a hand in it.

...

I certainly hope that M$ is not planning on taking FULL control of the updates and allows me to continue as I have for the past couple decades.

As I said in my post:

You can still opt out of getting the updates just as you can today on Windows 7.

You will still be able to turn off the automatic updates and opt-out of Microsoft sending updates to your machine "willy-nilly" like.

For those that are curious like me, I found that what Microsoft is calling OS as a Service simply means they will push all updates to your computer automatically. No more Service Packs. Possibly no more Patch Tuesday. When an update is ready, it goes out.

-[ snip ]-

Greetings OzzFan,

Are you saying that we will have NO control over updates as we do now? I have Win7 inform me that there are updates and that I will deal with them at my leisure, meaning I don't want the update system rebooting my PC "automagically" without my consent or me having a hand in it.

The update system does not know my password to finish the boot process. At 1am, my PC would be sitting here waiting for it. BOINC would not be running until I get up and realize the M$ sent an update and tried rebooting my PC. BOINC would miss out on hours of crunch time.

I certainly hope that M$ is not planning on taking FULL control of the updates and allows me to continue as I have for the past couple decades.

Keep on BOINCing...! :)

MS specifically stated that updated could be be delayed for those that needed or wished to run longer stability situations. They also stated that they want to have things like security patches & fixes pushed out as soon as they are available. So Patch Tuesday may in fact be going away.
I imagine the auto update service will still be able to be disabled as it can be now. At least in the preview releases of Windows 10 you still can. However, I haven't had a change to install the newest version released this week.

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For those that are curious like me, I found that what Microsoft is calling OS as a Service simply means they will push all updates to your computer automatically. No more Service Packs. Possibly no more Patch Tuesday. When an update is ready, it goes out.

-[ snip ]-

Are you saying that we will have NO control over updates as we do now? I have Win7 inform me that there are updates and that I will deal with them at my leisure, meaning I don't want the update system rebooting my PC "automagically" without my consent or me having a hand in it.

...

I certainly hope that M$ is not planning on taking FULL control of the updates and allows me to continue as I have for the past couple decades.

As I said in my post:

You can still opt out of getting the updates just as you can today on Windows 7.

You will still be able to turn off the automatic updates and opt-out of Microsoft sending updates to your machine "willy-nilly" like.

Ozz,

I would still want the updates, just not at the control of M$. If M$ has full control, I would have to opt-out and deal with "auto" updates when I had the time to do it. Then I would opt-in, wait for the reboot and log back into Windows. Personally, I would frown on ANYONE other then me having such control of my PC.

If there's no option to: "Inform me of updates but let me download and install them later.", then I may have to think twice about getting Win 10. Just because they are "giving it away free" for a year does not mean they can take control of PCs all across the world like that. THAT would be a major security risk I would not want to deal with, in my opinion. Hell, even the different flavors of Linux I have tried lets you deal with updates when you have the time, they're not forced upon you.

Everything I have been reading about Win 10 makes me want to get it. When I saw that for one year they would "give it away" to users of 7 and 8, that just sweetened the pie that much more. :)

I just want the control over updates as I have right now. I don't want to have to opt-out of getting them just to prevent my PC from rebooting in the middle of the night or worse, when I'm away from home for any length of time.

Keep on BOINCing...! :)

---

CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\//
Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker
"Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath

The opting out does the same as notifying you when updates are available. They simply won't be installed until you're ready.

The opting out does the same as notifying you when updates are available. They simply won't be installed until you're ready.

Greetings Ozz,

Ok then. I can deal with that. :)

That was what I was trying to find out. Thanks. :)

Keep on BOINCing...! :)

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CAPT Siran d'Vel'nahr - L L & P _\\//
Winders 11 OS? "What a piece of junk!" - L. Skywalker
"Logic is the cement of our civilization with which we ascend from chaos using reason as our guide." - T'Plana-hath

And what about the old CRT monitors that I still have to use due to my low income?

Since you won't be installing Windows 10 on the CRT itself, it won't be considered as part of the device's lifetime. The device will be the computer, tablet, laptop, or phone that you install the OS onto.

Listed "devices" quite different. What is "computer" device? I keep same case more then 10 years already, replaced almost all inside. Is it same "computer" or different one?...

Hi Raistmer,

Given that W7 tried put me through validation procedures at least 3 times when I upgraded some component that M$ deemed major I'm not impressed by all the guff they come out with regarding their OS's, Its always a case of having to suck it and see.

My guess is that if you change a CPU, GPU or Motherboard, or more than 1 hard drive that Win10 will demand re-validation or a new key.

Regards,

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Cliff,
Been there, Done that, Still no damm T shirt!

... just not at the control of M$. If M$ has full control, I would have to opt-out and deal with "auto" updates when I had the time to do it. Then I would opt-in, wait for the reboot and log back into Windows. Personally, I would frown on ANYONE other then me having such control of my PC.

If there's no option to: "Inform me of updates but let me download and install them later.", then I may have to think twice about getting Win 10. Just because they are "giving it away free" for a year does not mean they can take control of PCs all across the world like that. THAT would be a major security risk I would not want to deal with, in my opinion. Hell, even the different flavors of Linux I have tried lets you deal with updates when you have the time, they're not forced upon you. ...

We run rather a few Windows machines that are used to control equipment. We've had to isolate those machines from the outside world to ensure that there are no updates foisted upon them that then cause some badly expensive reboots or other interference... (Very simply, we very rarely update them. The disruption and risk is too expensive.)


Microsoft (as does Apple and some others) has (have) complete control of the updates for their internet connected users. With that, they have complete control of your machine and your data all at their whim and discretion and Marketing...


IT is what we allow it to be,
Martin

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See new freedom: Mageia Linux
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... just not at the control of M$. If M$ has full control, I would have to opt-out and deal with "auto" updates when I had the time to do it. Then I would opt-in, wait for the reboot and log back into Windows. Personally, I would frown on ANYONE other then me having such control of my PC.

If there's no option to: "Inform me of updates but let me download and install them later.", then I may have to think twice about getting Win 10. Just because they are "giving it away free" for a year does not mean they can take control of PCs all across the world like that. THAT would be a major security risk I would not want to deal with, in my opinion. Hell, even the different flavors of Linux I have tried lets you deal with updates when you have the time, they're not forced upon you. ...

We run rather a few Windows machines that are used to control equipment. We've had to isolate those machines from the outside world to ensure that there are no updates foisted upon them that then cause some badly expensive reboots or other interference... (Very simply, we very rarely update them. The disruption and risk is too expensive.)


Microsoft (as does Apple and some others) has (have) complete control of the updates for their internet connected users. With that, they have complete control of your machine and your data all at their whim and discretion and Marketing...


IT is what we allow it to be,
Martin

Apple may load the updates into your system but you determine when they are installed. The reason for this is many updates require rebooting the system which at times isn't desirable. Now isolating a system may still be desirable to avoid software updates by hackers. As for marketing, the only thing I have found is in the iPhone. It's possible for a web page to redirect the phone to the App store. It bugs the daylights out of me to read a news item then an instant latter being ask to purchase Candy Crush.

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Playing around with the latest version of Windows 10 today at work & if it more along the lines of what Windows 8 should have been. I haven't yet found much that causes me wish a 10,000 year curse upon Microsoft. Like Vista, Windows 8, & Windows 8.1 did.

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Having just played around for the past couple of days with a Lenovo G50 with Windows 8.1 on it, I must say there's nothing more I hate than Windows 8.1

Not easy to get into, not even when you've been using all kinds of Windows since 3.0 days. Very difficult to get rid of all the pre-installed bloatware (both from Lenovo and Microsoft). And whomever came up with those charms should be taken out back and flogged.

I dread tomorrow when I get to give that laptop to my mum, who is 75 years old and gets her first internet connection on Wednesday.
Although I got rid of most of the bloatware, there's still plenty on the machine that apparently needs to stay on as else Windows stops working. Sigh.

That doesn't bode well for Windows 10 then.
I'll make sure to install it on one machine, the tv-server first as that one is easily reformatted and brought back to its former glory, just because there's not much on there. It streams all we do with it from an 8TB NAS. But at least by installing Windows 10 on that machine, the family can decide if they want it on their own machines.

Not if it also sports the "Start menu" with all the tiles and the Microsoft Store that cannot be uninstalled.

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Having just played around for the past couple of days with a Lenovo G50 with Windows 8.1 on it, I must say there's nothing more I hate than Windows 8.1

Not easy to get into, not even when you've been using all kinds of Windows since 3.0 days. Very difficult to get rid of all the pre-installed bloatware (both from Lenovo and Microsoft). And whomever came up with those charms should be taken out back and flogged.

I dread tomorrow when I get to give that laptop to my mum, who is 75 years old and gets her first internet connection on Wednesday.
Although I got rid of most of the bloatware, there's still plenty on the machine that apparently needs to stay on as else Windows stops working. Sigh.

That doesn't bode well for Windows 10 then.
I'll make sure to install it on one machine, the tv-server first as that one is easily reformatted and brought back to its former glory, just because there's not much on there. It streams all we do with it from an 8TB NAS. But at least by installing Windows 10 on that machine, the family can decide if they want it on their own machines.

Not if it also sports the "Start menu" with all the tiles and the Microsoft Store that cannot be uninstalled.

I'm not a fan of the tiled "start menu". I figured I would put Classic Shell on there later. I only spent about 90 min messing around with it. I may have more time tomorrow if we don't get snowed out tonight.

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I watched recently as a veteran Windows user fired up a new Windows 8.1 computer for the first time. It was a classic 'big OEM' pre-install, so all the worries about licencing and so on were taken care of - it just needed user personalisation on first use. I was there to supervise and as technical backstop in case anything went wrong. Which it duly did...

Very few pages in, we got to a screen which asked 'please type in a name for this computer' - so he did. And got an error message about 'you are trying to use an incompatible keyboard - please use an alternative keyboard', or words to that effect. Which, since we were trying to use the laptop's built-in UK keyboard, didn't make much sense.

On a whim, I suspected that the name he had typed might have exceeded the 15-character NetBIOS limit for a hostname, and suggested he shorten it. Bingo! Keyboard becomes compatible again, and on we go.

But what crap for a new user to encounter at that point in the process. If there's a limit, state it - and if the user makes a mistake with the unknown limit, at least try to address the real problem with the error message.

Yep, I had to set up the laptop from scratch as well. I was super glad I tried the thing out first, because to be able to completely install everything... it needs internet. Not sure why though, but one of the first questions is which internet connection you want to use, even before adding a name of a user.

And then the weirdest thing by most is that you have to make a Windows account, with either a @hotmail.com or @outlook.com extension... but this isn't an active email address, it's just an account Windows uses. Or at least, when I tried to log in with that account, Outlook.com (the web site) told me the account was unknown. So I had to separately make it anew, with the same name and password. Yeah, I am going to manage to explain that to my mother. ;-)

An hour ago I was fighting with the pre-installed Skype. Now, the Skype on my own computer has a menu at the top, lots of things to offer and an acquaintances list. Not the one coming with Windows 8.1; here all you have is a button to call people, to look through your empty list and to search through your list. Then there's three dots at the bottom, which when clicked open to give you a chance to search someone out there on the internet and add them, and something else I have already forgotten. NO Options, NO preferences, even getting out of this Skype isn't easy as it's a full-screen endeavour. I'm contemplating uninstalling it and installing a Skype by hand.

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My gripe about 8.1 is.. I guess they're called "charms".. where you have to hover into the corners of the screen to get the useful stuff that used to be easy to find.

I installed 8.1 in a VM a few months ago and saw and used 8/8.1 for the first time ever. I tried for 30 minutes to figure out how to shut it down and ended up having to google it. Yeah. I am by no means a computer novice, but I'm not a software engineer, either. I have no idea whose brilliant idea it was to put the shut down/restart/logoff menu right in the middle of all the other icons that used to be in the tray. At least put a red background around that icon or something... make it stand out and obvious that is how to shut down or restart.

And that is the extent of my experience with 8.1. 30 minutes in a VM trying to figure out how to shut it down. That's just terrible. *shudder*

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Linux laptop:
record uptime: 1511d 20h 19m (ended due to the power brick giving-up)

Yep, I had to set up the laptop from scratch as well. I was super glad I tried the thing out first, because to be able to completely install everything... it needs internet. Not sure why though, but one of the first questions is which internet connection you want to use, even before adding a name of a user.

And then the weirdest thing by most is that you have to make a Windows account, with either a @hotmail.com or @outlook.com extension... but this isn't an active email address, it's just an account Windows uses. Or at least, when I tried to log in with that account, Outlook.com (the web site) told me the account was unknown. So I had to separately make it anew, with the same name and password. Yeah, I am going to manage to explain that to my mother. ;-)

An hour ago I was fighting with the pre-installed Skype. Now, the Skype on my own computer has a menu at the top, lots of things to offer and an acquaintances list. Not the one coming with Windows 8.1; here all you have is a button to call people, to look through your empty list and to search through your list. Then there's three dots at the bottom, which when clicked open to give you a chance to search someone out there on the internet and add them, and something else I have already forgotten. NO Options, NO preferences, even getting out of this Skype isn't easy as it's a full-screen endeavour. I'm contemplating uninstalling it and installing a Skype by hand.

With Windows 8.x using a Microsoft account instead of a local PC account is optional. You just have to find part on the screen at that point that says "skip this" or "use local account instead" or something like that. It has been a while since I had to set one of those up, but I did a OS install/setup guide for the other people at work with the exact process to skip the Microsoft account bit.
With Windows 10 a Microsoft account is required. At least so far, but I imagine they will ship it like that. They used to call it Live ID, but now the name is Microsoft account. Any e-mail address can be used when setting up a Microsoft account. The one I was using at work today happen to be with a gmail account I use for testing.
Once logged in with Windows 10 it looks like local accounts can be setup like normal. I will have to see about that at some point. I think most of my time was spent finding things that need shut off and locked down. Like our normal test systems are configured.

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