CIA chief challenges Senate torture report
CIA Director John Brennan threaded a rhetorical needle in an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters Thursday, acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to detainees but defending the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives.
http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2025211683_apxciatorturereport.html

CIA Director John Brennan wants to stop attacks and save lives.
Fine. But it doesn't work when "abhorrent" things to detainees are done.
On the contrary it will back fire.

Very clear post, thank you Janne.

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rOZZ
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CIA chief challenges Senate torture report
CIA Director John Brennan threaded a rhetorical needle in an unprecedented televised news conference at CIA headquarters Thursday, acknowledging that agency officers did "abhorrent" things to detainees but defending the overall post-9/11 interrogation program for stopping attacks and saving lives.
http://seattletimes.com/html/nationworld/2025211683_apxciatorturereport.html

CIA Director John Brennan wants to stop attacks and save lives.
Fine. But it doesn't work when "abhorrent" things to detainees are done.
On the contrary it will back fire.

Which everyone except a few rouge operatives -- at whatever level -- looking at career advancement understand. Somehow I get the feeling that what happened will be in direct conflict with written orders, if we could see the entire unredacted report. I do wonder how far up the chain the attitude of get results, don't tell me how, extended.

Now as to that won't prosecute memo, I suspect the person requesting it knew full well that abhorrent things, beyond the acceptable things memo, were or would be done. If so this person is a war criminal and conspired to commit war crimes.

Oh as to Bush v Goreing the difference is which side lost.

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Darwin said, in The Descent of Man:

As man advances in civilization, and small tribes are united into larger communities, the simplest reason would tell each individual that he ought to extend his social instinct and sympathies to all the members of the same nation, though personally unknown to him. This point being once reached, there is only an artificial barrier to prevent his sympathies extending to the men of all nations and races.

hominisation- Ain't There Yet, so Everybody Gets A Pass. -me.

And Calley wrote in his memoir, Body Count:

"And babies. On babies, everyone's really hung up. 'But babies! The little innocent babies!' Of course, we've been in Vietnam for ten years now. If we're in Vietnam another ten, if your son is killed by those babies you'll cry at me, 'Why didn't you kill those babies that day?'"

Oxymoron?

Yep or No Yep, dat 'is' The Question.

Yep. Nah. Yes. No?

' '

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

Oh as to Bush v Goreing the difference is which side lost.

Just an aside, that's what Goreing said at Nuremburg.

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What is the difference between
Goring and Cheney?
Cheney is still alive!

Yeah, right, the only difference between a top official of the Nazi regime and the vice president of the Bush presidency is that one is dead, sure.

I get that you don't like the guy, but please, refrain from idiotic statements like this. You are cheapening the tragedy that was WW2.

Netherlands Person said:

I get that you don't like the guy, but please, refrain from idiotic statements like this. You are cheapening the tragedy that was WW2.

Now Dat 'is' FUNNY!!!

My WWI and WWII GrandDad and Dad are Whooping 'it' Up in Their Graves!

No World Court, No World Condemnation, No Outrage from Any One or Group, into The Future EONs 'is' Gunna Stop HuWoMan from what some consider A War Crime.

The Nature of 'it', will Not Be Excised from our Code. Ever. Not Naturally.
Maybe Chemically or Genetically Engineered or Combo.

Otherwise, Where 'is' DEM Detainees, I'z Gots Some Questions fO 'em. heeeheeeheee. All NATURAL Like.

Yep.

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

Oh as to Bush v Goreing the difference is which side lost.

Just an aside, that's what Goreing said at Nuremburg.

Is, has been, always will be.

That is why Churchill, Roosevelt, Truman, and other 'Victors', were not tried for The War Crimes THEY committed.

Same for Bush Jr., Cheney, et al, should not be Prosecuted, unless the Jihadists , and their supporters, win and occupy Washington.

Why treat Bush Jr., Cheney, European Government Leaders Differently from the leaders of 'The Greatest generation'?

An Unthinking Agenda.

The firebombing of Dresden was a war crime. One of many the allies committed. None were charged. The necessity of winning comes before anything else. That is why it is impossible to wage war and not have war crimes.

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There are no absolutes!

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Hang all war criminals!

No, celttooth. Civilised countries do not have capital punishment. Civilised countries do not have torture either.

And, in civilised countries, everybody is innocent until proven guilty. Therefore Osama bin Laden was murdered as an innocent man, however much he might have been a suspect. He was never brought before court. I would rather, the proper procedure to be followed.

While I can sympathise with Celttooth's sentiments (and I have this constant vision of lamp posts in my mind) I agree that civilised countries do not have capital punishment or torture.

I would like to see these criminals brought to justice along with Tony Blair and his accomplices, remembering that our morals must be better than theirs. They all have blood on their hands.

They all have blood on their hands.

Somebody has to, so you do not.

Love to see the day, when The Legal Teams parachute into Countries with their Briefcases filled with Legal Pads, Subpoenas, and Hand Cuffs for The Baddies.

Arrest them. Set them up in 3 Star or better Hotels and Bring 'em to Justice.

Be Cheaper to Kill 'em.

Yep.

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

Hang all war criminals!

No, celttooth. Civilised countries do not have capital punishment. Civilised countries do not have torture either.

And, in civilised countries, everybody is innocent until proven guilty. Therefore Osama bin Laden was murdered as an innocent man, however much he might have been a suspect. He was never brought before court. I would rather, the proper procedure to be followed.

While I can sympathise with Celttooth's sentiments (and I have this constant vision of lamp posts in my mind) I agree that civilised countries do not have capital punishment or torture.

I would like to see these criminals brought to justice along with Tony Blair and his accomplices, remembering that our morals must be better than theirs. They all have blood on their hands.

And from what I have read Mr. Blair was the one who fed Bush the bogus intel.

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[/quote]

Old James

Darwin said, in The Descent of Man:

As man advances in civilization, and small tribes are united into larger communities, the simplest reason would tell each individual that he ought to extend his social instinct and sympathies to all the members of the same nation, though personally unknown to him. This point being once reached, there is only an artificial barrier to prevent his sympathies extending to the men of all nations and races.

hominisation- Ain't There Yet, so Everybody Gets A Pass. -me.

And Calley wrote in his memoir, Body Count:

"And babies. On babies, everyone's really hung up. 'But babies! The little innocent babies!' Of course, we've been in Vietnam for ten years now. If we're in Vietnam another ten, if your son is killed by those babies you'll cry at me, 'Why didn't you kill those babies that day?'"

Oxymoron?

Yep or No Yep, dat 'is' The Question.

Yep. Nah. Yes. No?

' '

Yep... No?

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rOZZ
Music
Pictures

And from what I have read Mr. Blair was the one who fed Bush the bogus intel.

Well, they got it from the Germans, but I believe both the Germans and the British noted in their reports that the source of the intel was unreliable at best. The CIA knowingly used unreliable intel to argue that Iraq had WMD's, without telling anyone that the intel they used was unreliable.

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Reality Internet Personality

And from what I have read Mr. Blair was the one who fed Bush the bogus intel.

Well, they got it from the Germans, but I believe both the Germans and the British noted in their reports that the source of the intel was unreliable at best. The CIA knowingly used unreliable intel to argue that Iraq had WMD's, without telling anyone that the intel they used was unreliable.

I stand corrected. I was against the Iraq invasion right from the start. I listend to the Senate debates and I wasnt convinced the intel was right.
So if you want to hang war criminals then go for all of our politicians who voted to allow that war to happen.

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[/quote]

Old James

And in keeping with the blood on Blair's hands there was also the mysterious death of David Kelly, the United Nations weapons inspector in Iraq..

"After telling Her Majesty's Government there were no weapons of mass destruction (WMD) in Iraq. He told David Broucher, a former British Ambassador. "I will probably be found dead in the woods."
When he was found dead in the woods Tony Blair was asked.
“Have you got blood on your hands.” Blair refused to answer."

Who Killed Kelly?

Hey OutRagers: How You Gonna Arrest Them and Bring Them To Justice?

I'm Talking 'bout All The Baddies Now Adorning Streets of Iraq and Syria with Heads and Decapped Bodies. Not to Mention Other World Baddies doing 'War' 'Crimes' Everywhere else.

Send them First Class Tickets to Whatever World Court of Justice? Quartered in First Class Hotels while Awaiting and Attending Trials? Then when Convicted, have Them Placed Gently in Wonderfully Equipped and Staffed 'Prisons'? Until they Die at age 70, 80, 90, 100?

Who Pays? Europe? ROTFLMAO? US? Super ROTFLMAO.

Please Show Me A Proposal on HOW ALL THIS WILL BE DONE, BY WHOM and WHO PAYS.

Rolling on the Floor.

Yep.

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

Hey OutRagers: How You Gonna Arrest Them and Bring Them To Justice?

I'm Talking 'bout All The Baddies Now Adorning Streets of Iraq and Syria with Heads and Decapped Bodies. Not to Mention Other World Baddies doing 'War' 'Crimes' Everywhere else.

Send them First Class Tickets to Whatever World Court of Justice? Quartered in First Class Hotels while Awaiting and Attending Trials? Then when Convicted, have Them Placed Gently in Wonderfully Equipped and Staffed 'Prisons'? Until they Die at age 70, 80, 90, 100?

Who Pays? Europe? ROTFLMAO? US? Super ROTFLMAO.

Please Show Me A Proposal on HOW ALL THIS WILL BE DONE, BY WHOM and WHO PAYS.

Rolling on the Floor.

Yep.

Don't let your conviction convice you otherwise, or vica versa for that matter. Keep your individuality strong in these Times.

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rOZZ
Music
Pictures

An even better story than who killed Kelly...

Iraq Supergun

...interesting reading.

What is the difference between
Goring and Cheney?
Cheney is still alive!

Yeah, right, the only difference between a top official of the Nazi regime and the vice president of the Bush presidency is that one is dead, sure.

I get that you don't like the guy, but please, refrain from idiotic statements like this. You are cheapening the tragedy that was WW2.

Of course, number of deaths in those 2 wars are just incomparable. But still they 2 have something in common, both are wars. So, both are war criminals.

If some will judge war criminal by number of deaths in particular war (just as you suppose to do refusing to see common parts and making accent on scale) perhaps one should be sentenced 10 000 years and another "only" let say 200, will such comparison be better?