Racist? [yes you are]

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Message 1681844 - Posted: 20 May 2015, 20:22:14 UTC - in response to Message 1681658.  

I'm so glad you have data that shows that high school dropouts are richer than people with masters degrees. Perhaps you will share that data source with us so we can be enlightened at how the conventional wisdom on that is wrong. https://admit.washington.edu/Paying/Value Hint 1.6 million dollars.

That number doesn't mean what you think it does. First of all, it talks about college graduates, not highschool graduates, second of all, its only an average number. Averages are color blind. Black people, even with a college degree, earn less than everyone else.

Besides, colleges have a huge upfront cost. If you want more black people to go to college, what you need to do is lower the costs of college, rather than improve the quality of education itself.

Let me ask a dumb question. If you are brought up in a culture that tells you, you can't succeed because the man will slap you down, so you don't even try, will you succeed? Does it even matter if the man does or doesn't slap you down? Yes, the culture that says you can't get ahead even if you try, needs to change.

Easy victim blaming and absolving your own responsibility. America is not racist, black people aren't getting ahead in life because of racism, its all because they are part of a culture that tells them to don't even try. Its all on them.

Even if 100% of racism were to stop tomorrow, would there be any change? Unfortunately, not much. There is a lot of cultural momentum that needs to change and that could take many generations.

There would be change, instantly. Not a lot of change and poverty wouldn't be over within a year, but we would definitely see positive change right away.

But ES99, posted a link to an article that said colorblind was racist. So that means that even if 100% of it were to stop, it is still racist. Not sure about that math. Thinking about that another way, the argument is to not be racist, you must consider race. Sounds like we have some circular thinking. Or someone wants to extract vengeance by corruption of blood.

If racism would stop 100% the system that would come into place wouldn't actually be color blind, as like you said, color blindness is racism in itself.

Finally we have the lawsuit by the Asian students saying that the racial preference policy that puts blacks ahead -- considering race to be non-racist -- is in fact racist to their group. So the cure to racism, is different racism?

Thats similar to white people complaining that positive discrimination is racist towards them. What those white people, and to a lesser degree Asians, fail to understand is the imbalance of power. White people enjoy systemic privilege almost everywhere, Asians to a lesser degree also benefit from said privilege. Black people face systemic racism everywhere. So when they get preferential treatment now and then, its not racism. Its compensating for the fact that normally everyone but them get preferential treatment.

I know you can fight fire with fire, but to do so you must write off a portion of what you want to save. I don't buy doing that with human life, but I guess there are academics who do.

Riiiight, because taking away a tiny bit of the normal white privilege is messing with human lives. I guess those black people don't count as human lives then?

Look, as long as the education system has only a limited number of students it can accept, and therefor creates competition for spots, there will be people who want to get in but who won't. Its unfair for someone no matter what you do. But if one thing is unfair for white people once in a while, well, deal with it.

Also, even if you do make it too easy for a group to succeed can they? If you give them success on a silver platter, can they keep it? Or did they need to struggle with determination to get it to actually be successful?

Well, given that the 1% get success on a silver platter, and they keep getting richer, I'd say that yeah, its quite possible for them to keep succeeding. Indeed, having success has a cascading effect. If you are successful once, you get a confidence boost, and the people around you take notice. As a result they will both be more lenient about your mistakes and they will give you more opportunities to succeed again. Just think back to gym class. If you played basketball, who got passed the ball the most? The guy that works hard, or the guy with the reputation of being a good shot. And then ask yourself why that guy has a reputation of being a good shot? Because he scored the most? But in order to score, you first need to be passed the ball so you have an opportunity to score. Success is a self fulfilling prophecy.

That whole story about the people that work hard and with determination finally getting their success in the end is a load of nonsense. Just look at the people who run the world, the people that are loaded. They aren't the ones that worked hard their entire lives. It are the people born with wealthy parents, the people who created the right networks and met the right people.

In the end, the people that succeed are not the ones that worked the hardest, they are the ones that worked smartly.



Let me also be clear education isn't just the three r's. Education must be well rounded, it must include instilling a burning desire to learn. It has to include how to make your children better. It needs to even include some of the factors of The Million Dollar Success Plan. It isn't IQ but, determination that determines success.

Nope, determination is for suckers. Your work ethic is nonsense. The 1% is laughing their ass off behind your back for buying into this whole rat race nonsense because the only ones that profit from it are they. Work hard and you get nowhere. Work smart, and you win at life. Or redefine success along non material lines.


So here the system is trying to get students better prepared, but fails. Why is a big question. Is it a teaching issue? Is it a parenting issue? Go back an reread what I said about my teacher friend and what he faces in his classroom. Consider the comment above that is it the most determined that are successful, and that now there are calls to lower the standards.

Ah, but your friend forget that while determination might make the difference between a good and a bad student, once people have entered the workforce, non of that stuff matters. Your work isn't graded like a school paper, and promotions aren't handed out to the people that have the highest graded work. The workforce is not a meritocracy. The people that succeed are the ones that know the right people, that have formed the right networks, the ones that know how to look like hard workers at just the right moment. The people that succeed in the workforce are the people that during group projects don't do any of the work regarding content. Instead they make a flashy powerpoint and do the presentation. Least amount of effort, but for the teacher they appear as if they made a valuable contribution to the group effort. They aren't the freeriders, but they are also definitely not the ones that work the hardest.

The reality is education is the only tool we have that can end poverty. It also isn't capable of a 100% fix, and there is nothing else that can either. As long as our society and language has concepts of mine and yours poverty will exist. Some level of poverty is a requirement of our society. Unfortunately as long as we have classification and preference as concepts in our language there will be racism.

No, education will not solve poverty because education does teach or explicitly reward the skills you need to succeed on the job market. Again, we are talking about a system that rewards hard work, cooperation and integrity, when the job market rewards smart work, backstabbing and sociopathy.

The lesson? Stop looking for some magic bullet quick 100% fix. It doesn't exist and doing so only prolongs the problem by wasting resources, and creating false expectations which exacerbates the problem.

Hah, says the person who just claimed that the only solution against poverty is education. You are the one that treats education as a quick fix cure all solution.

Last word, education is an answer. It doesn't matter if you like it or dislike it. Like or dislike doesn't change validity.

Indeed, like or dislike doesn't affect validity. Although in this case, its more accurate to say that your like or dislike doesn't change the fact that your argument has no validity.
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Message 1681904 - Posted: 20 May 2015, 23:04:21 UTC - in response to Message 1681796.  

...

As most everyone who posts here is very far removed from the ghetto and attitudes of the ghetto it can be very hard to understand how much depression and lack of self worth is in that attitude. You might ask yourself why it was called the Great Depression and if that might have anything to do with the ghetto

...

Speak for yourself. I lived and worked in the ghetto for nearly 20 years. I had these issues up in my face on a daily basis.


Same here. I grew up in a neighborhood just a few steps above trailer-park trash. My mother always tried to give off the impression we were more well-off than we were. But I am quite familiar with the atmosphere and attitudes of the environment.
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Message 1681974 - Posted: 21 May 2015, 3:47:16 UTC - in response to Message 1681904.  
Last modified: 21 May 2015, 3:47:40 UTC

...

As most everyone who posts here is very far removed from the ghetto and attitudes of the ghetto it can be very hard to understand how much depression and lack of self worth is in that attitude. You might ask yourself why it was called the Great Depression and if that might have anything to do with the ghetto

...

Speak for yourself. I lived and worked in the ghetto for nearly 20 years. I had these issues up in my face on a daily basis.


Same here. I grew up in a neighborhood just a few steps above trailer-park trash. My mother always tried to give off the impression we were more well-off than we were. But I am quite familiar with the atmosphere and attitudes of the environment.


I'll one-up that. I grew up in a trailer park.
C'mon, Dull and Clyde, let's hear you now.
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Message 1682092 - Posted: 21 May 2015, 12:00:40 UTC

Like the article states, it's not known whether it is true or false, but...

"A racist walks into a crowded bar. He looks around and sees a black man sat in a corner.

The racist walks up to the bar, turns around and announces, “I’m going to buy everyone in this bar a free drink, except for that black guy over there!” Everybody is clapping and cheering for the racist and when he buys the last pint, the black man turns around, puts his thumb up and says, “Thanks mate!”

The racist is slightly puzzled by his reaction but doesn’t pay too much attention to it.

The next night, the racist goes into the same bar and again, there is a black guy sat in the corner, so the man, again, goes to the bar, turns around and says, “I’m going to buy everyone here a free drink, except for that black guy over there!”

The crowd are all ecstatic and are hugging and cheering the racist for his generosity.

When he buys the last pint, the black guy turns around, puts his thumb up and says, “Thanks mate!”

The racist scratches his head and asks the barman, “Why is that black guy thanking me when he’s the only person I’m not buying drinks for?”

“Well”, the barman responds, “He owns this place.“

...taking the book by its cover certainly proves the point in that situation.

Thanks Mate :-)
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Message 1682098 - Posted: 21 May 2015, 12:33:02 UTC - in response to Message 1682092.  

LOL
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Message 1682119 - Posted: 21 May 2015, 14:03:50 UTC

Long Haired, Super Good-Looking Stud Said:
I'll one-up that. I grew up in a trailer park.
C'mon, Dull and Clyde, let's hear you now.


Dr. HOHUM's Humble Home. Prof 'it' from 'it'.

Home Sweet Home.

Yep

May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!
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Message 1682153 - Posted: 21 May 2015, 16:06:14 UTC - in response to Message 1682133.  

I'll one-up that. I grew up in a trailer park.
C'mon, Dull and Clyde, let's hear you now.

Sarge...
Very unthinking, and clueless opinion of others, outside your Cloistered 'Thinking'.
Your adolescent 'Button Pushing', only works with those who share your 'Belief System'.
Could you, and others who share your 'Thinking', please enter the real, non-adolescent world?
Awaiting your usually Intelligent and Mature reply.

I like to add a thing.
When I was a kid there where some Romani (Gypsy) in our school.
One boy lived in a Caravan and I met him when we had to learn to swim.
The family lived in that Caravan, summer and Winter.
No electricty, water or heat.

Today many are coming from Romania and Bulgaria since they are EU members.
Same thing but now they cannot afford a Caravan...
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Message 1682168 - Posted: 21 May 2015, 16:50:02 UTC
Last modified: 21 May 2015, 17:19:43 UTC

Wow, I whistle and they come running! :)
P.S.-Clyde, when will you realize you're more cloistered? When will you realize I pushed no button? When will you realize I gave a prime example of why I do not fit the mold you think I fit? When will you realize that your posts represent the analytical level of 60 months?
Please, do demonstrate more of your "thinking" and "maturity" so that we can all do it right.
(Posting here isn't the pleasure you're looking for. You don;t want to sell us death sticks. You want to shut down your tablet and re-think your life and your posts.)
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Message 1682578 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 13:14:13 UTC - in response to Message 1682444.  
Last modified: 22 May 2015, 13:21:13 UTC

Today many are coming from Romania and Bulgaria since they are EU members.
Same thing but now they cannot afford a Caravan...

When you look at the figures for Bulgaria and Romania it is hardly surprising that nobody wants to live there. Plus also they are part of a North/South corridor of countries that form a buffer zone between Russia and Europe. So they have the Russian bear breathing down their necks all the time, wanting to pull their strings behind the scenes.

Why do you give links to Bulgaria and Romania to me?
I meet the romani peoples everytime I go shopping.
One girl I thought came from Romania comes from Bulgaria:)
Here there Calling themself the Roaming People as in nomads.
Some are still wearing traditional clothes.
A neighbour family from Finland does it.
Rosita Grönfors is one of 55,000 romani people living in Sweden.
https://translate.google.se/translate?sl=sv&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=sv&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fsverigesradio.se%2Fsida%2Fartikel.aspx%3Fprogramid%3D493%26artikel%3D4987690&edit-text=
Some years ago a romani woman was invited by the Swedish government to speak about their situation today in Europe.
When she entered, dressed in traditional clothes, Sheraton hotel she was denied to stay there even though she had a room booked by the Swedish government!
That's what I call VERY rascist!!!

And that romani family who lived in a Caravan in Stockholm about 50 years ago.
Cooking is not a problem. I Think they ate somewhere else.
One of the boys ate in our school.
Heating?
It's quite cozy in a confined space especially when you have a large family.
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Message 1682603 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 14:46:56 UTC - in response to Message 1682584.  

I see. So you are quite happy with underprivileged people having to huddle together for warmth? Perhaps they got taught lessons from Eskimos?

I see. You are racist.
Calling Inuits for Eskimos is the same as calling Romanis for Gypsies!!!!!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwRDEKL2GrY
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Message 1682604 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 14:57:21 UTC - in response to Message 1682603.  

[quote]I see. So you are quite happy with underprivileged people having to huddle together for warmth? Perhaps they got taught lessons from Eskimos?

I see. You are racist.
Calling Inuits for Eskimos is the same as calling Romanis for Gypsies!!!!!

I aint ever met Chris but I know he's no racist and he's alright . Im 100% sure he didn't mean anything racist by his post its a saying like "sell ice to the Eskimos " that's all
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Message 1682610 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 15:11:24 UTC - in response to Message 1682604.  

[quote]I see. So you are quite happy with underprivileged people having to huddle together for warmth? Perhaps they got taught lessons from Eskimos?

I see. You are racist.
Calling Inuits for Eskimos is the same as calling Romanis for Gypsies!!!!!

I aint ever met Chris but I know he's no racist and he's alright . Im 100% sure he didn't mean anything racist by his post its a saying like "sell ice to the Eskimos " that's all

Of course.
But here in Sweden its racism by law to call Romanis for Gypsies.
I wonder why because Romanis are often calling themself for Gypsies.
But it's certainly not Political Correct to in a public forum to speak of minorities in this way!
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Message 1682628 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 15:42:05 UTC - in response to Message 1682610.  

Janne over here if a cop comes to you and says stop swearing and using words like that , (not being politically correct) then you just say "f" off i'm a ozzie and we have a "f"ing colourful "f"ing langauge and i'll "f"ing say what the "f"ing words i "f"ing want , so go ahead ya "f"ing onk onk you "f"ing know it will get "f"ing thrown out of "f"ing court ya "f"ing Onk Onk but you must swear heaps so it sounds like your a true blue Australian as it has been thrown out of court for that reason we do have a colourfull language
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Message 1682635 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 16:10:18 UTC

What happens when you don't see colour


Reality Internet Personality
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Message 1682649 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 16:28:02 UTC - in response to Message 1682635.  

well Ess you might wish to Send that one to George Brandis the Attorney-General for watering down the anti discrimination act to use his words " it not against the law to be a bigot"

Beside i din't mean it the way you think i meant it as in how we have nick names for every nation , like pomms = english , kiwi = Newzealander , American = yank , Australian = skippy , greek, italian = wog

And Janne did say they call them self's Gipsy's so why is it offensive if that's what they call them self's
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Message 1682651 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 16:40:01 UTC - in response to Message 1682628.  

Janne over here if a cop comes to you and says stop swearing and using words like that , (not being politically correct) then you just say "f" off i'm a ozzie and we have a "f"ing colourful "f"ing langauge and i'll "f"ing say what the "f"ing words i "f"ing want , so go ahead ya "f"ing onk onk you "f"ing know it will get "f"ing thrown out of "f"ing court ya "f"ing Onk Onk but you must swear heaps so it sounds like your a true blue Australian as it has been thrown out of court for that reason we do have a colourfull language

Hrmmm.
Only for some months ago I walked the dog in unknown places.
Suddenly 4 hysterical persons shouted at me that I was trespassing their property and accussed me for vandalism and being a peeping Tom.
I was not. I was 30 yards from their precious property.
THREE police officers came and was very confused.
However one of them shouted at me and said:
"Where are you coming from? I can hear that you are not from here".
I answered that I live here. He said "shit in your pants" !!!!
I said "I dont Think a police officers should say so"
He said "1-0 to you" as if it was soccergame.

Sweden today:(
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Message 1682655 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 16:52:49 UTC - in response to Message 1682651.  


Hrmmm.
Only for some months ago I walked the dog in unknown places.
Suddenly 4 hysterical persons shouted at me that I was trespassing their property and accussed me for vandalism and being a peeping Tom.
I was not. I was 30 yards from their precious property.
THREE police officers came and was very confused.
However one of them shouted at me and said:
"Where are you coming from? I can hear that you are not from here".
I answered that I live here. He said "shit in your pants" !!!!
I said "I dont Think a police officers should say so"
He said "1-0 to you" as if it was soccergame.


Janne that's not what you where going on about you where going on about how it's wrong to call Romainians Gipsy's and why is it wrong when they call themself's gypsi's . So to clearify my statement if i was calling a italian a wog or a english man a pom and a cop came up to me and said stop talking like that then i would say what i said in the post . My ex father inlaw was maltese and called himself a wog

And yes that was wrong for a cop to say that i would not have been so polite
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Message 1682700 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 18:22:32 UTC - in response to Message 1682699.  

I will post this a second time....

Brits are called Limeys because back in Elizabeth 1st days, sailors got scurvry on long sea voyages due to lack of fresh food with vitamin C. So they took barrels of limes on board to make up for it. Brits are also called Poms because in times past when they murdered someone, they would be banished from England and sent off to Australia. Pom stands for Prisoner of her Majesty.

WHY? Do you "suspect" that the crunchers on here are too "simple" to understand what you post?
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Message 1682704 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 18:25:15 UTC - in response to Message 1682701.  

Your problem is that you intensely dislike anyone who disparages Britain.

Guilty

Since when was national pride a crime???

When continuing to stand proudly knowing that something is seriously wrong. I'm proud of Britain & always have been, unfortunately there is no pride towards those that govern.

It's also a "crime" when that pride leads to racist comments with a "superior" attitude.
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Message 1682740 - Posted: 22 May 2015, 19:28:41 UTC - in response to Message 1682699.  

I will post this a second time....

Brits are called Limeys because back in Elizabeth 1st days, sailors got scurvry on long sea voyages due to lack of fresh food with vitamin C. So they took barrels of limes on board to make up for it. Brits are also called Poms because in times past when they murdered someone, they would be banished from England and sent off to Australia. Pom stands for Prisoner of her Majesty.


I will post this a first time.
So, Brits are all sailors? All Brit sailors had scurvy? So, since limes didn't work, Elizabeth I sent them, as prisoners, to Australia, as original sinners and now all in Australia are scurvy infected sailors?

I doubt your short post or your longer posts would really explain why you bring it up or help anything.

Why mention the terms?

Repeating the slurs, with inadequate explanation of them and why it is silly to use them, keeps the slurs alive.
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