Even school kids in England know the full history of the US slave trade,

Point of order; the US of A wasn't even a thought when the British brought slaves to the new world. If you think the US started the slave trade I must question the British education system.

History in 1807 the US barred the British from bringing more slaves to the US.

Do British Schools teach how much money the British Textile Industry were making from the cotton, the slaves were picking?

Yes. It is one of the reasons we are aware of the dangers of runaway capitalism. Those cotton mills were hell on earth for the workers.

And if The South won. Slavery would have continued, and more money would roll into Britain?

The British Empire has a terrible history of occupation, slavery, piracy and genocide. Feel free to start a thread on it. I'll help you list all the horrors the British Empire inflicted on the globe. The legacy of which are still with us today.

Or do the British believe they would have demanded an end to Slavery?

There are no 'clean hands' in this.

Is there something missing in American Education about the whole UK abolishing slavery in 1807 thing?

This is the second post here where the Americans seem to have missed that.

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Reality Internet Personality

i see no reason that a belief in one or many gods require that darwin

must be wrong. i also see no compelling reason why there must be a designer to

make the world work.

i think that the world is a pretty neat place with or without gods.

now most religions say god is all knowing all powerful and omnipresent.

if this is so then by definition god is unknowable.

if god is unknowable than than all religion claiming to know the word of god

have taken an awful lot of liberty with what is or isn't right in the eye's of god.
nothing in science that i am aware of precludes the the possibility of one or many gods, science has also not weighed measured or proved god or god's.

now for me i am not sure that i have faith in intelligent design and he posts here.
as to a designer who must by definition be unknowable i classify him or it as just that, and pending further information as well.

if there is a designer or not makes no difference.

and as to inditing the entire US school system that is unfair some of us managed

to drop out before it turned our minds completely to jelly, allowing us to

pursue independent study.]

all hail thor.

Apart from the format...

Pretty good reasoning there!


Keep searchin',
Martin

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See new freedom: Mageia Linux
Take a look for yourself: Linux Format
The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3)

Even school kids in England know the full history of the US slave trade,

Point of order; the US of A wasn't even a thought when the British brought slaves to the new world. If you think the US started the slave trade I must question the British education system.

History in 1807 the US barred the British from bringing more slaves to the US.

I wonder if you are a troll, or just an illiterate buffoon. Nobody (but you) mentioned the US starting the slave trade. I think it goes back well before there was a Britain as well, but that is not relevant. I have to assume you post only to annoy, or you post from a position of grand ignorance.

BTW, based on my Canadian grade school education, I got Es' inference.

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Even school kids in England know the full history of the US slave trade,

Point of order; the US of A wasn't even a thought when the British brought slaves to the new world. If you think the US started the slave trade I must question the British education system.

History in 1807 the US barred the British from bringing more slaves to the US.

I wonder if you are a troll, or just an illiterate buffoon. Nobody (but you) mentioned the US starting the slave trade. I think it goes back well before there was a Britain as well, but that is not relevant. I have to assume you post only to annoy, or you post from a position of grand ignorance.

BTW, based on my Canadian grade school education, I got Es' inference.

Does your Canadian education also talk about how Britain led the Abolitionist movement? Just curious.

I also know in the UK we were taught about how Canada helped slaves to escape to freedom via the underground railroad.

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Reality Internet Personality

Does your Canadian education also talk about how Britain led the Abolitionist movement? Just curious.

I also know in the UK we were taught about how Canada helped slaves to escape to freedom via the underground railroad.

Going from memory (which is risky at my age) we were taught that the Abolitionist movement was started by British individuals and what we would today call NGOs, and resisted by the British government for some time. The Churches quickly caught on to the movement. (desperate attempt to stay on topic.) Similar case in British North America, before it became Canada.

Uncle Tom's Cabin, the real one, is about an hour's drive from my house. The British land registries for my county show free black land owners arriving in the 1790s, escaped from the rebellion down south. Guess which side they fought for in 1812?

Unfortunately, those same registries don't show the native people all this land was stolen from. Natives appear in the registry after the War of 1812, and the filed claims are still disputed in court today. As you said Es, we all have history to be ashamed of.

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...(desperate attempt to stay on topic.)...

mmm yeah..good point. We seem to have wondered off the beaten path somewhat. My bad.

To get us back on topic let's talk about evolution!

Algae Study Sheds Light On The Evolution Of Sexes

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Reality Internet Personality

We are both Atheists,

Doesn't being an atheist actually acknowledge something? Why be so emphatic about not believing in something? So you don't believe in god. What is this god you don't believe in?

Actually I have an open mind. That doesn't mean Agnostic. Just says 'Prove It'.

Nothing wrong with 'Prove it', nothing at all. What do you need for "burden of proof" seems---no wrong word, it's true that no one has asked that question.

What would you call proof?

Actual present day verifiable sighting(s), personal hearing/feeling, ... Can't think, right now, of anything else. There are probably more.

All I have seen was expected of you all, nothing new, move along people nothing to see at this car accident....

Do you ask for proof of a blackhole? Have you seen one? What is it that makes you believe that there is one at the center of our galaxy? How are you so damn sure there is such a thing as a blackhole? I have never seen one... By what right is such a thing even taught to our children in school? You cannot prove such a thing as a blackhole. Yet you fools believe in something that no one has ever seen, nor can prove. Prove it...

Have any of you ever seen Ab Lincoln? How do you know that he was a real person? Just because you have read about him in history books does not mean there ever was such a person as Ab Lincoln. Sure, we all know the stories about how he freed the black slaves from the greedy white cotton grower. BTW, the first slave was owned by another black man in this country, thought Id give you a heads up on that. Which leads me to believe that if such a thing as the first slave owner in my country was another black man, and this is not taught in our schools, why the hell should I believe the first president of the U.S. that came from my state of Illinois was even a real man in the first place? The history books have lied once, why would they not lie about there even being a president named Ab Lincoln? Prove it...


How the hell do you know for sure that there is such a thing a gravity? Perhaps the world sucks, ever thought of that? How are you going to prove that there is such a thing as gravity? There might be some other force at work here that you know nothing about. Just because you say there are only so many forces at work in the universe does not mean you have found all of them. Prove it...


I also don't see any proof of us ever being on the moon. Prove it...

Just because you think you have seen something does not mean you seen what you think you have seen. Ask any cop at a accident about what was seen and not seen.

"burden of proof"...

What do you think 12 who sit on a jury would say about the proof of the above problems? 12, normal, everyday people...

Proof #1,

Nothing happens by accident, so I believe. It is not mathematically possible for our universe to happen with all the variables (that we know of so far) so chance cannot enter as a factor. The time it would take for this universe to happen by chance is longer then the 13.7 billions years it has been around so far. I am more apt to just disappear from this rock and appear on the 4th one then a chance happening of our universe.
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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Repeating yourself again I.D.?

How can there be a "car accident" here when you don't believe in them?

Or has a screw come loose?

Cheers.

Repeating yourself again I.D.?

How can there be a "car accident" here when you don't believe in them?

Or has a screw come loose?

Cheers.

Not a one of you address the questions inferred and or outright asked. You all applied fallacy, as you just have again...

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Repeating yourself again I.D.?

How can there be a "car accident" here when you don't believe in them?

Or has a screw come loose?

Cheers.

Not a one of you address the questions inferred and or outright asked. You all applied fallacy, as you just have again...

I'm addressing your post, ID you don't distinguish between a theory which has some evidence to back it, ie black holes and a hypothesis with no evidence ie Intellegent Design.

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Repeating yourself again I.D.?

How can there be a "car accident" here when you don't believe in them?

Or has a screw come loose?

Cheers.

Not a one of you address the questions inferred and or outright asked. You all applied fallacy, as you just have again...

I'm addressing your post, ID you don't distinguish between a theory which has some evidence to back it, ie black holes and a hypothesis with no evidence ie Intellegent Design.

I'm not shocked the problem went right over your head, or you have ignored it....

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

The only problem I see is that you just don't know the difference between conjucture and evidence.

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The only problem I see is that you just don't know the difference between conjucture and evidence.

His church tells him there is evidence. As with most they don't question the "evidence" because they feel better thinking a god is watching out for them.

There is something to believing in a higher power that is good for some. The 12 step religion says they must turn themselves over to a higher power. That higher power can be anything though and it does work.

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At first I thought ID was just intellectually dishonest but over the last year or so I have come to believe he is mentally deranged, witness all the "vacations" he has taken. Only a mad man would keep doing the same thing and expect different results.

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At first I thought ID was just intellectually dishonest but over the last year or so I have come to believe he is mentally deranged, witness all the "vacations" he has taken. Only a mad man would keep doing the same thing and expect different results.

If one were to honestly consider the things that religion and religious people believe in the light of mental conditions, things such as believing that some invisible being controls their life, that this invisible being has and is communicating with them ... it might remind you of David Berkowitz. Now I realize a lot of religious people say these things, but they don't actually believe them. It is the ones that believe it, the delusion of invisible beings and that they communicate with them, that are potentially dangerous, like a Pope saying have a crusade and kill all Muslims.

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The only problem I see is that you just don't know the difference between conjucture and evidence.

His church tells him there is evidence. As with most they don't question the "evidence" because they feel better thinking a god is watching out for them.

There is something to believing in a higher power that is good for some. The 12 step religion says they must turn themselves over to a higher power. That higher power can be anything though and it does work.

I knew a person who did the 12 step program. Teaching people that they are not responsible for their own issues and therefore they need to give in to a higher power that has a plan for them is actually more harmful than good. Also, when trying to measure the helpfulness of teaching people this through companies that teach it like AA, they refuse to release any success rate info because they know that what they teach isn't what helps, but they are merely hope merchants hinged on people's ability to believe in themselves and their want to live a better life. The actual believing in a higher power has nothing to do with their success.

At first I thought ID was just intellectually dishonest but over the last year or so I have come to believe he is mentally deranged, witness all the "vacations" he has taken. Only a mad man would keep doing the same thing and expect different results.

I wouldn't call him a mad man, very convinced about his ideas though.

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rOZZ
Music
Pictures

At first I thought ID was just intellectually dishonest but over the last year or so I have come to believe he is mentally deranged, witness all the "vacations" he has taken. Only a mad man would keep doing the same thing and expect different results.

a direct quote from alcoholics anonymous

as to turning things over to a higher power,

having been there i think this is more about letting go of things we are

obsessing about and can not change though you may be right and it does work even

if the higher power you turn these things over to is your higher self.

as to id yes i have faith that black holes exist but the path to this belief is

paved with testable things and i have faith because i do not yet have all the

math i would need to know though i have tested what i could with the math i know

that has so far checked out.

this can not be said for god's.

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as to turning things over to a higher power,

having been there i think this is more about letting go of things we are

obsessing about and can not change though you may be right and it does work even

if the higher power you turn these things over to is your higher self.

as to id yes i have faith that black holes exist but the path to this belief is

paved with testable things and i have faith because i do not yet have all the

math i would need to know though i have tested what i could with the math i know

that has so far checked out.

Almost like I could've written that myself!

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rOZZ
Music
Pictures

You all believe in things you cannot see, or prove for that matter. That is the point, the point you all glossed over with very strange logic that is for sure called fallacy. I really don't feel the need to point out what kind of fallacy, but never the less, fallacy.

I asked Clyde what he needed for "burden of proof". He wanted to question the Causal Agent, as would I. But, as I also pointed out, people believe things everyday of the week that they cannot see. So, just because I cannot provide the Causal Agent for you all to question does this mean there is no Causal Agent? I cannot see a blackhole, BTW it's opaque (if you want to call that a color), not black, yet I believe there is such a thing by the "preponderance of evidence". I believe in Abe Lincoln, that he was a real person anyhow, by the preponderance of evidence, not because I can see him and question him. I believe in gravity, because the math works and by the preponderance of evidence. I believe we sent men to the moon and our machines far beyound that moon. And I believe the cop at an accident will get to the truth in time as to who was at fault because he will use logic and science to get to the bottom of it.

We deduce a opaquehole in space by what goes on around it. We see stars whipping around a point in space that has a huge gravitywell. We deduce a Causal Agent in much the same way, by what goes on around nature, such as the math of chance and many other things.

Mad man? LMAO! Once again I am not left or right of this issue. I'm at the center. A overwhelming amount of people believe in a Creator and they do so for good reason. There is both logic and science on their side.

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...