I think it is wonderful that you are
willing to take the effort provide me with a sober
considered explanation of how you understand this issue.

LOL!!! What a charming way to say "let us agree to disagree". But happily, it does sound like we agree on several things. (And as an aside, whatever makes you think that I am "sober"? I found ripe prickly pear cactus fruits at our Farmers Market last Saturday and tonight I turned them into margaritas to go with dinner.)

I just have a hard time accepting that a diet that humans
evolved with for 90% of our time here on earth or so is
no longer is considered as healthy as one we have had
only recently.

Funny you should mention that. We evolved to eat mostly plants, and that is probably one of the many reasons why farming ultimately "won" over hunting and gathering.

Our species comes out of Africa. Savannas are ecosystems composed of grasses and sedges, spotted with the occasional tree. Savanna grasses do well in hot dry regions because, to take up carbon from the atmosphere, they use a specific pathway called C4. This set of reactions is miserly with carbon and water.

Our species moved into Europe. In wetter ecosystems woody vegetation and trees grow and these plants tend to take up carbon from the atmosphere using a specific pathway called C3, which requires much more water.

Dramatic swings between wet and dry climates, wherever our ancestors lived, killed off some of our early ancestors and provided evolutionary pressures that pushed other ancestors towards modern traits that we still possess today. The most adaptive trait our species has is probably our ability to eat just about anything.

The typical modern American diet of soft drinks, cow meat, Doritos and candy is largely derived from corn, a C4 grass. When you say "90% of our time here on earth" I assume that you are going back to our early ancestors in the genus Homo. Guess what?!!! Early members of our genus were designed to eat everything... generally to the tune of 65% C3 and 35% C4 things. All that matters in the "evolution game" is that you survive long enough to reproduce yourself and ensure the survival of your offspring. Our early ancestors could have done this on a diet of burgers and Doritos. (Now most of us would like to live much longer than 30 or so years, so yes, we have to do things differently.)

We are such an amazing species!!! We don't live in our environments, we eat our environments!!! When you say "a diet that humans evolved with 90% of our time here on earth" you make it sound like we consistently ate a certain way. But actually, we ate whatever we found, hunted or managed to grow, wherever we happened to be. Our species has populated the earth, from our planet's poles down to the equator, probably because we are two things - smart and good eaters.

Don't get me wrong. I am certainly not advocating a diet of burgers and Doritos, even though most of us can digest these foods just fine. We know that for optimal health and longevity we need plant-heavy, balanced diets full of moderation. All I am saying is that genetically we are pretty much adapted to eat whatever is in front of us, whether it comes to us via hunting and gathering or via farming. Hunters and gatherers ate a paleo-diet because that was what was in front of them. Early farmers ate whatever their community could grow because that was what was in front of them.

I suspect that the problem with our modern diet is NOT that we have given up eating spit-roasted game and a handful of unripe berries for breakfast and NOT that we are farming and eating the wrong types of grains. I would guess that the REAL problem is that we are eating too darn much of what is so conveniently in front of us.

I just have a hard time accepting that a diet that humans
evolved with for 90% of our time here on earth or so is
no longer is considered as healthy as one we have had
only recently.

Funny you should mention that. We evolved to eat mostly plants, and that is probably one of the many reasons why farming ultimately "won" over hunting and gathering.

Our species comes out of Africa. Savannas are ecosystems composed of grasses and sedges, spotted with the occasional tree. Savanna grasses do well in hot dry regions because, to take up carbon from the atmosphere, they use a specific pathway called C4. This set of reactions is miserly with carbon and water.

Our species moved into Europe. In wetter ecosystems woody vegetation and trees grow and these plants tend to take up carbon from the atmosphere using a specific pathway called C3, which requires much more water.

Dramatic swings between wet and dry climates, wherever our ancestors lived, killed off some of our early ancestors and provided evolutionary pressures that pushed other ancestors towards modern traits that we still possess today. The most adaptive trait our species has is probably our ability to eat just about anything.

The typical modern American diet of soft drinks, cow meat, Doritos and candy is largely derived from corn, a C4 grass. When you say "90% of our time here on earth" I assume that you are going back to our early ancestors in the genus Homo. Guess what?!!! Early members of our genus were designed to eat everything... generally to the tune of 65% C3 and 35% C4 things. All that matters in the "evolution game" is that you survive long enough to reproduce yourself and ensure the survival of your offspring. Our early ancestors could have done this on a diet of burgers and Doritos. (Now most of us would like to live much longer than 30 or so years, so yes, we have to do things differently.)

We are such an amazing species!!! We don't live in our environments, we eat our environments!!! When you say "a diet that humans evolved with 90% of our time here on earth" you make it sound like we consistently ate a certain way. But actually, we ate whatever we found, hunted or managed to grow, wherever we happened to be. Our species has populated the earth, from our planet's poles down to the equator, probably because we are two things - smart and good eaters.

Don't get me wrong. I am certainly not advocating a diet of burgers and Doritos, even though most of us can digest these foods just fine. We know that for optimal health and longevity we need plant-heavy, balanced diets full of moderation. All I am saying is that genetically we are pretty much adapted to eat whatever is in front of us, whether it comes to us via hunting and gathering or via farming. Hunters and gatherers ate a paleo-diet because that was what was in front of them. Early farmers ate whatever their community could grow because that was what was in front of them.

I suspect that the problem with our modern diet is NOT that we have given up eating spit-roasted game and a handful of unripe berries for breakfast and NOT that we are farming and eating the wrong types of grains. I would guess that the REAL problem is that we are eating too darn much of what is so conveniently in front of us.

I agree Angela, also some people don't get that people with lighter skin are a genetic and beneficial mutation, beneficial in cloudier climates with more trees, plus except for those who are of pure African ancestry, everyone else on earth has about 1% to 4% Neandertal DNA in them and some from a previously unknown species as well, according to recent information that I read, it seems Humans were a bit friendly in the deep past, here and there. Of course no matter what the skin, hair or eye color is, there is currently only 1 species of Human on Earth now, since all the other naked apes are extinct. All humans are potentially equal to each other, barring problems like disabilities, which can and does happen, whether by birth or by accident.

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The T1 Trust, PRR T1 Class 4-4-4-4 #5550, 1 of America's First HST's

Oh Vic... your last line is going to enrage Blurf, and justifiably so.

Oh prickly pear margaritas... why do you have to taste so good? G-R-O-A-N!!!

Climbing back up onto the diet and exercise wagon now... Brushing off the dirt from the rut where the wagon rolled back and forth over me several times... Dragging myself into the kitchen to prepare a sensible breakfast...

G-R-O-A-N!!!

Oh Vic... your last line is going to enrage Blurf, and justifiably so.

Oh prickly pear margaritas... why do you have to taste so good? G-R-O-A-N!!!

Climbing back up onto the diet and exercise wagon now... Brushing off the dirt from the rut where the wagon rolled back and forth over me several times... Dragging myself into the kitchen to prepare a sensible breakfast...

G-R-O-A-N!!!

Well it wasn't meant to, things do happen, I tried to word that as best that I could. My apologies to anyone who I have or may have offended, Blurf included.

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The T1 Trust, PRR T1 Class 4-4-4-4 #5550, 1 of America's First HST's

My new diet seems to be working some what......
Still holding that half pound loss.

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My favorite board bulldozer has been pushing me to start a new thread.

See you all over in the next one!