Please, I beg you---elaborate.

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Put into context of this thread, Climate Change, we can see from the tilt of out planet our climate changes with 4 seasons. I see this by design, not man made.

If you wish to think about carbon, well we have a carbon cycle that locks back up the extra carbon not needed, not needed for life, intelligent life being the pinacle of that design.

What kind of person are you? Are you the ones who see's signs and everything is for reason. Or are you one who lives by the rules of chance and everything is by a cosmic roulette game? You know how I love the nutshell. And you also know I don't play three card monty... I have looked at both sides. Many here refuse and therefore have given up on science all together for the---?----dogma of modern science/Neo-Darwinism.

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Put into context of this thread, Climate Change, we can see from the tilt of out planet our climate changes with 4 seasons. I see this by design, not man made.

If you wish to think about carbon, well we have a carbon cycle that locks back up the extra carbon not needed, not needed for life, intelligent life being the pinacle of that design.

What kind of person are you? Are you the ones who see's signs and everything is for reason. Or are you one who lives by the rules of chance and everything is by a cosmic roulette game? You know how I love the nutshell. And you also know I don't play three card monty... I have looked at both sides. Many here refuse and therefore have given up on science all together for the---?----dogma of modern science/Neo-Darwinism.

Hi ID :)

The earth's axial tilt is most definitely what causes our seasons. But in some places, what may seem small fluctuations to us in, for example, the length of our seasons, often has catastrophic effects on insects, birds etc.

Some species of birds rely on raising their young on a particular species of caterpillar grub - a "relationship" which has in fact in the past been beneficial to both these animals, and indirectly to us. By keeping caterpillar numbers down, those caterpillars (whether by accident or a little more wisdom) that survive, can fatten faster and have a much better chance of completing their life cycle and breeding the next generation thanks to there being less competition for resources.

Just a small shift in seasonal averages throws that relationship out of synch. The bird lays its eggs earlier because of a warmer start to the spring for example, but the larvae don't hatch until the sun is it a particular height above the horizon. The bird has nothing to feed it's young and cannot move them elsewhere. The babies die in the nest, the parent's leave, the caterpillars hatch out, their natural predator has gone, the farmer/gardener suffers - we pay a cost. That continues for several springs in a row - farmers start spraying their crops, other birds and small animals are effected etc, etc

What is the sign we should be seeing there? Or is the above scenario cosmic/planetary chance? Do we sit back and let one intelligent design after another die because they were not the pinnacle of design and they did not foresee how stupid it was to rely on one food source for their young just because that always worked for them in the past? I may be wrong, but that sounds a little Darwinian to me. If there is a possibility that there is something we are doing that we could change that would help give all of earth's creatures, intelligently designed or not, a chance to continue contributing to our planetary home, surely we should be looking into it as scientifically as we can... from all angles?

You have looked at all sides and your belief has helped you to do that. To see the blueprint of Intelligent Design comes easier to some than others and does require faith. To see a metereorite/asteroid about to smack you between the eyes does not. So, whilst we may doubt our scientific boffins's ability to actually save us from one should one turn up, we don't discourage them from theorising and testing hypotheses. Okay we have to keep a close eye on them definitely, because we're all capable of making terrible decisions at times :) but would that be us attempting to interfere with the designer's plan for us or part of the designers plan for us to extend the knowledge and abilities that were granted to us when we were given the gift of our brains? Would we be responding to a sign, or to a game of cosmic roulette where the odds are suddenly stacked against us? I think it's possible for all differences to be put aside when we all want the same thing. I just don't think we're very good at it yet. :)

Anyway, just some more musings from my brain :) Hope everyone's been having or is having or is about to have a lovely day! :) xxx from Anniet (I'm sorry, I'm quite happy today, because my other half came out of hospital - yay!!!)

If the intelligent here can't get along, what hope does that give us for the rest of the world.

Me LIkeee

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On Topic: I DENY Climate...

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May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!

If the intelligent here can't get along, what hope does that give us for the rest of the world.

Me LIkeee

' '

On Topic: I DENY Climate...

I also think climate denier is a misnomer. They should be called science deniers.

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Reality Internet Personality

ANNIET

Repeating:

Your Post may have been off target. But it was Beautiful.

:) Thank you Clyde! I do wander about sometimes - so it's good to be reminded not to. And I will just add, that we are all definitely part of the carbon cycle - which is what I forgot to say first time round :)

I have had 12 posts removed in three days

And you are still here.

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Which proves this point....

As evidenced by these boards, there are MEN & then there are men

Many it seems fall into the small category as seen by their tantrums.

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So... Trying to follow this thread...

Is the 'drift' for the last few posts that Climate Denial is due to a lack of intelligence and an excess of American religions?


Also, do we need to reign in the dishonest and anti-competitive FUD that is being pushed under the guise of Marketing and 'free Markets'?...

After all, the very negative FUD being thrown against everything green is a form of anti-competitive practice...


All on our only one planet,
Martin

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See new freedom: Mageia Linux
Take a look for yourself: Linux Format
The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3)

Is this another reason why the dirty polluting Fossil Fuels industries are using Tobacco Industry Marketing 'tricks'?


Air pollution linked to seven million deaths globally

Seven million people died as a result of air pollution in 2012, the World Health Organization estimates.

Its findings suggest a link between air pollution and heart disease, respiratory problems and cancer. One in eight global deaths were linked with air pollution, making it "the world's largest single environmental health risk"...


All on our only one planet,
Martin

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See new freedom: Mageia Linux
Take a look for yourself: Linux Format
The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3)

Not really. Most more than likely agree that something needs to be done. However, the problem is that what is being forced down our throats by those wanting us to be all green are sitting pretty in their ivory towers....

...without any thought or consideration for those at the bottom of that tower where their misguided policies are impacting harshly.

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Meanwhile, the press stir up controversy where there is none for the sake of playing Nero's advocate for the sake of controversy sales:


Dissent among scientists over key climate impact report

Senior scientists and government officials are meeting in Japan to agree a critical report on the impact of global warming...

... Last September in Stockholm, they produced a summary on the physical science of climate change, arguing that it was real, and humans were the "dominant cause". Now in Yokohama, the second IPCC working group will set out the impact that rising temperatures will have on humans, animals and ecosystems over the next century. The scientists and government officials will agree on the exact wording of the final summary over the next few days...

A leaked draft of the summary, seen by the BBC, points to a range of negative effects that will, in some instances, be "irreversible"...

Prof Richard Tol is an economist: ..."The message in the first draft was that through adaptation and clever development these were manageable risks, but it did require we get our act together," he told BBC News. "This has completely disappeared from the draft now, which is all about the impacts of climate change and the four horsemen of the apocalypse. This is a missed opportunity."

... The report is shaping up to be more nuanced, with far more emphasis on adaptation than the last one in 2007.

According to many familiar with the text, it is about managing the risk rather than waiting to see if things get worse. "We are going to frame the issue of climate change as more of a distributional issue," said Dr Petersen.

"It's not doom and gloom but an additional stress on countries that are already severely stressed."



And note there is also the recently publicized report about how for business and economists it is for them "business as usual" until there is a bitter final collapse... Despite the present assumed doctrine of continued 'growth' being very obviously unsustainable.


Which way do you want to go?

All on our only one planet,
Martin

---

See new freedom: Mageia Linux
Take a look for yourself: Linux Format
The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3)

So... Trying to follow this thread...

Is the 'drift' for the last few posts that Climate Denial is due to a lack of intelligence and an excess of American religions?

Could it be that you fail to understand the Christian Faith? We are charged to be good stewards of the planet. Dumping trash in the sea as well as on land is not being the good steward.

Killing animals for the fun of it is not being the good steward. ect, ect, ect...

Also, do we need to reign in the dishonest and anti-competitive FUD that is being pushed under the guise of Marketing and 'free Markets'?...

You can try but that is a natural function of mankind. If there is a market there will be trade. You mean force, that is your true meaning here, you want the government gun. I see your intent if no one else does...

After all, the very negative FUD being thrown against everything green is a form of anti-competitive practice...

Once again, the market...

Once again I see nothing but billions of dollars given to friends who helped the last president get elected. That money might as well have been burned. It was redistributed alright.... :-)

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Off topic, I know, but I like your new profile ID:)

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rOZZ
Music
Pictures

Carbon cycle! LMAO!

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

One carbon cycle (data 2000 as far as I can tell)

According to the noaa:

An extra burden of CO2 in the atmosphere will remain for a very long time, of the order of thousands of years, if we have to rely on the natural mechanisms of erosion and sedimentation to process it.

I know not everyone trusts the noaa, but fossil fuels are called "fossil" for a reason.

Here's another one from 2008


And one from 2013


I tried to get one more up to date, but keep getting pictures of bicycles, which is definitely not on topic. :/

I was going to mention ocean acidification and it's potential impact on additional carbon release (from an area of our planet far vaster than what we can walk on) should those inhabiting it begin to die in significant numbers, but I won't here - because it's futuristic, and I haven't studied it enough, and you never know, algae blooms might sort that out (that's not my idea by the way - but it's got me intrigued). :)

Cheeze and Rice! Carbon Cycle!!!

I'll add here that there is a lag time of carbon release during our sunspot cycle also, not due to man. Also NOT added to your wonderful example of the carbon cycle!!!

No, I don't trust the numbers, we are talking about the government and the wealth and power that comes with. But I agree with the logical premise. I prefer all the variables. Any other variables left out?

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Well I can't see any mention of carbon release that might come from a volcanic eruption... which would be quite a big variable increase I think... but we of course don't have any control over those. Net atmospheric carbon increasing by 4 gigatonnes a year does sound a lot, if it will take 1000's of years for the planet to safely lock it away. Goodness knows what an injection of volcanic activity might add! :/ So it's just as well we have all those trees...

.......................

sorry... just popped over to www.worldometers.info (won't post it as a link cos it has a lot of off-topic stuff - I'm learning a little about staying on topic aren't I! At least I think I am! :))

1 197 539 ... no sorry 1 197 545 (oh good grief it's gone up again!... sorry, I can't type fast enough to keep up with it) hectares of forest lost this year.

:( Is that another variable?

I did see your post:

Could it be that you fail to understand the Christian Faith? We are charged to be good stewards of the planet. Dumping trash in the sea as well as on land is not being the good steward.

That is very true ID.

Many without Christian, or any other religious faith for that matter, also strive to be good stewards of the planet too. We all want the same thing for it.

All sides have to beware being the puppet of others with less than pure ideals. Am I correct in thinking the new Catholic Pope, Pope Francis recognises that too? And now I think I'm way off topic :) Sorry!

I'm glad you liked the carbon cycle pictures though - there were loads to choose from! Some didn't seem to show as much detail as these - and others - at a quick glance - seemed to mostly blame animals for all the carbon in the air, which is definitely off-topic as far as I am concerned :)

Best wishes, Anniet

Excellent point! Volcanic activity.

Both, the sun's release [AFTER a sunspot-cycle, remember lag time changers Love to mislead people...] and volcanos could and DO easy out weigh what little we put into the air.

With a incomplete imput of the variables we get mucked up science. Lot's of mucking going on with this topic!

There are more...

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Must not conflict resolve by suggesting that someone should go sit on an ice pick...

Well I can't see any mention of carbon release that might come from a volcanic eruption... ...

Except that along with the CO2 volcanoes also put a lot of ash and particulates into the air so they have a net cooling effect.

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Reality Internet Personality