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NSA silences the web & newspapers!
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ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20283 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
We've so far had two email services in effect closed down by the NSA... Now a very prominent site has been forced to close: Groklaw legal site shuts over fears of NSA email snooping Pamela Jones shuts award-winning site, saying concerns that messages could be read mean that 'there is now no shield from forced exposure' The award-winning legal analysis site Groklaw is shutting because its founder says that "there is no way" to continue to run it without using secure email - and that the threat of NSA spying means that could be compromised. ... ... "the simple truth is, no matter how good the motives might be for collecting and screening everything we say to one another, and no matter how "clean" we all are ourselves from the standpont of the screeners, I don't know how to function in such an atmosphere. I don't know how to do Groklaw like this," she writes. ... Surveillance concerns bring an end to crusading site Groklaw A legally-informed Web site critical of lawsuits from the SCO Group, Apple, Oracle, and patent trolls shuts down because its founder says e-mail can't be protected from government scrutiny. ... ... Citing concerns about privacy and government surveillance, Pamela Jones is shutting down her site Groklaw that for years took on what she and vocal fans saw as wrongheaded legal action... Note that without any privacy, and without the freedom to freely question, we are all open to being exploited and abused... All from the USA? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30649 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
What part of 1984 don't you understand? |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20283 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
And now, looks like also the newspapers are being threatened and hounded to force their silence: Guardian teams up with New York Times for future Snowden GCHQ coverage Faced with a mounting backlash from UK authorities, The Guardian newspaper has announced that it will collaborate with The New York Times to release further documents detailing the activities of the UK's Government Communications Headquarters... ... The move comes after CCHQ agents reportedly smashed up hard drives and computers belonging to Guardian staffers... In a separate incident, the Metropolitan Police detained David Michael Miranda, the partner of Guardian journalist Glenn Greenwald, for nearly nine hours in Heathrow Airport, citing the Terrorism Act. Miranda's mobile phone, his laptop, and several memory sticks were seized, and Miranda was reportedly compelled to turn over passwords that gave police access to computer and mobile phone... ... By partnering with a US newspaper to release UK-related documents, however, The Guardian hopes to gain the advantage of the strong free-speech protections afforded by the First Amendment of the US Constitution. In particular, US courts have held that "prior restraint" – the suppression of speech before the speech has actually taken place – is unconstitutional except where such speech might have serious consequences for national security. Information regarding UK government policies, however classified, is unlikely to meet that standard in the US... And we all meekly allow this to happen? Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30649 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
By partnering with a US newspaper to release UK-related documents, however, The Guardian hopes to gain the advantage of the strong free-speech protections afforded by the First Amendment of the US Constitution. I remember being berated by the UK's posters here for saying the same, using Mr. Churchill, "The United States is a land of free speech. Nowhere is speech freer — not even here where we sedulously cultivate it even in its most repulsive form." Seems now the UK'ers are understanding that is true. It is why Assange isn't a wanted man in the USA. |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30649 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
The fact that they now have to publish in the USA, should be taken as a big hint that they are not wanted in the UK. Deciding what is right and proper; what's next? An appeal to natural law? |
bobby Send message Joined: 22 Mar 02 Posts: 2866 Credit: 17,789,109 RAC: 3 |
The Guardian is read by pseudo intellectuals who think they ought to run the country, and tut tut over their muesli at the latest news not to their liking, whilst looking over their shoulder for big brother. The fact that they now have to publish in the USA, should be taken as a big hint that they are not wanted in the UK. Ever read Tropic of Ruislip? You do like those stereotypes don't you? The "Yes, Minister" quote was: The Daily Mirror is read by people who think they run the country. The Guardian is read by people who think they ought to run the country. The Times is read by the people who actually do run the country. The Daily Mail is read by the wives of the people who run the country. The Financial Times is read by people who own the country. The Morning Star is read by people who think the country ought to be run by another country. And The Daily Telegraph is read by people who think that it already is. BTW the NYT is not a "strong left wing paper", Britannica calls it the "newspaper of record in the United States". Some may regard the NYT as left wing, though "strong left" is not deserved by it. As I recall The Guardian is the newspaper that uncovered police bribery by journalists from News International as part of their investigation into those same journalists' phone hacking activities. I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ... |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20283 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
... why Assange isn't a wanted man in the USA. REALLY?! The whole reason he has been imprisoned for over a year in London is due to the farcical requests for him to be taken to Sweden(?) without charge merely for 'questioning' and the very real expectation that the USA will hijack him from their or somewhere en-route... Go against the 'establishment' or merely cause a little embarrassment and it appears the laws are vague enough to be interpreted any way that is convenient. However for Edward Snowdon for the tricks perpetrated against him, it appears the USA are not bound by any laws in any case... The world is what we allow it to be... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
bobby Send message Joined: 22 Mar 02 Posts: 2866 Credit: 17,789,109 RAC: 3 |
... why Assange isn't a wanted man in the USA. That's the claim, one that the Swedish authorities have denied. As for farcical, if there's a farce, it seems from this recounting of events, Assange is the one that turned it into one. I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ... |
bobby Send message Joined: 22 Mar 02 Posts: 2866 Credit: 17,789,109 RAC: 3 |
My observation that they are not wanted in the UK was based on the establishments reaction to them threatening to publish state secrets. That seems to me to be a clear indication that if they choose to take that course of action, they wouldn't be allowed to do it in the UK. Not everybody in the UK assumes that the all establishment actions are justified. While you may care little about government intrusions into your private matters, there are others that do. The Guardian is likely wanted by them. I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ... |
Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24879 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
there are others that do. The Guardian is likely wanted by them. Get your pills ready...totally agree..... Greedy Bankers, Thieving MP's, Dodgy Journalists, corrupt snivel serpents, tax evading corporations...... |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30649 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
... why Assange isn't a wanted man in the USA. I believe it is called a publicity stunt. Of course, it is a bit hard to call a press conference if you are serving 2 to 4 years in a prison cell, and upon release are deported back to you home country with a record as a sex offender so you can't get visas to travel any more. For a unemployed homeless Lothario I could see that as a bit of a problem. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20283 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
... why Assange isn't a wanted man in the USA. All the more hard when there is no evidence of any sex offense... All a convenient setup to have him effectively imprisoned in any case? That is a very strange "publicity stunt"... Our world is what we allow it to be... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Gary Charpentier Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 30649 Credit: 53,134,872 RAC: 32 |
... why Assange isn't a wanted man in the USA. But there is. At least enough for the prosecutor to want him arrested for a formal interrogation, the immediate step before issuance of a trial date. Your problem is that you don't believe it is evidence, that is for a jury to decide. Your problem is you don't understand the Swedish Criminal Justice system. It is a mix of French Common Law, where judges investigate, and English Common Law where judges try cases investigated by prosecutors. Think of it more this way, the formal questioning would be like him being compelled to appear in front of a Grand Jury, who as soon as they finish asking him questions votes an indictment. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20283 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
So the innocent have nothing to fear? After David Miranda we now know where this leads... You've had your fun: now we want the stuff back. With these words the British government embarked on the most bizarre act of state censorship of the internet age... Be very afraid?... Politics is what we allow it to be... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24879 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
So the innocent have nothing to fear? After David Miranda we now know where this leads... Part 2 |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20283 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
So the innocent have nothing to fear? After David Miranda we now know where this leads... A rather dubious snippet from that: ... Under the proposal, data could be gathered from records held by the Post Office, local government and credit checking agencies... Looks like more people will know our presumed private details than we ourselves have access to! Chilling. Politics is what we allow it to be... Dare you be 'different'?... Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19060 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
Is there a problem with most people from the top politicians downwards to the man on the street in that they don't know enough about intelligence gathering a a means to avoid wars or if the diplomacy fails how to win the war. I remind you of “...One who acts thus is no leader of men, no present help to his cause, no master of victory. Thus, what enables the wise commander to strike and conquer, and achieve things beyond the reach of ordinary men, is foreknowledge. Now this foreknowledge cannot be elicited from spirits; it cannot be obtained inductively from experience, nor by any deductive calculation. Knowledge of the enemy's dispositions can only be obtained from other men.†Sun Wu’s The Art of War A country needs to gather intelligence all the time, at times of peace and war, if you want to survive. You need to collect intelligence to avoid incidents like 9/11 and 7/7, where especially for 9/11 the intelligence agencies failed big time mainly because of the political climate. You also need to collect intelligence in times of peace so that you don't get surprised when you friend becomes your enemy. Who were the UK's closest allies and antagonists pre-1900. Clues what nationality was the Royal Family and who did we kick in 1805 and 1815. Then what happened after 1910, who did we fight and who were our allies, until 1945. And since then who has been our main problem concerning Europe and the EU. So Political leaders shouldn't be surprised that they are under surveillance, and didn't we all require the governments to do all it could to stop terrorist attacks. Maybe at the moment the intelligence services have overstepped the mark, but that surely is the fault of their overseers, the politicians. But how do you extract one very small file out of an encrypted zip folder, without gathering the rest? |
W-K 666 Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 19060 Credit: 40,757,560 RAC: 67 |
A good post WK. Thanks, in that I forgot to mention John Nott, Secretary of State for Defence in 1982 and Foreign Secretary Lord Carrington, over intelligence failures about Argentina. |
Sirius B Send message Joined: 26 Dec 00 Posts: 24879 Credit: 3,081,182 RAC: 7 |
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