agp ati card, will either of these work with Bonic?


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Message boards : Number crunching : agp ati card, will either of these work with Bonic?

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Profile Rae of Quakesville,CHCH NZ
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Message 1400395 - Posted: 8 Aug 2013, 2:49:38 UTC
Last modified: 8 Aug 2013, 2:50:29 UTC

Hi. I am upgrading an old Dell computer. The motherboard has an AGP port on it.
The desktop runs windows 7. Will either of the following Graphics cards be recognised by Bonic for crunching?

256MB Asus A9550GE/TD/256M (RadeonĀ® 9550) AGP 4X/8X graphics card.

ATI Radeon X800 XT Platinum Edition Bus Type AGP 8x
Vista Capability This video card is capable of running Windows Vista, without any of
the new major features, and is suitable for Vista Home Basic.
Graphics Processor / Vendor ATI Radeon X800 XT
RAMDAC 400.0 MHz
Max Resolution 2048 x 1536 at 85.0 Hz
Max Monitors Supported 2.0
Interfaces 1.0 x DVI-I - 15 pin HD D-Sub (HD-15) ( On supplied cable ),
1.0 x S-video output - RCA ( On supplied cable ),
1.0 x VGA - 4 pin mini-DIN ( With adapter ),
1.0 x Composite video output - 29 pin combined DVI,
1.0 x VGA - 15 pin HD D-Sub (HD-15)
API Supported DirectX 9.0,
OpenGL 2.0

Memory

Video Memory Installed 256.0 MB
256-bit memory interface
Technology GDDR3 SDRAM
Effective Clock Speed 1.12 GHz

if either or both of these are suitible, which 1 would be the better choice?

Thank you in advance
Rae
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Message 1400421 - Posted: 8 Aug 2013, 3:54:05 UTC

The main problem is if the cards support Open CL or not (this is the language the apps for the ATI cards is written in). The second problem is the amount of GPU memory. To crunch BOINC, 256 MB of on board memory may bot be enough.

Your other option is that there are suitable PCI cards available with low end NVidia chips in them, but you'd probably have to mail order them from the US or Europe.

T.A.

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Message 1400427 - Posted: 8 Aug 2013, 4:13:54 UTC

Neither of those cards support OpenCL or CAL. They were made before graphics processing took off.
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Message 1400435 - Posted: 8 Aug 2013, 4:36:15 UTC - in response to Message 1400395.

The third problem is that for OpenCL to be used with an AMD GPU the processor must have SSE2 or above, what processor does this machine have?

Claggy

Profile Rae of Quakesville,CHCH NZ
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Message 1400492 - Posted: 8 Aug 2013, 7:31:12 UTC - in response to Message 1400435.

The third problem is that for OpenCL to be used with an AMD GPU the processor must have or above, what processor does this machine have?

Claggy


Intel Pentium 4 @ 2.66 ghz ( single core) It does support SSE2. I have already downloaded Lunatics v0.41 & it chugs along nicely for its age.
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Profile Rae of Quakesville,CHCH NZ
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Message 1400496 - Posted: 8 Aug 2013, 7:35:32 UTC - in response to Message 1400421.

[/quote]
Your other option is that there are suitable PCI cards available with low end NVidia chips in them, but you'd probably have to mail order them from the US or Europe.

T.A.

[/quote]
Is there a card you can recommend and a place to purchase it from?
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Message 1402177 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 14:33:07 UTC

The most powerful AGP card from AMD is the HD3850. This is not OpenCL capable, and the AMD 48xx series is the oldest to be OpenCL capable (I understand). I think the situation is similar for Nvidia, with the GT430, etc.

The HD3850 will crunch Milkyway OK and the PCI capable NV 9500GT/9800GT will crunch PrimeGrid. But, the output is getting below the bar when the results justify the electricity used.
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Message 1402198 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 15:05:02 UTC - in response to Message 1400496.

Is there a card you can recommend and a place to purchase it from?

You can do searches for the HD4650 1GB DDR2 AGP8, there's versions from Sapphire and XFX available, such as here at Amazon, or here at eBay (both used).

Or here at IpMart.com (new), or closer to home at Priceme (I suppose the price is in NZ dollars).

The HD4650 does support OpenCL 1.0

Alternatively, you may want to search for the HIS HD 4670 IceQ Native HDMI 1GB (128bit) DDR3 AGP, although the places I looked so quickly, it's sold out. But perhaps that someone sells it second hand. HIS has also got a 4650 AGP.
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Message 1402202 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 15:12:56 UTC - in response to Message 1402198.

The HD4650 does support OpenCL 1.0

I think one of the SETI apps is incompatible with HD4650 (work group size: 128)?


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Message 1402253 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 17:35:09 UTC

No.
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Message 1402339 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 22:13:50 UTC - in response to Message 1400496.



Is there a card you can recommend and a place to purchase it from?



I don't know what the situation in NZ is as far as pricing and availability.

I've gone down the road you are trying to go down so while I'm not trying to get you to adopt my solution, I just wanted to tell you my experience and make a suggestion.

My experience is that purchasing anything new that will "just barely" qualify as a help (an AGP video card, for instance) is a total waste of your money. Even the least expensive new motherboard/RAM/CPU combination that will give you a "modern" PCIe slot is an investment in your own future. Throwing any money at all at a rig so outdated as to not already have a PCIe slot is the equivalent of burning your wallet.

My suggestion is to find whatever inexpensive outlet you can, even used, and replace the system with something more up-to-date even if it isn't a powerhouse.

If I had all of the money back that I spent trying not to spend any more than I had-to to improve things on the margin, I could buy a pretty decent cruncher.

Look at my rig with the ATI 6670 in it. P4 3GHz, HT enabled, Windows XP Pro. I already had the computer (one I retired from home service). The 6670 was about $100. I've had to replace fans, the power supply, and put a new hard drive in it, all one-at-a-time, of course, so each time the least expensive thing to-do was to patch it.

And of course I patched-it as inexpensively as possible, so if I "upgraded" it, I'd have to replace the things I replaced, HDD & optical drives <IDE> and the PSU, in addition to the motherboard/CPU/RAM.

And I managed to make that very same mistake multiple times. Now I have a different P4 trying to drive a GPU that it really can't and is throttling the GPU's output, but for that one I had to upgrade the OS and PSU and spent $150 on an "ok" video card. It's just good money after bad.


That's the way it turned-out for me. We don't face identical circumstances so I'm not saying your experience will be the same; but I have my suspicions.

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Message 1402344 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 22:37:50 UTC

Please dont forget tho.
Not everybody is able to build computers.

The problem with the 4650 is its based on RV 730.
Full OpenCL capability is from RV 770 onwards.
It could work but no warranty.

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Message 1402345 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 22:37:52 UTC - in response to Message 1402339.

Just did a search on Socket 478 motherboard with PCI-E and found these on ebay. I've never known there were Socket 478 motherboards with AGP8x AND PCI-E slots.
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Message 1402347 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 22:41:15 UTC - in response to Message 1402202.

I think one of the SETI apps is incompatible with HD4650 (work group size: 128)?

MB won't work on HD4650/4670 (because of the work group size limitation), but AstroPulse will (run-time around 7.25 hours).

I can only see one on-line store in Australia that still stocks a HD 4670 AGP for around AUD124, and that's assuming the page is up-to-date.

But as tbret suggested, it's probably not worth the money at this point to put an OpenCL-capable card in such an old machine. I did it a few years ago and mine's still running, but I plan on retiring it within the next few months.
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Message 1402365 - Posted: 12 Aug 2013, 23:23:46 UTC - in response to Message 1402347.

I think one of the SETI apps is incompatible with HD4650 (work group size: 128)?

MB won't work on HD4650/4670 (because of the work group size limitation), but AstroPulse will (run-time around 7.25 hours).

I can only see one on-line store in Australia that still stocks a HD 4670 AGP for around AUD124, and that's assuming the page is up-to-date.

But as tbret suggested, it's probably not worth the money at this point to put an OpenCL-capable card in such an old machine. I did it a few years ago and mine's still running, but I plan on retiring it within the next few months.


We have seen some 4650 which did work with MB app.
But not all.

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Message 1402443 - Posted: 13 Aug 2013, 3:13:53 UTC - in response to Message 1402345.

Just did a search on Socket 478 motherboard with PCI-E and found these on ebay. I've never known there were Socket 478 motherboards with AGP8x AND PCI-E slots.


If I already had a relatively "just ok" GPU, I might spend $35 on a motherboard so that the CPU and RAM I already have could feed a $100 card I already have. But I wouldn't even spend $35 on a board for a P4 and then have to spend $100 on a GPU.

I've noticed "bundles" at newegg that don't cost very much which have the equivalent of a low-end video card on the APU *and* have a PCIe slot. If I were trying to improve things as cheaply as possible, I might go that direction. Make the APU's GPU crunch now and leave myself room to add a better GPU later.

Most of my attempts to save money have shown themselves to have been a bad idea. I hope everyone else had a different experience.

Profile Rae of Quakesville,CHCH NZ
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Message 1403386 - Posted: 15 Aug 2013, 10:00:39 UTC

What about a pci slot card? maybe there are more options with that?
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Message 1404298 - Posted: 17 Aug 2013, 14:22:08 UTC - in response to Message 1403386.
Last modified: 17 Aug 2013, 15:05:15 UTC

What about a pci slot card? maybe there are more options with that?


For Nvidia these are probably the ones you want to look for or similar

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007709%20600007853%20600007321&IsNodeId=1&name=GeForce%20G%2fGT%20series&Pagesize=100


For AMD (probably these but I'm not entirely sure what you need to look for on AMD/Ati)


http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007709%20600007853%20600007320&IsNodeId=1&name=Radeon%20HD%205000%20series&Pagesize=100

Bare in mind none of these are particularly quick though
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Message 1404327 - Posted: 17 Aug 2013, 16:29:08 UTC - in response to Message 1404298.

What about a pci slot card? maybe there are more options with that?


For Nvidia these are probably the ones you want to look for or similar

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007709%20600007853%20600007321&IsNodeId=1&name=GeForce%20G%2fGT%20series&Pagesize=100

In this case newegg is not a very good place to look for this kind of cards. The 210 and 610 cards that are listed are kind of crap.

Ebay might be a better place to look.
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Message 1404423 - Posted: 17 Aug 2013, 20:18:44 UTC
Last modified: 17 Aug 2013, 20:19:15 UTC

Hence me not saying they weren't very fast. :)

You can allegedly get a 620 and 630 variant that are pci according to the below, but having already searched ebay and not come up with either newegg was the easiest. You can also of course get the 430 but the prices on ebay seem excessive compared to the 610 tbh

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Nvidia_graphics_processing_units
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