Independents' thread for discussing gun issues


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Profile Sarge
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Message 1320634 - Posted: 28 Dec 2012, 3:28:53 UTC - in response to Message 1320494.

Right after this last national election, I quit being fair and have untied the half of my brain that I had tied in the past to make debating liberals fair.

I'm an no longer wanting to be friendly with the mind-numbed robot voters who are successfully destroying this nation through athiesm, socialism, Marxism and communism.

I no longer listen to Rush Limbaugh. He now listens to me and then repeats what I have to say on over 600 AM radio stations. I don't know how he's doing it because we've never talked.


Please stay on topic. You were invited here to discuss the gun issues raised in my opening posts.

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Message 1320635 - Posted: 28 Dec 2012, 3:32:33 UTC - in response to Message 1320587.

Right after this last national election, I quit being fair and have untied the half of my brain that I had tied in the past to make debating liberals fair.

Didn't you previously announce some sort of conversion to liberalism around election time?

And we all knew he was being sarcastic. Demonstrating absurdity by being absurd, indeed.

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Message 1320641 - Posted: 28 Dec 2012, 4:21:52 UTC

Back to the topic: did one of the biggest of the gun supporters, Ted Nugent, evade the draft to go to Vietnam?

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Message 1320646 - Posted: 28 Dec 2012, 4:35:55 UTC - in response to Message 1320641.

Back to the topic: did one of the biggest of the gun supporters, Ted Nugent, evade the draft to go to Vietnam?


Ummm...he admits doing so Sarge

http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/nugent.asp
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Message 1320647 - Posted: 28 Dec 2012, 4:40:33 UTC - in response to Message 1320646.
Last modified: 28 Dec 2012, 4:41:31 UTC

Back to the topic: did one of the biggest of the gun supporters, Ted Nugent, evade the draft to go to Vietnam?


Ummm...he admits doing so Sarge

http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/nugent.asp


The Snopes page I read said the exact nature of getting out of it was undetermined. He has given different stories.

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Message 1321102 - Posted: 29 Dec 2012, 2:58:58 UTC
Last modified: 29 Dec 2012, 2:59:35 UTC

http://www.komonews.com/news/national/Fearful-of-ban-frenzied-buyers-swarm-gun-stores-185101411.html

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Message 1321137 - Posted: 29 Dec 2012, 5:17:17 UTC - in response to Message 1319800.

No Sarge. There is a limit.I'll agree with you that most people have degree of irrationality but when it gets to the point of specifically arming yourself to start taking out seven year olds or fellow employees. That is definitely outside the "normal" range.

I can understand "crimes of passion" and even a gangland hit that is cold bloodedly organised to get rid of rival (there is a certain rationality to this), but to start blazing away at people you don't know, are no threat and have done you no harm shows a complete withdrawal from the rest of humanity.

T.A.

When you get to the point of arming yourself to protect yourself against a democratic republic government because you think there is some conspiracy in that government to come after you, that is outside the normal range.

When you arm yourself for protection because you job makes you a target for the criminal element, e.g. transportation of large amounts of cash, that is a rational decision.

When you arm yourself for protection without any credible specific threat, that is borderline.

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I will have to remember that the next time I shoot trap.

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Message 1321139 - Posted: 29 Dec 2012, 5:20:25 UTC - in response to Message 1319813.

to protect themselves against tyranny in government


Can you cite one occasion where the US Government has been cruel and oppressive and not been questioned if cruel acts against the population have been suspected.

The fact that laws have changed, probably because they no longer fit the present situation, is not a reason for an uprising or even suggesting one.

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wounded knee creak comes to mind.

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Message 1321327 - Posted: 29 Dec 2012, 16:05:53 UTC

Suicide by Cop preferable to prison:
http://news.yahoo.com/nj-police-station-shooter-corrections-employee-143541364--abc-news-topstories.html

Prisons Worker Shoots Cops in Station

The man who "unleashed a barrage of gunfire" on three police officers this morning in New Jersey was an employee of the New Jersey Department of Corrections who had been arrested for allegedly stalking his ex-girlfriend's home.

The suspect was shot dead in the police station. Three police officers also were shot but are expected to make full recoveries.

Eddie Jones III, 39, of Willingboro, N.J., was arrested around 1 a.m., when he was found allegedly stalking the home of his former girlfriend.

Yep. Knew where he was going, better than most, and made his choice.

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Message 1340891 - Posted: 25 Feb 2013, 23:47:43 UTC

I'm really glad "good guys" come with good guy symbols emblazoned on their chests, that such symbols are always accurate and no one EVER changes from good to bad (or vice versa).

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Message 1341180 - Posted: 27 Feb 2013, 6:26:32 UTC

it seems to me that being able to buy a specialize printer and a few bottles of

plastic ink making it possible to print out a working gun mince springs should

be eliciting a lot more comment.

yes the printer costs about 10,000.00 dollars and the ink is not cheap either

but standard inkjets could be retrofitted. and the plans are downloadable on the internet now.


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Message 1341205 - Posted: 27 Feb 2013, 7:09:54 UTC

It really should be setting the alarm bells off.

The printed gun is going to be PLASTIC!

Does a plastic full auto AR-15 set off a metal detector looking for a gun? Does it matter to a terrorist that he might only get a few hundred rounds out of a plastic gun compared to tens of thousands for a nice factory made metal one?

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Message 1341483 - Posted: 28 Feb 2013, 0:55:44 UTC

since the only parts not being made of plastic will be the springs maybe

I should start making a waffle flipper or a spring loaded lamp that just happens

to use the same spring as an ar-15 say for 15 or 20 bucks.
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Message 1341646 - Posted: 28 Feb 2013, 15:49:33 UTC - in response to Message 1341205.

[quote]It really should be setting the alarm bells off.

The printed gun is going to be PLASTIC!

Does a plastic full auto AR-15 set off a metal detector looking for a gun? Does it matter to a terrorist that he might only get a few hundred rounds out of a plastic gun compared to tens of thousands for a nice factory made metal one?
[/quote

Whith the special plastics nowdays, Id say a firearm capable of a few hundred shots is possible before it blows up. However you still need ammo. Even caseless rounds that have been tried for years now, still have a metal bullet. I just cant see a plastice bullet with the mass to do a lot of damage Sting like hell yes.

The scanners they have to day can detect an objects shape. Look online and see what they see. If it looks like a gun it probally is one. And if it looks like a bullet it probally is one. Why do think some folks are up in arms about the full body scans?
They said the same about the Glock when it came out. OMG the terrorist will smuggle them on airplanes. I have a Glock the barrel and slide are made of steel. Plus all the springs and the ammo.

Id say printers will make high capacity magazines and stocks.


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Message 1341856 - Posted: 1 Mar 2013, 5:37:16 UTC - in response to Message 1341646.
Last modified: 1 Mar 2013, 5:44:36 UTC

The scanners they have to day can detect an objects shape. Look online and see what they see. If it looks like a gun it probally is one. And if it looks like a bullet it probally is one. Why do think some folks are up in arms about the full body scans?

But aren't those scanners being pulled from service? Also they were only ever in a few select airport locations. Not at the entrance to every government building, school, sports stadium, convention center, amusement park and the like, a place where a terrorist still could do considerable damage.

<edit>I can even think of worse consequences. Some terrorist painting his plastic gun orange, like a toy, and getting it by security at an event by pointing out it is plastic and saying it is a toy, then using it. After that every child with a toy gun in his hands is going to get shot by the police as they can't tell the difference between a toy and the real thing.
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Message 1342044 - Posted: 1 Mar 2013, 15:48:45 UTC - in response to Message 1341856.

The scanners they have to day can detect an objects shape. Look online and see what they see. If it looks like a gun it probally is one. And if it looks like a bullet it probally is one. Why do think some folks are up in arms about the full body scans?

But aren't those scanners being pulled from service? Also they were only ever in a few select airport locations. Not at the entrance to every government building, school, sports stadium, convention center, amusement park and the like, a place where a terrorist still could do considerable damage.

<edit>I can even think of worse consequences. Some terrorist painting his plastic gun orange, like a toy, and getting it by security at an event by pointing out it is plastic and saying it is a toy, then using it. After that every child with a toy gun in his hands is going to get shot by the police as they can't tell the difference between a toy and the real thing.

Back when the Glock first came out there was a huge cry that terrorists would get them on planes. The scanners of those days was still able to see the outline of the whole gun and the ammo. Hell you see a palstic comb plane as day ( no pun inteneded) And in this day and age why would any parent let a kid tote a toy gun to any public place. And It should raise securitys eyebtrows if an adult is carryinng one.

I think the real danger is for a terrorist to use common material to hide in plane sight a weapon that can kill. Think a cane that is hollow, An oxygen tank. Tubing and .33 caliber balls of steel or glass. I wonder what a glass ball at x amount of mass at 2000 psi has for kinectic energy?
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Message 1342147 - Posted: 1 Mar 2013, 18:59:21 UTC

Ok I watched bill and I must say he made the point elegantly.

so where do we go from here?

congress needs to be called every time they breach the constitution.

their oaths of office need to be questioned every time they do these things.

I just get tired of doing that.

I an vary frustrated that I have to go back time and time again to try to stop

things that the oath of office should stop.
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Message 1343188 - Posted: 5 Mar 2013, 6:23:12 UTC

it seems to me that printable guns are most dangerous to regimes that have high

militant dissident population, this may be far more dangerous to the Arab world

than it is to us, infighting among Arab factions and the lack of sophisticated

imaging detectors make finding them harder.

I guess that the thing to look for will be tested designs that are small

concealable and powerful at close range, quiet would be good to.
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