WASTING MY TIME?

Message boards : Number crunching : WASTING MY TIME?

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Author	Message
dancer42 Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 2 Jun 02 Posts: 340 Credit: 1,073,305 RAC: 1,197	Message 1309922 - Posted: 24 Nov 2012, 21:01:05 UTC - in response to Message 1309862.
	The ego and self-importance of some people is surfacing again (maybe it never went under) with the ridicule of people without a green star. It is quite apparent that we each contribute resources to this project, those who are computing continuously. I'm sorry I have to remind you of that. Most of this community's PC's no longer waste energy all night as they did when the project started, with automatic sleep mode, etc. So we choose to contribute a portion of our energy bucks on S@H. Isn't that enough? Many of us go out and update our hardware periodically in order to "keep our stats up". That is a contribution as well, assuming our work is useful and appreciated. Unless I'm missing something, it is at that point the community recedes back and let's the S@H work its way. Pretty much that is where I am now. Ego and self-importance? Dancer42 is obviously missing my point with this personal attack (Read his complete post). It's quite simple. Seti@Home is being overwhelmed (among other problems). If many/most of the persons spending time and money on THEIR end, would only contribute a few dollars a year: It may greatly help. I am truly sorry if asking people to contribute a few dollars a year hit a raw nerve. hay i am with you i was responding to "PhonAcq" it does not hurt much to save some pocket change and donate eric and the crew need a new light bulb. lol DANCER42 ____________
	ID: 1309922 ·

dancer42 Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 2 Jun 02 Posts: 340 Credit: 1,073,305 RAC: 1,197	Message 1309933 - Posted: 24 Nov 2012, 21:46:23 UTC
	It is not about the star, or even finding the golden signal,it's about looking and exploring,it is about keeping the light's on in one of the most wonderful experiments in the entire history of mankind. seti has already changed the way science is done. If you have a neat idea and you can't get funding or time on the university mainframe ask for volunteer's,Seti did it! so if you can, help, if you can't that is ok. When seti was started almost everybody said it will never work yet here we are. we have change and are changing the world every day seti run's,so once again if you can help please do, if you really can't that is alright too. But at the end of the day please enjoy having changed the world just a little bit. DANCER42 ____________
	ID: 1309933 ·

tbret Send message Joined: 28 May 99 Posts: 1914 Credit: 127,635,158 RAC: 89,320	Message 1310032 - Posted: 25 Nov 2012, 4:15:53 UTC - in response to Message 1309917.
	Why asking for contributions to seti@home, or any other non-profit institution, would be considered negative is beyond me. My stars! How can you ask that!?! With so many thousands of people around, someone always misunderstands and takes offense. You could say, "Good morning!" and someone's going to point-out that this is an international project and that it's only morning to some of us, and how dare people in ________ think they are the center of the universe and force the rest of us to accept a pleasantry that assumes the superiority of their time-zone. After all, their dark is every bit as good as our light...etc, etc, etc. Someone always has their panties in a wad. Don't look now (or ever, when I stop to think about it), but sometimes it's me. ____________
	ID: 1310032 ·

Cheopis Send message Joined: 17 Sep 00 Posts: 126 Credit: 6,951,277 RAC: 6,072	Message 1310452 - Posted: 26 Nov 2012, 11:29:56 UTC - in response to Message 1307073. Last modified: 26 Nov 2012, 11:47:05 UTC
	Josef W. Segur wrote The general idea would be to send 107.374 seconds of raw data from a channel to the host (a 64MiB + overhead super WU) and have the app split it into 256 frequency subbands (MB WUs) plus split into 8 sequential time sections at full bandwidth (AP WUs). The advantage is that single ~64MiB download replaces ~162MiB of downloads for work split server side. Both the raw data and split data use the same 2 bits to represent a complex data point, the savings come from only sending the data once plus far less overhead in the WU header information. Exactly. By this method you would be distributing more of the processing out to the end-user machines, which is what this project is all about. Should attract Dr. Anderson's attention. Nobody has addressed validation yet, though. Tron wrote Take that a step further and have the Host distribute some the "locally split" WU's Why on Earth would you want to redistribute these WU? If the end-user machine is big and fast enough to take on a whole raw data unit, it's also big and fast enough to process the WU so generated. Indeed, the main saving is in reducing the bandwidth required at the central servers, by making only one download of the data and one upload of the combined set of results. The combined results would need to be validated as a unit against the same unit processed by a different end-user. Any disagreement would result in the whole unit being sent out again for a processing by a third user, exactly as is done at present. So you would reduce the load on the splitter processes and reduce the bandwidth requirement. Eh, why not perform the validation by hash, through some sort of peer-to-peer validation, and have SETI send each data piece to only one peer unless there are problems? In other words, send one big data chunk to user #1, (validate by hash), who then forwards it to user #2 who validates it with a hash to SETI. Then they both split it, and cross validate with each other. If they do not match all hashes properly, then they re-split, and compare their first set to their second set and if their first sets match their second sets, but they still don't match each other, then and only then would the SETI project send out another copy of the first big data chunk. This means that BOINC would have to take on the role of a peer-to-peer data transfer host for project data. I'm not sure how doable this would be, or how secure it could be made to be.
	ID: 1310452 ·

Tron Send message Joined: 16 Aug 09 Posts: 180 Credit: 2,236,055 RAC: 23	Message 1310717 - Posted: 27 Nov 2012, 7:37:04 UTC
	Did someone say "free beer" ?
	ID: 1310717 ·

juan BFB Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 16 Mar 07 Posts: 2722 Credit: 158,640,469 RAC: 158,823	Message 1310732 - Posted: 27 Nov 2012, 11:09:58 UTC - in response to Message 1310717. Last modified: 27 Nov 2012, 12:05:19 UTC
	Did someone say "free beer" ? Free beer? I´m second in line! ____________
	ID: 1310732 ·

KWSN-Sir Robin's Minstrels Send message Joined: 19 Aug 03 Posts: 17 Credit: 14,621,025 RAC: 0	Message 1310763 - Posted: 27 Nov 2012, 18:38:51 UTC - in response to Message 1310452.
	This means that BOINC would have to take on the role of a peer-to-peer data transfer host for project data. I'm not sure how doable this would be, or how secure it could be made to be. I'm sure the security of such a setup is the main concern. Once upon a time the system WAS less secure (if I remember it was pre-BOINC) and data that was closer to raw was handed out...and it didn't take long for a small group of people to start falsifying results and compromising the project in the name of the almighty RAC. I doubt we'll see uncontrolled raw data out in the wild again because of this. ____________
	ID: 1310763 ·

Dorphas Send message Joined: 16 May 99 Posts: 117 Credit: 7,121,235 RAC: 5,497	Message 1310774 - Posted: 27 Nov 2012, 18:57:37 UTC - in response to Message 1310763.
	until seti actually starts looking at the data and showing everyone the results, we all are wasting our time. after almost 14 years they own everyone that. it was, after all, one of the statements made when the ads came out to sign up for seti. ____________
	ID: 1310774 ·

Claggy Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 5 Jul 99 Posts: 3510 Credit: 26,372,749 RAC: 17,522	Message 1310782 - Posted: 27 Nov 2012, 19:13:20 UTC - in response to Message 1310774. Last modified: 27 Nov 2012, 19:17:47 UTC
	until seti actually starts looking at the data and showing everyone the results, we all are wasting our time. after almost 14 years they own everyone that. it was, after all, one of the statements made when the ads came out to sign up for seti. Which is what the Near-Time Persistency Checker (NTPCkr) does: Near-Time Persistency Checker (NTPCkr) Frequently Asked Questions and has been Publically shown in the past: Near-Time Persistency Checker: Current Best Candidates by Score Claggy
	ID: 1310782 ·

Bathybius & Eozoon Nummulosphere Bound Send message Joined: 16 Jun 02 Posts: 1359 Credit: 2,422,153 RAC: 2,200	Message 1310785 - Posted: 27 Nov 2012, 19:20:49 UTC
	SETI is A Near Time Persistent Donation Accepting Machine for Us One Percenters. Check, Double Check. DEMON...Gamma Ray Burst Burning Hot. ____________
	ID: 1310785 ·

WezH Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 19 Aug 99 Posts: 75 Credit: 2,342,638 RAC: 4,657	Message 1310794 - Posted: 27 Nov 2012, 19:36:14 UTC - in response to Message 1310782.
	Near-Time Persistency Checker: Current Best Candidates by Score Claggy Well about that... "The public version of this page is currently offline, as we are still developing large parts of the code." Again, major problem of Seti@Home. No new information for The Volunteers. Yes, I DO know about the lack of funding and manpower, and I have patience to wait, but... How many of beginners of Seti@Home does have?... "This doesn't work, I'll just uninstall it" How many of those kind of "volunteers" Seti@Home have/had?
	ID: 1310794 ·

Josef W. Segur Volunteer developer Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 30 Oct 99 Posts: 3969 Credit: 937,691 RAC: 158	Message 1310874 - Posted: 28 Nov 2012, 0:23:05 UTC - in response to Message 1310794.
	... Yes, I DO know about the lack of funding and manpower, and I have patience to wait, but... How many of beginners of Seti@Home does have?... "This doesn't work, I'll just uninstall it" How many of those kind of "volunteers" Seti@Home have/had? Stats sites show that there are about 1343k SaH user accounts, and about 153k still active. Just think what we might be doing now if many of those lapsed users had been interested enough to make even one 10 dollar donation rather than simply giving up! I would guess there's been more users lost because their computer died and they forgot to add SaH on the replacement, though. In Classic days, only about a third of accounts never completed a WU. Joe
	ID: 1310874 ·

HAL9000 Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 11 Sep 99 Posts: 3297 Credit: 78,499,802 RAC: 59,919	Message 1311007 - Posted: 28 Nov 2012, 13:02:44 UTC - in response to Message 1310874.
	... Yes, I DO know about the lack of funding and manpower, and I have patience to wait, but... How many of beginners of Seti@Home does have?... "This doesn't work, I'll just uninstall it" How many of those kind of "volunteers" Seti@Home have/had? Stats sites show that there are about 1343k SaH user accounts, and about 153k still active. Just think what we might be doing now if many of those lapsed users had been interested enough to make even one 10 dollar donation rather than simply giving up! I would guess there's been more users lost because their computer died and they forgot to add SaH on the replacement, though. In Classic days, only about a third of accounts never completed a WU. Joe From the information on the donations page it looks like the donations average close to $1 per active user. If the donations averaged $10, or even $5, per user that would be a significant amount of money. ____________ SETI@home classic workunits: 93,865 CPU time: 863,447 hours Join the BP6/VP6 User Group today!
	ID: 1311007 ·

Blurf Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 2 Sep 06 Posts: 6458 Credit: 5,734,751 RAC: 2,814	Message 1311110 - Posted: 28 Nov 2012, 18:50:07 UTC
	I PM'ed Brad from GPU users to offer assistance last week and still haven't heard anything. shrug ____________
	ID: 1311110 ·

msattler Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 9 Jul 00 Posts: 34711 Credit: 355,111,074 RAC: 381,780	Message 1311112 - Posted: 28 Nov 2012, 18:52:52 UTC - in response to Message 1311110. Last modified: 28 Nov 2012, 18:58:16 UTC
	I PM'ed Brad from GPU users to offer assistance last week and still haven't heard anything. shrug He's been absent for a bit.....hope all it OK there. I sent a PM and have not heard back either. But he's not posted for a week here. Hopefully he's just out of town for a while and we'll hear back soon. I'll inquire on the team board. ____________ ****** "Ask not, what your kitty can do for you. Ask what you can do for your kitty." As it is kitten, so shall it be done.
	ID: 1311112 ·

juan BFB Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 16 Mar 07 Posts: 2722 Credit: 158,640,469 RAC: 158,823	Message 1311165 - Posted: 28 Nov 2012, 21:58:31 UTC Last modified: 28 Nov 2012, 22:02:11 UTC
	I´m not 100% sure if was him, (so please forgive if i was wrong) but i remember some talking about he is busy with some illness related to his girlfriend. Just can´t find in what thread i see that to be sure. (edit) I find the msg: http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=69925&postid=1303290 seems the info is outdated. ____________
	ID: 1311165 ·

Dorphas Send message Joined: 16 May 99 Posts: 117 Credit: 7,121,235 RAC: 5,497	Message 1311348 - Posted: 29 Nov 2012, 15:45:21 UTC - in response to Message 1310782.
	until seti actually starts looking at the data and showing everyone the results, we all are wasting our time. after almost 14 years they own everyone that. it was, after all, one of the statements made when the ads came out to sign up for seti. Which is what the Near-Time Persistency Checker (NTPCkr) does: Near-Time Persistency Checker (NTPCkr) Frequently Asked Questions and has been Publically shown in the past: Near-Time Persistency Checker: Current Best Candidates by Score Claggy i'm aware of all of that. what i'm talking about is running 24/7. even seti was was talking about this as far back as 2005 in a science newsletter. it should have been running after 8 years. but maybe looking for hydrogen gas is more important. ____________
	ID: 1311348 ·

Raistmer Volunteer developer Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 16 Jun 01 Posts: 2626 Credit: 26,617,741 RAC: 35,162	Message 1311460 - Posted: 5 Dec 2012, 20:24:33 UTC - in response to Message 1311348.
	but maybe looking for hydrogen gas is more important. I would say "important" have few quite different aspects. If important thing is that brings you money to live and that allow you to have some free time and to spend that free time on your own personal interests then what your own goverment treat as important and for what inverstigation it supply funds via grants - that is important thing. It brings you money. And quite different aspect what your own curiosity thinks as important and for what you will spend your money and time (spend money, not recive money, it's important). Taking this into account I would consider all this long thread as quite insulting for peoples who cares about this project. Cause LONG AGO already this project became important thing in second aspect and not the first one. No goverments pay for this project, no goverments give grants for this (very important indeed) study. So peoples who involved must do different (and paid) work to be able to spend some time here too. And forgetting about this crude reality is childish at least and really insulting indeed. I would suggest to let this thread die on its own. Period. ____________ News about SETI opt app releases: https://twitter.com/Raistmer
	ID: 1311460 ·

Gary Charpentier Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 10556 Credit: 5,263,174 RAC: 6,433	Message 1311466 - Posted: 5 Dec 2012, 20:40:28 UTC - in response to Message 1311460.
	Is looking for Hydrogen important? It is how the radio receiver for Seti Classic got on the dish at Arecibo. So without that there would be no Seti@home. Is it important to you now? As to NTPCKR, it has been in the budget as a line item for a programmer for many a year. The people here scream for more and more data, not for someone to write a program. Let's face it flashing lights are sexy, a guy with a pocket protector isn't. Want to change that? Write a letter to you favorite celebrity and ask them to donate to Seti@Home. ____________
	ID: 1311466 ·

dancer42 Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 2 Jun 02 Posts: 340 Credit: 1,073,305 RAC: 1,197	Message 1311568 - Posted: 6 Dec 2012, 0:17:49 UTC Last modified: 6 Dec 2012, 0:18:41 UTC
	One of the sibling projects to seti has mapped the pretease protein that allows hiv to reproduce. this is a huge step to finding a cure. If seti was not here first that this may have taken decades to happen. wasting my time I think not!!! ____________
	ID: 1311568 ·

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Message boards : Number crunching : WASTING MY TIME?