Republicans Can't Handle The Truth


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Profile soft^spirit
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Message 1303871 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 5:30:30 UTC - in response to Message 1303869.

High oil costs could actually help. It costs more and more to send things to Asia and back...
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Message 1304004 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 14:45:12 UTC - in response to Message 1303869.

Is the US now becoming an offshore location for manufacturing companies.

Foxconn 'considers plan to open factories in US'

Taiwan company's reportedly evaluating LA and Detroit as site for TV assembly plants owing to rising labour costs at home

Hey, if things are balancing out that quick in the global economy, I'm ok with it.

You want to be a third world country?

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Message 1304018 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 15:21:18 UTC - in response to Message 1304004.
Last modified: 21 Mar 2014, 16:32:33 UTC

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Message 1304029 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 16:08:34 UTC - in response to Message 1304004.

Is the US now becoming an offshore location for manufacturing companies.

Foxconn 'considers plan to open factories in US'

Taiwan company's reportedly evaluating LA and Detroit as site for TV assembly plants owing to rising labour costs at home

Hey, if things are balancing out that quick in the global economy, I'm ok with it.

You want to be a third world country?

Parts of America already are.
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Message 1304040 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 16:28:18 UTC - in response to Message 1304004.

Is the US now becoming an offshore location for manufacturing companies.

Foxconn 'considers plan to open factories in US'

Taiwan company's reportedly evaluating LA and Detroit as site for TV assembly plants owing to rising labour costs at home

Hey, if things are balancing out that quick in the global economy, I'm ok with it.

You want to be a third world country?

No, but how else can the trade deficit be turned around? If our labor is becoming affordable to other countries, yes it's bad for our dollar, but could be a turning point...
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Message 1304050 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 16:47:36 UTC - in response to Message 1304040.

Is the US now becoming an offshore location for manufacturing companies.

Foxconn 'considers plan to open factories in US'

Taiwan company's reportedly evaluating LA and Detroit as site for TV assembly plants owing to rising labour costs at home

Hey, if things are balancing out that quick in the global economy, I'm ok with it.

You want to be a third world country?

No, but how else can the trade deficit be turned around? If our labor is becoming affordable to other countries, yes it's bad for our dollar, but could be a turning point...

Inflation coming home to roost. Yep, that tax will be paid and no political party can prevent that tax from being paid. And you thought Sequestration was bad?!

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Message 1304082 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 17:50:36 UTC - in response to Message 1304004.

Is the US now becoming an offshore location for manufacturing companies.

Foxconn 'considers plan to open factories in US'

Taiwan company's reportedly evaluating LA and Detroit as site for TV assembly plants owing to rising labour costs at home

Hey, if things are balancing out that quick in the global economy, I'm ok with it.

You want to be a third world country?

You haven't been to Oklahoma or North Dakota lately. have you
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Message 1304139 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 19:03:47 UTC - in response to Message 1303603.

The discussion of how the Republicans must "reinvent themselves" in order to remain relevant is amusing. The Republican party is already irrelevant; it has done nothing of national significance since the beginning of President Obama's first term.

Obstructionism is not an agenda, it is a tantrum.

The GOP has missed its last chance to play any constructive role in the context of the USA's new and future demographic realities, since it rejected W's "compassionate conservative" rhetoric, which was never coherent enough to be called a vision, but nevertheless, it was the closest any of them ever came to beginning to describe a model of governance that could be relevant into the 21st century. And as a group they chose not to make the attempt.

Inevitably, some factions of the GOP and of the "conservative movement" will now attempt to make worthwhile reforms but as institutions, neither has any credibility left. Conservatives and Republicans talking about how to prevent going the way of the Whigs rather than do post-mortem analysis to determine why that has already happened are simply in denial, or not very bright. You are through. Here, in a nutshell, is why.

Whichever policy you support, suppressing the facts and suppressing non-partisan, professional analysis as Senate Republicans just did, is simply un-American.

Not one of the conservatives here wrote to concur with that self-evident fact. More importantly, no national GOP leader spoke one word of criticism of this USSR-style suppression of information. This is but one of many available examples of opportunities to reform your faction, which as a group you have chosen not to take. As a result, there is nothing left but corruption and hate to define the GOP.

Because none of you have refuted this abuse of the free exchange of information, you have no credibility talking about freedom. Because you refused to acknowledge the costs of the wars you chose to start or the known falsity of the claims you used as pretext for the Iraq war, you have no credibility when you talking about fiscal responsibility nor national security. Because you refused to admit that GOP legislation de-regulating Wall Street late in the Clinton administration directly caused the financial crisis of 2008 and ongoing economic depression, you have no credibility on regulatory policy. Because you refused to admit that "No Child Left Behind" and private charter schools are harmful to the project of educating children and beneficial only to practitioners of a predatory business model, you have no credibility on education, and so on.

Over and over, when facts manifestly contradicted what you wished to believe, you denied the facts. You have an ideology, and when facts contradicted the premises of your ideology, you refused to check your premises. As a result, your "ideas" are no longer relevant and you are no longer taken seriously. The time to reform your political party and your "conservative" movement is long past. You have wasted too much time trying to "conserve" a status quo that has long ago ceased to exist (and much of which has never existed), and have already been thrown into the dustbin of history.
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Message 1304143 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 19:10:12 UTC - in response to Message 1304139.

+1
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Message 1304165 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 20:09:34 UTC - in response to Message 1304139.

Reed, it could be no one has answered because there are no tea idiots on these boards, possibly except for those on vacation.

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Message 1304173 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 20:31:44 UTC
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Message 1304197 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 21:32:51 UTC - in response to Message 1304173.

Didn't think you went for the total government control of reproduction that the tea idiots go for. I thought you were more of a libertarian who wanted the government to simply go away.

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Message 1304198 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 21:34:14 UTC - in response to Message 1303739.

The tea idiots are throwbacks to the 4th century!!

More like throwbacks to Australopithecus, at least.

It took until the 80's before the idiots settled into the Republican party.

Nobody identified as part of a "Tea Party" (faction within the GOP) until the Obama administration(*), so your assumption that the formation of a separate "Tea Party" would take all the idiots out of the GOP seems unfounded.

Now that they seem to have gone off and formed the Tea idiots perhaps the Republicans can finish throwing them out and they can become a totally marginalized non issue.

Also, long before any "Tea Party" faction began identifying as such, it has been the extremists that have dictated who may speak for the GOP, not your moderates and not your intellectuals, assuming you have any. It is well known that winning a Republican primary is far more likely to require tacking to the far right than toward the middle. Romney was not the first to have to do that, his experience in the primaries is just what Republicans outside Massachusetts have had to do for decades to win a primary. So I'm curious how you envision this trend, that the GOP agenda is dictated by its extremists, really reversing.

I hope level-headed guys like David Frum will become your party's de facto intellectual leaders, and I hope they have a real strategy in mind rather than just hoping the extremists voluntarily take themselves out of the picture. Historically, that does not happen and people or groups that have political power continue to use their power to get what they want, until that power is taken from them.

* Ron Paul's "Tea Party" (in 2007, iIrc) was just an event, not a movement or an organization of any kind.
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Message 1304207 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 21:54:39 UTC - in response to Message 1304198.

The tea idiots are throwbacks to the 4th century!!

More like throwbacks to Australopithecus, at least.

No 4th century, when the fundies last had power and it brought out the dark ages.

It took until the 80's before the idiots settled into the Republican party.

Nobody identified as part of a "Tea Party" (faction within the GOP) until the Obama administration(*), so your assumption that the formation of a separate "Tea Party" would take all the idiots out of the GOP seems unfounded.

The tea idiots are religious fundies. Took them a while to come up with a name. None the less they used to be part of the democratic party. The democrats threw them out starting in the 60's and they landed one by one in the republican party and slowly took over in the 80's.

Now that they seem to have gone off and formed the Tea idiots perhaps the Republicans can finish throwing them out and they can become a totally marginalized non issue.

Also, long before any "Tea Party" faction began identifying as such, it has been the extremists that have dictated who may speak for the GOP, not your moderates and not your intellectuals, assuming you have any. It is well known that winning a Republican primary is far more likely to require tacking to the far right than toward the middle. Romney was not the first to have to do that, his experience in the primaries is just what Republicans outside Massachusetts have had to do for decades to win a primary. So I'm curious how you envision this trend, that the GOP agenda is dictated by its extremists, really reversing.

I hope level-headed guys like David Frum will become your party's

My party? Don't insult me. I'm at right angles to the democrat republican line.
de facto intellectual leaders, and I hope they have a real strategy in mind rather than just hoping the extremists voluntarily take themselves out of the picture. Historically, that does not happen and people or groups that have political power continue to use their power to get what they want, until that power is taken from them.

* Ron Paul's "Tea Party" (in 2007, iIrc) was just an event, not a movement or an organization of any kind.


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Message 1304212 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 22:03:34 UTC - in response to Message 1304165.

Reed, it could be no one has answered because there are no tea idiots on these boards...

But there are conservatives here, aren't there? And Republicans? To avoid disappointment, I try to never expect logical behavior from idiots nor logical dialog with them. But whether or not you consider McConnell a tea idiot or just a conservative Republican, he is a Republican in the U.S. Senate, not some inconsequential House member like Darrell Issa, Steve King or Allen West, whose shenanigans I can understand waving away as the actions of some puffed up nobodies that each represent no more than about 1/435 of the people.

On the contrary, as Senate minority leader, McConnell's blatant attempt to deny facts and to suppress professional, reputable and non-partisan analysis merely because it does not comport with his policy preferences, calls for denunciation by all credible members of his party. So why don't Senators Chuck Grassley or Lindsay Graham condemn McConnell's un-American attempt at censorship? We all know this would be demanded if a Democrat tried to pull that kind of crap. Instead of informing his opinions with the facts and professional analysis, McConnell is attempting to coerce the facts to conform to his opinions. In communist China under Mao, millions of peasants died because his flunkies were too afraid to give him the bad news that his five year plans weren't working. GOP leaders have the information that their economic plans do not work and will lead to no good, but they are trying to prevent anybody else from knowing it and from acting rationally according to the known facts. That's un-American, and for fellow Republicans to fail to call him out on it shows greater loyalty to party than to country, and that's also un-American.
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Message 1304217 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 22:13:48 UTC - in response to Message 1304207.
Last modified: 9 Nov 2012, 22:21:36 UTC

I hope level-headed guys like David Frum will become your party's

My party? Don't insult me. I'm at right angles to the democrat republican line.

No, you're not. And I have not insulted you, I have observed your comments and objectively categorized them according to their content. Your political opinions are orthogonal to neither Democrat nor Republican, they are largely identical to the GOP and totally opposed to the Democratic Party. Even your claim of belonging to neither party is typical of the faux-individualism of the Republican Party.
http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=69902&postid=1303741

Bama said he was going to pay for your health insurance. How he is going to do that is interesting. He is going to make the wealthiest man in America pay everyone's health insurance. He will keep raising taxes and giving more away until only one person is able to pay taxes and that person will subside everyone. Everyone will be dependent on King Bama. Good way to head into slavery and get them to lock the shackles on themselves.

That's all ideology, no fact and no intelligence and that, we all know, means that your sympathy is to the GOP world view, regardless of whatever quibbles that you imagine put you "at right angles to" them. And your views are antithetical to the Liberal ideal that came out of the aptly-named Enlightenment.
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Message 1304228 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 22:31:06 UTC
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Message 1304229 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 22:37:15 UTC - in response to Message 1304217.

I hope level-headed guys like David Frum will become your party's

My party? Don't insult me. I'm at right angles to the democrat republican line.

No, you're not.

You are incorrect.

And I have not insulted you

You have.

You are also a newcomer here and have not been around long enough to tell the difference between people. I can forgive ignorance.

I'm not a republican. I have never given a dime to the republicans.

I have given money to candidates to the party I belong to. I did vote for their standard bearer for President. HINT it wasn't Romney.


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Message 1304232 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 22:44:01 UTC - in response to Message 1304212.
Last modified: 9 Nov 2012, 22:44:34 UTC

On the contrary, as Senate minority leader, McConnell's blatant attempt to deny facts and to suppress professional, reputable and non-partisan analysis merely because it does not comport with his policy preferences, calls for denunciation by all credible members of his party

Snort
officials at the research service “decided, on their own, to pull the study pending further review.”

From a link in your own post.

Credibility?

<edit> Perhaps the reason no one wants to talk to you.
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Message 1304233 - Posted: 9 Nov 2012, 22:52:01 UTC

heard on NPR yesterday. I higher up in the GOP was discussing what and how the GOP can fix its image and DING DING DING get people to buy into SupplySIDE economics. WTF Reagan did it and W did it and we are still doing it. It does not work. Never created a job just redistributed tax money and wealth to the already very wealthy. Clearly, the GOP and its lackeys just dont get it. Farewell GOP been nice hating you for so many years. Now that you've become irrelevant I will have to think of you as a museum piece, a relic that once stood for fiscal responsibility as long as it was someone else in charge and social conservativism as long as it wasn't their body that was raped and forced to have the child.
Screw them.
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