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Mark West

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Message 1307199 - Posted: 17 Nov 2012, 22:59:48 UTC

I too have recently cut back on my SETI activity. I regularly run out of WUs for days on end. Luckily there are lots of other valuable science projects available to contribute to. I am currently contributing to seven projects and find that many of them run short of WUs.

While I would like to have more WUs for SETI, I am glad that we are analyzing the data as fast as they can send it to us. That tells me there are lots of like minded people out there trying to help.

Keep up the good work everyone.
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Message 1307222 - Posted: 18 Nov 2012, 0:11:24 UTC

My client hasn't updated for days. I just tried (again) to manually update and it's still not uploading my finished WUs and it hasn't downloaded any new ones. In fact, it's doing nothing but deferring communication over and over.

Anyone know what's up?
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Message 1307281 - Posted: 18 Nov 2012, 4:45:40 UTC
Last modified: 18 Nov 2012, 4:48:53 UTC

I too have a machine that is unable to connect and upload/download work units. What I find more interesting is that it is the machine that has a serious GPU and multi CPU cores to do the processing. I have another machine that has a less capable GPU and a modest 2 core CPU that seems to get units as required and keeps the buffer full or close to it. I have a third machine that has no GPU and a slow CPU that I don't run BOINC on but have in the past just for testing.
I decided to run seti on that last night to see how it would connect and down load units. On its first connection it got units, downloaded with no problems making connections.

Whatever is going on seems to be related to machines that have larger computing capacities. There have been hints on the message baords that the scheduler is aware of the capacity of the machines it is dowloading to. It seems to me machine capacity is related to this ongoing problem.

FWIW.

I have tried everything I know to do including the not geting work units trick, which used to work, to deleteing the project entirely and reloading from the beginning. So far, I get 1 unit and then nothing.
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Message 1307308 - Posted: 18 Nov 2012, 8:54:43 UTC - in response to Message 1307222.  

My client hasn't updated for days. I just tried (again) to manually update and it's still not uploading my finished WUs and it hasn't downloaded any new ones. In fact, it's doing nothing but deferring communication over and over.

Anyone know what's up?

Same here and no notice from SETI@home whatsoever. I hope the problems will be resolved shortly...
<--- Searching for this one ;-)
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Message 1307443 - Posted: 18 Nov 2012, 17:07:34 UTC
Last modified: 18 Nov 2012, 17:09:17 UTC

F Y I

I am using BOINC Version 7.0.28(64), wxWwidget version 2.8.10, BOINC manager shows that I have no work for my i7 870 PC 5663981 , Windows 7 Ultimate 64. This has been an ongoing problem for the last couple of months. My core2 6320 Windows XP 32, PC 6584825, is still getting work!

Now when I check the SETI site for my account, and then on the PC's for my account, there it shows 224 ghosts units are applied to this PC 5663981. I have Reset Seti@home multiple times, and I am still unable to remove these Ghost Units from my account. These ghost Work Units are set to expire sometimes in January 2013.

Until they are removed from my account, then I will have no choice but to move PC 5663981 to another project, that is until the problem with Ghost Units is corrected.

This is not the first time this project has had problems with WU's. I have long since removed my Nvidia GPU's to other useful BOINC scientific medical projects. There, their bandwidth is appreciated, thus not only giving enormous credits(682,005.13 RAC as a side bonus), to doing useful WU's for Medical Research.

Sometimes I do miss the old days before BOINC, with the original SETI program, and where my Windows 95 AMD K6-2 400, would take about 7 days to crunch just one WU. This was using a dial-up modem! I still have my first 100 Unit Certificate, given to me from Berkeley, somewhere. That 100 unit milestone took about 1 year to complete.
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Message 1307482 - Posted: 18 Nov 2012, 19:49:51 UTC

Hi
I live in Ukraine. Since 2004 my computer working for S@H. It never off, only when I update it. In my country orice for electricity not very low, but I pay, because I belive and want to know. Last week my computer OFF. No ne workunits. I'm sad and cry. I feel like doctors cut me hand or leg. My heart with S@H but my brain tell me thinking about other project.
I don't want say "Good bye SETI".
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Profile Gary Charpentier Crowdfunding Project Donor*Special Project $75 donorSpecial Project $250 donor
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Message 1307568 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 1:13:38 UTC - in response to Message 1306912.  

The problem is that the infrastructure (servers and bandwidth capacity) is way under what is needed for the current operation.

BINGO. There are more volunteers than there is data. Result frustration.

No, there's plenty of data, just not enough capacity to distribute it and collect the results.

I believe that is what I said. The only valid question is data being collected that never will be analyzed? The answer to that is no. Does it matter if the data is analyzed next week or next decade? No.

However there is a real issue. Is say the optical Seti search data being combined with radio Seti search data? No. That means if ET alternates between radio and optical contact methods, we won't find them. There is no single Seti clearing house.


http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=70080&postid=1307567
Well there it is. Too many people trying to crunch for SETI. We knew this day would come.


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Message 1307588 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 1:50:57 UTC - in response to Message 1307568.  

Well there it is. Too many people trying to crunch for SETI. We knew this day would come.
Well, maybe they should start and limit the number of WUs a single host can receive to cut down the the number of WUs that are "in progress" (forever).
Each time I check on one of my WUs that hasn't been validated in weeks, it comes down to a deadbeat cruncher hoarding thousands of WUs on a single host and then just abandoning them...
If there would be a way to weed those out, that would probably already help to level the issue at hand... :(

Ralf
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Message 1307719 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 14:44:00 UTC - in response to Message 1307588.  

Well there it is. Too many people trying to crunch for SETI. We knew this day would come.
Well, maybe they should start and limit the number of WUs a single host can receive to cut down the the number of WUs that are "in progress" (forever).

There is a limit of 100 CPU WUs and 100 GPU WUs per host. It's been in place for a couple of weeks.

Each time I check on one of my WUs that hasn't been validated in weeks, it comes down to a deadbeat cruncher hoarding thousands of WUs on a single host and then just abandoning them...
If there would be a way to weed those out, that would probably already help to level the issue at hand... :(

Ralf

Don't call them all deadbeats. They may just be having trouble getting through to report the ones they've finished.

I like to keep a large cache on board to carry me through "normal" server outages. However, right now I have 63 GPU WUs which aren't getting done anytime soon because I also have about 300 Einstein GPU WUs, which the computer downloaded when it couldn't get any from Seti (I assume that's what happened, anyway). It'll get to them eventually. I know how frustrating it is to see WUs you finished weeks ago still pending on your account page, but they will get done someday and you will get credit for them (unless they come out invalid on your part).

David
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Waiting for a message from a small furry creature from Alpha Centauri.

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Message 1307722 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 14:49:48 UTC - in response to Message 1307179.  

Matt; Some of the previous posts recommended doing other projects while waiting and waiting for Seti. That may have been a strategy to get users to use Seti less and maybe ultimately leave Seti and have more of Seti to themselves.

I don't think anyone would do that. Some would joke about doing it, but wouldn't really.

Whatever the reason As of now SETI community, I have taken the dedicated (Intel(R) Xeon(R)CPU X5650@ 2.67GHz[Family6 Model 44 Stepping 2](24 processors)NVIDIA GeForce GTX 465 (1023MB) driver: 301.42) away from the SETI Project because of inadequate Server Bandwidth and several Programing issues that impact overall Reliability and Functionally. All that has significantly diminished my sense of any doing any meaningful scientific contribution with Seti@Home. I started with SETI in June of 1999. I currently rank 9,667 out of 2,488,900 (99.6116 percentile)
I will keep the laptop,(Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU Q 740 @ 1.73GHz [Family 6 Model 30 Stepping 5](8 processors)NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460M (1535MB) driver: 306.23) with only 4 0f the 8 processors running because of heat issues. Token effort only to SETI.
I would say to the rest of the Seti Community "Good Luck" but think it will take more than that. Maybe with me not trying to get wu's or taking up Bandwidth it will be minimally better for the rest of you.

I hope you and several others who posted in the last few days understand that you can add other projects without dropping Seti. Just let the computer do whatever work it's able to get. You can even set your resource shares so that it will do all Seti when it can and switch to others only when it can't get Seti.

David
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Waiting for a message from a small furry creature from Alpha Centauri.

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TPCBF

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Message 1307734 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 15:56:15 UTC - in response to Message 1307719.  

Well there it is. Too many people trying to crunch for SETI. We knew this day would come.
Well, maybe they should start and limit the number of WUs a single host can receive to cut down the the number of WUs that are "in progress" (forever).

There is a limit of 100 CPU WUs and 100 GPU WUs per host. It's been in place for a couple of weeks.
Apparently not...
I just checked my oldest WU stuck in PV jail right now, and while it is not as bad as those folks with a couple thousands of WUs, this shows that this limit doesn't exist or doesn't work.
All tasks for computer 3988571
	
State: All (346) · In progress (288) · Validation pending (23) · Validation inconclusive (20) · Valid (12) · Invalid (0) · Error (3)
Application: All (346) · Astropulse v505 (0) · AstroPulse v6 (2) · SETI@home Enhanced (344) · SETI@home v7 (0) 
288 WUs in progress right now, while by your statement, this host should not have more than 200.
So either that limit doesn't exist or it doesn't work/there are ways around it...
Each time I check on one of my WUs that hasn't been validated in weeks, it comes down to a deadbeat cruncher hoarding thousands of WUs on a single host and then just abandoning them...
If there would be a way to weed those out, that would probably already help to level the issue at hand... :(

Don't call them all deadbeats. They may just be having trouble getting through to report the ones they've finished.
If they show as with no server contacts for more than 7 days, sorry, I just call them deadbeats, I don't think that I had any of my hosts have a problem contacting the servers for more than 3 or 4, and that was during the power outage saga...

Btw, above referenced host is contacting the servers more frequently, so it's not one of them, but still disproves the 100 WU limit your mentioned...

Ralf
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Profile Bernie Vine
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Message 1307744 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 16:20:07 UTC

If they show as with no server contacts for more than 7 days, sorry, I just call them deadbeats, I don't think that I had any of my hosts have a problem contacting the servers for more than 3 or 4, and that was during the power outage saga...


Sorry for being a "deadbeat" a while back when my HDD died and I couldn't afford a new one for a couple of weeks.

Then of course there was the time I had a PSU fail and I was working away. Still the time I had an MB fail I actually put the HDD in another cruncher with a shorter queue and avoided being a deadbeat.

I must try harder!
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Message 1307751 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 16:43:32 UTC

Thank you, Eric, for your informative post. Wish you all speed in returning things to fully operational status.

And the rest of you, PLEASE direct all further posts not directly related to Eric's post to the Number Crunching forum for your comments and discussions.
"Freedom is just Chaos, with better lighting." Alan Dean Foster

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TPCBF

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Message 1307756 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 16:59:46 UTC - in response to Message 1307744.  

If they show as with no server contacts for more than 7 days, sorry, I just call them deadbeats, I don't think that I had any of my hosts have a problem contacting the servers for more than 3 or 4, and that was during the power outage saga...


Sorry for being a "deadbeat" a while back when my HDD died and I couldn't afford a new one for a couple of weeks.

Then of course there was the time I had a PSU fail and I was working away. Still the time I had an MB fail I actually put the HDD in another cruncher with a shorter queue and avoided being a deadbeat.

I must try harder!
Maybe...

Seriously, while there are reasons why someone might not contact the server for a couple of weeks, if this is going on 4 weeks or more, with thousands of WUs sitting idle, someone isn't likely to have such bad luck (all in a row?) like you...
And it just takes a hundred hosts with a 1000 idle WUs and you have 100000 WUs clogging up the database for weeks.
And if someone has your bad luck, why have those WUs (in such amounts, I am not talking about 20 or 30 here...) sitting idle when it isn't likely that they will return in time without passing their deadline once whatever bad luck is involved is remedied?...

Why do have a few folks cause additional problems for the large number of working hosts?

Ralf
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Message 1307758 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 17:04:36 UTC - in response to Message 1307722.  

Matt; Some of the previous posts recommended doing other projects while waiting and waiting for Seti. That may have been a strategy to get users to use Seti less and maybe ultimately leave Seti and have more of Seti to themselves.

I don't think anyone would do that. Some would joke about doing it, but wouldn't really.

Whatever the reason As of now SETI community, I have taken the dedicated (Intel(R) Xeon(R)CPU X5650@ 2.67GHz[Family6 Model 44 Stepping 2](24 processors)NVIDIA GeForce GTX 465 (1023MB) driver: 301.42) away from the SETI Project because of inadequate Server Bandwidth and several Programing issues that impact overall Reliability and Functionally. All that has significantly diminished my sense of any doing any meaningful scientific contribution with Seti@Home. I started with SETI in June of 1999. I currently rank 9,667 out of 2,488,900 (99.6116 percentile)
I will keep the laptop,(Intel(R) Core(TM) i7 CPU Q 740 @ 1.73GHz [Family 6 Model 30 Stepping 5](8 processors)NVIDIA GeForce GTX 460M (1535MB) driver: 306.23) with only 4 0f the 8 processors running because of heat issues. Token effort only to SETI.
I would say to the rest of the Seti Community "Good Luck" but think it will take more than that. Maybe with me not trying to get wu's or taking up Bandwidth it will be minimally better for the rest of you.

I hope you and several others who posted in the last few days understand that you can add other projects without dropping Seti. Just let the computer do whatever work it's able to get. You can even set your resource shares so that it will do all Seti when it can and switch to others only when it can't get Seti.


I have run 3,385,632 seti work units over at primegrid since october 15th,because of trouble getting seti work units. I have been a dedicated seti participant since june of 2002.
Now with green bank coming on line soon I think it is time to consider what we want to do with seti? With Arecibo all we could get was a random sampling of the sky,with green bank we will be looking at systems with planets. A budget roughly equal to the paycheck's for the employees at one micky d's may have made since for the shot in the dark like Arecibo was.
But now we are going to be looking at planetary system were life could be expected to be found. With it literally thousands of times more likely that seti can find Proof.
The server problems are not because too many people are running seti,it is that we,toughs that have interest in seti have failed to provide adequate support to seti both financial and moral. If you can donate a dollar a month if you can't then let amd know that you use their products to do seti and that it is embarrassing how little of their stuff is in the top 100,The same goes for intel and nvidia. If a business donates equipment put a link to their business on your personal or team setup If you come up with a good idea post it,seti is at least as important as the sky search for harmful asteroids and ten years ago it had the budget of a micky d's. Just remember the minimum donation is $10 so even if you have to save up to do that it is not to painful.
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Message 1307762 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 17:16:04 UTC - in response to Message 1307734.  

Apparently not...
I just checked my oldest WU stuck in PV jail right now, and while it is not as bad as those folks with a couple thousands of WUs, this shows that this limit doesn't exist or doesn't work...

Apparently, you are looking at the wrong numbers. The 100/100 limits apply to tasks actually downloaded, not to tasks listed as "in progress" (probably ghosts anyway).

Gruß,
Gundolf
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Message 1307768 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 17:36:40 UTC - in response to Message 1307762.  

Apparently not...
I just checked my oldest WU stuck in PV jail right now, and while it is not as bad as those folks with a couple thousands of WUs, this shows that this limit doesn't exist or doesn't work...

Apparently, you are looking at the wrong numbers. The 100/100 limits apply to tasks actually downloaded, not to tasks listed as "in progress" (probably ghosts anyway).

Gruß,
Gundolf

Which if resend missing results is on will un-ghost as the overworked bandwidth clears.

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Message 1307795 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 18:15:38 UTC - in response to Message 1307762.  

Apparently not...
I just checked my oldest WU stuck in PV jail right now, and while it is not as bad as those folks with a couple thousands of WUs, this shows that this limit doesn't exist or doesn't work...

Apparently, you are looking at the wrong numbers. The 100/100 limits apply to tasks actually downloaded, not to tasks listed as "in progress" (probably ghosts anyway).

Gruß,
Gundolf

Not exactly, the limits exists and are working, but the limits do not affect the number of tasks that were assigned to you before they were applied.
This means that you wont get new assigned work until your pending WUs get under 100/100, meanwhile if you succeed getting work you will get those already assigned WUs as resends, and the number of pending WUs should not grow unless it goes under 200.
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Message 1307797 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 18:21:28 UTC
Last modified: 19 Nov 2012, 18:21:47 UTC

Keep up with the news - just now there is nothing being downloaded, read this from Eric-
http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=70080

And don't clog up the news with inaccurate debates about what is/isn't going on.
Bob Smith
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Somewhere in the (un)known Universe?
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Message 1307803 - Posted: 19 Nov 2012, 18:31:19 UTC - in response to Message 1307762.  

Apparently not...
I just checked my oldest WU stuck in PV jail right now, and while it is not as bad as those folks with a couple thousands of WUs, this shows that this limit doesn't exist or doesn't work...

Apparently, you are looking at the wrong numbers. The 100/100 limits apply to tasks actually downloaded, not to tasks listed as "in progress" (probably ghosts anyway).

Gruß,
Gundolf
Besten Dank für den Gruß, ;-)

but I don't think that I am looking at the wrong numbers.
Ghosts or not, the basic problem might be very well the same, a huge number of WUs just sitting idle in the database waiting to expire and being resend...

I rather think that it's the continuing case of RAC happy folks just filling up a week of WUs "just in case" and then abandoning the project when they don't see the result they expect in their numbers.

I will start a new thread for posting examples of those cases that I am referring to next time I see this again ("SETI Wall of shame" <LOL>)

Ralf
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