Black Holes part 2

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Message 1453866 - Posted: 14 Dec 2013, 11:12:55 UTC
Last modified: 14 Dec 2013, 11:13:19 UTC

Not really about black holes but I didn't know where else to post this. Keeping an open mind with this one...

http://www.collective-evolution.com/2013/03/08/nasa-discovers-hidden-portals-in-earths-magnetic-field/

Mainstream science continues to grow further, but I often get confused between mainstream science, and science that is formed in the black budget world. It seems that information and discovery isn’t information and discovery without the type of ‘proof’ that the human race requires. Given that the human race requires, and has a certain criteria for ‘proof’, which has been taught to us by the academic world, information can easily be suppressed by concealing that ‘proof’. It’s no secret that the department of defence receives trillions of dollars that go unaccounted for and everything developed within the United States Air Force Space Agency remains classified. They are able to classify information for the sake of ‘national security’. Within the past few years, proof has been emerging for a number of phenomenon that would suggest a whole other scientific world that operates separately from mainstream science.


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Message 1453876 - Posted: 14 Dec 2013, 12:00:55 UTC - in response to Message 1453874.  

Disn't they used to be called Ley lines?



The Ley lines have a more spiritual and mystical connotation, no?
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Message 1454446 - Posted: 16 Dec 2013, 12:11:39 UTC - in response to Message 1453879.  

Meh, whether they really have the technology to bring ET home I very much doubt. But, with the billions of dollars the US government spends on R&D, and with only a part of that budget being unclassified its not such a stretch to say that the US has developed technology that the general public is still unaware off.

I mean, just in case you are interested, take a look at the unclassified budget for the US army, airforce and navy. Imagine what we could achieve if those kind of research budgets were made available for civilian research institutions.
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Message 1456539 - Posted: 23 Dec 2013, 6:42:22 UTC - in response to Message 1454446.  

The question as to who killed the radio star has finally been answered — it wasn’t killed, it committed suicide by changing itself into a black hole, just like many other radio stars. According to researchers in a December 20 press release, a certain kind of radio star turns off its radio transmission prior to going ka-bloo-ie, falling in upon itself, and changing into a black hole, while other radio stars turn into neutron stars.

http://guardianlv.com/2013/12/radio-stars-not-killed-just-changed-into-black-holes/
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Message 1461954 - Posted: 8 Jan 2014, 23:00:21 UTC - in response to Message 1456539.  

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/chandra/news/death-by-black-hole.html#.Us3XSfvTDSc
Death By Black Hole In Small Galaxy?

A bright, long duration flare may be the first recorded event of a black hole destroying a star in a dwarf galaxy. The evidence comes from two independent studies using data from NASA’s Chandra X-ray Observatory and other telescopes.



A dwarf galaxy is located in the galaxy cluster Abell 1795.
Image Credit:
X-ray: NASA/CXC/Univ. of Alabama/W.P.Maksym et al & NASA/CXC
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Message 1463986 - Posted: 13 Jan 2014, 17:24:31 UTC

Astronomers have discovered more than 100 small, dwarf galaxies with characteristics indicating that they harbor massive black holes feeding on surrounding gas; this could help resolve the question as to how black holes originated and grew in the early universe.
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Message 1467948 - Posted: 24 Jan 2014, 0:37:47 UTC - in response to Message 1463986.  

Astronomers have used NASA's Chandra X-ray Observatory and a suite of other telescopes to reveal one of the most powerful black holes known. The black hole has created enormous structures in the hot gas surrounding it and prevented trillions of stars from forming.

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/chandra/multimedia/extreme-black-hole-power.html#.UuG0RPtMHSc

Pic's found in link.

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Message 1468490 - Posted: 25 Jan 2014, 0:27:48 UTC - in response to Message 1467948.  

Notion of an 'event horizon', from which nothing can escape, is incompatible with quantum theory, physicist claims.

http://www.nature.com/news/stephen-hawking-there-are-no-black-holes-1.14583
Stephen Hawking: 'There are no black holes'

update..
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Message 1468604 - Posted: 25 Jan 2014, 8:02:28 UTC

Most interesting...Thanx Lynn:)
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Message 1468690 - Posted: 25 Jan 2014, 12:52:24 UTC

That is truly fascinating! I have always liked the singularity theory, as you would have just one chunk of mass that has infinite density. It can vary in size, but it takes a lot of mass to equal a small amount of size do to the compression.

It's too bad, we can't perform direct measurements to confirm the nature of these gravitational collapses.

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Message 1468718 - Posted: 25 Jan 2014, 14:28:28 UTC
Last modified: 25 Jan 2014, 14:31:13 UTC

Probably mentioned it before (maybe even in this thread... heh) but I have no idea why physicists/cosmologists don't seem to consider GR time dilation in the collapse when an object nears its Schwarzchild radius/event horizon. From our perspective, it would asymptotically approach this size and never reach it, never mind collapse to a point of infinite density. Any "true" black holes inside their own event horizons would have to be primordial.

The non-primordial ones, then, could be 99.99% or whatever arbitrary closeness time permits of the way there and have all the effects that black holes are supposed to have on the space and matter around them, but could never attain that last fraction in finite time. No infinite densities thus no breakdown of physical laws to have to deal with.
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Message 1468724 - Posted: 25 Jan 2014, 14:33:23 UTC - in response to Message 1468490.  
Last modified: 25 Jan 2014, 14:41:17 UTC

Notion of an 'event horizon', from which nothing can escape, is incompatible with quantum theory, physicist claims.

http://www.nature.com/news/stephen-hawking-there-are-no-black-holes-1.14583
Stephen Hawking: 'There are no black holes'

update..

Interesting indeed.

The popular press always seem to emphasize the 'singularity' view. Meanwhile, the effects upon time always seem to get ignored... Far too complicated for mere journalists to even dream about?

'Black holes' were initially described by astrophysicists/astronomers as "frozen stars" to emphasize the significance of the time effects... Hence my pet theory that we can never get to suffering a 'singularity' because there is never enough time for one to develop to become 'an infinity'... (Time in effect 'slows down' as viewed by an 'outside observer' as gravity increases.)

I've always been uneasy about what happens to material/radiation as it approaches the 'event horizon' from the outside or from the inside... Do you get to suffer an infinity of material/energy piling up across space and time in that region?...



Keep searchin',
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Message 1468822 - Posted: 25 Jan 2014, 18:30:23 UTC - in response to Message 1468718.  

Probably mentioned it before (maybe even in this thread... heh) but I have no idea why physicists/cosmologists don't seem to consider GR time dilation in the collapse when an object nears its Schwarzchild radius/event horizon. From our perspective, it would asymptotically approach this size and never reach it, never mind collapse to a point of infinite density. Any "true" black holes inside their own event horizons would have to be primordial.

The non-primordial ones, then, could be 99.99% or whatever arbitrary closeness time permits of the way there and have all the effects that black holes are supposed to have on the space and matter around them, but could never attain that last fraction in finite time. No infinite densities thus no breakdown of physical laws to have to deal with.

No doubt the specialists know all about the subtle physics, it's just that the subtleties don't make it to the pop press.

You sometimes run into the deprecated moniker "frozen stars" in reference to black holes. That refers to just what you are talking about...from the external universe's standpoint the collapse never actually happens.

For someone falling through the event horizon it does. But for the falling observer, the external universe would speed up such that the entire future history of everything would flash by as the horizon is passed. To me that means that all the radiation (starlight, mostly) that would fall into the black hole over all the rest of time would blast the falling observer in an instant. That can't be pleasant.

That also suggests to me that once (if somehow) the observer is inside the horizon, the external universe has ended. All time has passed, and more. Or something. As I've said before I wish we had some real astrophysicists around here sometimes.
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Message 1469125 - Posted: 26 Jan 2014, 14:34:20 UTC

Prof.Hawking has proposed that black holes are really gray holes. Read this:
Gray Holes
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Message 1469319 - Posted: 26 Jan 2014, 23:18:29 UTC - in response to Message 1469125.  

Prof.Hawking has proposed that black holes are really gray holes. Read this:
Gray Holes
Tullio


Thanks Tullio, for the article.

I'm not a huge fan of Prof.Hawking. He has been proven wrong on Black Holes, before.

I remember this documentary which aired some time ago.

http://icecoldscience.blogspot.com/2011/07/hawking-paradox-aka-hawking-vs-susskind.html
The Hawking Paradox aka Hawking vs Susskind
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Message 1469412 - Posted: 27 Jan 2014, 6:26:07 UTC - in response to Message 1469319.  

I admire prof. Hawking for what he is doing despite his physical condition. A theoretical physicist who is also a far relative of mine and has fallen ill like him does nothing but crying.
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Message 1469426 - Posted: 27 Jan 2014, 7:30:30 UTC - in response to Message 1469412.  
Last modified: 27 Jan 2014, 7:32:50 UTC

I admire prof. Hawking for what he is doing despite his physical condition. A theoretical physicist who is also a far relative of mine and has fallen ill like him does nothing but crying.
Tullio



Tullio, I'm not a huge fan of Prof.Hawking. In no way did I ever or even implied about his physical condition. I'm sorry if you read my post like that. :(
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Message 1469440 - Posted: 27 Jan 2014, 8:37:33 UTC - in response to Message 1469426.  

No, I did not misread your post. You were talking about science, but I see Hawking as a suffering human being, like my brother-in-law.
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Message 1470662 - Posted: 30 Jan 2014, 7:57:52 UTC

Active supermassive black holes revealed in merging galaxies


Astronomers have conducted infrared observations of luminous, gas-rich, merging galaxies to study active, mass-accreting supermassive black holes (SMBHs). They found that at least one SMBH almost always becomes active and luminous by accreting a large amount of material


It is now believed that many galaxies have supermassive black holes at their centers, and that whether such galaxies are active galaxies is a question of whether mass is being fed into these black holes. The simplest ideas for the origin of such supermassive black holes are that they are conglomerations of many star-size black holes that were formed during the history of a galaxy, or perhaps that galaxies formed around large black holes that then grew by accreting matter.
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Message 1481878 - Posted: 26 Feb 2014, 11:37:43 UTC

Clouds seen circling supermassive black hole

Astronomers see huge clouds of gas orbiting supermassive black holes at the centres of galaxies. Once thought to be a relatively uniform, fog-like ring, the accreting matter instead forms clumps dense enough to intermittently dim the intense radiation blazing forth as these enormous objects condense and consume matter.


In 2003, scientists discovered what seemed to be a cloud of gas, termed G2, which should collide in March or thereabouts with the supermassive black hole that lurks at the heart of the Milky Way. The interaction will reveal much about this black hole.
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Message boards : Science (non-SETI) : Black Holes part 2


 
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