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Might this be unexpectedly important for Life? (Spherical Sun)
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ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Now here is a highly unexpected curiosity... Our sun is almost precisely spherical!... Sun is the most perfect sphere ever observed in nature ... the first precise measurement of the sun's equatorial bulge, or its "oblateness". The results were a big surprise. "We were shocked,"... How many other stars might match that? And might that matter? Keep searchin', Martin (Sorry for the multiple bad puns! :-) ) See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Johnney Guinness Send message Joined: 11 Sep 06 Posts: 3093 Credit: 2,652,287 RAC: 0 |
Martin, The story is mildly interesting, at best! What interests me more is that every time i read an astronomy article, the astronomers use words like "surprised" and "shocked" and "amazing" and "shocking" and "unexpected" to describe every single discovery. I mean, come off it! Is it really "shocking" that the Sun is spherical? What, is the astronomer looking for a Nobel prize for the discovery or something? He found out that the Sun is round.......Woooow! What a shock! John. |
Bob DeWoody Send message Joined: 9 May 10 Posts: 3387 Credit: 4,182,900 RAC: 10 |
Well stars that spin very fast do have a significant equatorial bulge but I can't see where that would inhibit the development of life on one of it's planets if all the other factors favor it's development. Bob DeWoody My motto: Never do today what you can put off until tomorrow as it may not be required. This no longer applies in light of current events. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
... The story is mildly interesting, at best! Quite an understatement there... What interests me more is that every time i read an astronomy article, the astronomers use words like "surprised" and "shocked" and "amazing" and "shocking" and "unexpected" to describe every single discovery. Don't be misled by glib irreverent trash media trying to drum up a few extra clicks for their advertisers... I mean, come off it! Is it really "shocking" that the Sun is spherical? What, is the astronomer looking for a Nobel prize for the discovery or something? He found out that the Sun is round.......Woooow! What a shock! That is indeed a huge shock. We do not know of any other stars that might be as perfectly round. A comparable example might be for a slow-rotation neutron star but I don't think they can exist. Perhaps possible for a magnetar that has be dragged down to a slow rate by 'dynamo' effects?... (All stars can be expected to have a large bulge at their equators. A bit like a squashed doughnut.) Keep searchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Well stars that spin very fast do have a significant equatorial bulge but I can't see where that would inhibit the development of life on one of it's planets if all the other factors favor it's development. That is something very unusual, and we assume intelligent life to be unusual. All an unconnected coincidence? Keep searchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Well stars that spin very fast do have a significant equatorial bulge but I can't see where that would inhibit the development of life on one of it's planets if all the other factors favor it's development. Perhaps... The mix of material, mass and angular momentum for our solar system that generated such a slowly rotating super-spherical long-lived stable sun is also consequently 'just right' for the orbital differentiation to give rise to an iron cored (magnetic field protected) water world at just the right orbit and rotation for that size of sun to give a good possibility for a rich variety of life to develop... (Trying not to be anthropomorphic about this! ;-) ) Keep searchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
William Rothamel Send message Joined: 25 Oct 06 Posts: 3756 Credit: 1,999,735 RAC: 4 |
There are perhaps many more conditions and narrow parameters for each of them for life as we know it to start and thrive. |
Johnney Guinness Send message Joined: 11 Sep 06 Posts: 3093 Credit: 2,652,287 RAC: 0 |
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tullio Send message Joined: 9 Apr 04 Posts: 8797 Credit: 2,930,782 RAC: 1 |
There are perhaps many more conditions and narrow parameters for each of them for life as we know it to start and thrive. That would recall the Gaia hypothesis by James Lovelock and Lynn Margulis, which goes back to the ideas of Pierre Teilhard De Chardin, SJ, and Vladimir Vernadsky. "The global ecosystem ia a superorganism with a whole much greater than the sum of its parts. This vision is clearly theological". from "A globe, clothing itself with a brain", by Jennifer Cobb Kreisberg. But I've lost the link, I have only a hard copy of the article in Wired News, June 1995. Tullio |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Yet another "mystery" surrounding the Sun: scientists working with the Solar Dynamics Observatory (SDO) have observed that the Sun is far too perfectly round. Centrifugal forces in a rotating ball of gas should make the Sun wider at its equator than along its axis -- that's the requirement of the standard model. Unfortunately, 'Conspiracists' will see conspiracy in the normal scientific method in that even as we find new discoveries, the science must somehow be conspiring to 'hide' the answer... I guess it is all a game of expanding The Horizon of Ignorance! ;-) Keep searchin', Martin (As you discover and learn more, you then know more to search yet further, and so your sphere of knowledge expands to push the horizon of ignorance a little further away. But also, as you know more, you also come to better appreciate how very much more there is yet to learn as the horizon expands further... ;-) ) See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
A 'new' idea for our super-spherical sun is that it is so perfectly spherical because the dominant effect that determines its shape is NOT gravity!... Our sun may well be so perfectly spherical because its outer reaches (the chromosphere) is actually an electrically driven gas "plasma ball"... I think that is quite a plausible idea. The electrical and magnetic forces at play can be greatly stronger than gravity. However, I suspect that the more dense interior will still be oblate as is expected for a gravitational rotating object. I wonder if solar seismic observations might reveal that... Keep searchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Fred J. Verster Send message Joined: 21 Apr 04 Posts: 3252 Credit: 31,903,643 RAC: 0 |
---[snipped]---
I would be shocked if the sun is a cubus or piramid ;-) It also could be an alien power-plant.....but I think "they" prefer a black-hole! |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
---[snipped]--- Nah... Don't be daft! The angles are far too obtuse for stable physics. Those old shapes prove to be too inefficient. You get a far more robust physical order from pentagon or hexagon forms to generate a much more powerful dynamo force for far higher power outputs. As has been noted also for Saturn and Jupiter... Keep searchin', Martin ;-) See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Johnney Guinness Send message Joined: 11 Sep 06 Posts: 3093 Credit: 2,652,287 RAC: 0 |
This seems to me to be another conspiracy theory. Next we'll have that aliens built the sun and its not a star at all! Chris, You actually make sense there. Over the last 2 years, i have given a lot of thought about if aliens might actually be living inside the Sun. Maybe the Sun is hollow on the inside! Maybe all those ancient people that were praying to "Sun Gods" weren't mad after all! Maybe they weren't praying to the Sun, but instead they were praying to the Gods living inside the Sun! I wouldn't completely rule it out! .....LOL John. |
Lint trap Send message Joined: 30 May 03 Posts: 871 Credit: 28,092,319 RAC: 0 |
Yet another "mystery" surrounding the Sun: scientists working with the Solar Dynamics Observatory (SDO) have observed that the Sun is far too perfectly round. Centrifugal forces in a rotating ball of gas should make the Sun wider at its equator than along its axis -- that's the requirement of the standard model. Well, the "experts" can't decide what a planet really is...so, why should we trust them to be able to find a real Star?? :) Lt |
Johnney Guinness Send message Joined: 11 Sep 06 Posts: 3093 Credit: 2,652,287 RAC: 0 |
Martin, When you first posted this story, i was overly sarcastic in my response. But in the mean time, i have given this "Spherical Sun" story quite a bit of thought. But your right, this news about the Sun being perfectly spherical is very significant. Its significant because it breaks Newtons laws of gravity and Einsteins special and general relativity. Simply put, if the Sun is spinning, it should "bulge" a bit in the middle, but it doesn't! So Newton and Einstein were both wrong! Both theories are wrong! John. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
... i have given this "Spherical Sun" story quite a bit of thought. How so? Simply put, if the Sun is spinning, it should "bulge" a bit in the middle, but it doesn't! So Newton and Einstein were both wrong! Both theories are wrong! Indeed so... Upon first glance that is... So yes, that is why the "perfect sphere" aspect is so very interesting. An equatorial bulge, just as we significantly have here on Earth, would be very much expected. However, for our sun, such a bulge is not there, at all! So... What are the possibilities?...
See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
tullio Send message Joined: 9 Apr 04 Posts: 8797 Credit: 2,930,782 RAC: 1 |
The Sun is not a solid sphere. It is rotating in 25 days at the equator and in 27 days at a 40 degrees latitude. So the centrifugal force is much weaker than that of Earth, which rotates once a day. Tullio |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20147 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
Thanks Tullio: Including the differential rotation, three more clues there... There's also the question of why so slow a rotation?... Another clue? ;-) Keep searchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
tullio Send message Joined: 9 Apr 04 Posts: 8797 Credit: 2,930,782 RAC: 1 |
The relative slowness of the Sun's rotation is put in relationship with its mass in the first chapter of "Cosmogony of the solar system" by Fred Hoyle. It the Sun had a bigger mass it could rotate faster, otherwise it would disintegrate. This is what I gathered from reading the chapter. Tullio |
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