Decoding the Biblical Book of Revelation


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Profile Johnney Guinness
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Message 1267517 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 13:54:24 UTC
Last modified: 4 Aug 2012, 13:58:02 UTC

Decoding the Biblical Book of Revelation

The Biblical Book of Revelation has NEVER been decoded! Would anyone like to try decoding or interpreting it? Its a challenge and anyone can try, even if your an atheist or agnostic its still worth a try.

The Bible; Book of Revelation (Online Bible)
http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation+1&version=NIV

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Book_of_Revelation

It was written around 68 or 69 AD, shortly after the death of Jesus Christ. Its the last book of the Christian Bible and as the name suggests, the Book of Revelation, if you can decode or interpret it, will "reveal" what will happen shortly before the return of the Messiah.

Right from the start, Book of Revelation is written in very "coded" and very "poetic" language. Many people think they know what it means, but they don't. There is NO general consensus on the meaning of ANY of the stuff in the book. But many people suggest that we are currently living in the "End times" and the Book of Revelation is describing many of the religious, scientific and political events that are happening around the world right now.

There are loads of good "characters" in the Book of Revelation. Like "The Beast" who is associated with the number "666". And there is "The Dragon". There is more than one Dragon mentioned in Book of Revelation. Then there is "The Lamb", which all priests assume represents Jesus, the Lamb of God. But the Lamb in the Book of Revelation is not Jesus! And there are the "24 Elders" and a variety of other characters.

Does anyone here want to have a go at decoding Book of Revelation? Why not have a go at decoding it! Its not a big book, you can read it in about an hour.

John.
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Message 1267522 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 13:57:04 UTC

It'll be a lot easier to just go out & buy a word search puzzle book....

..at least they are designed that way & make sense.
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Message 1267543 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 14:52:32 UTC - in response to Message 1267522.

It'll be a lot easier to just go out & buy a word search puzzle book....

..at least they are designed that way & make sense.


Yes and the answers are crystall clear. No need for experts to tell you your interpretation is wrong.
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Message 1267568 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 16:56:23 UTC - in response to Message 1267517.

Decoding the Biblical Book of Revelation

....

Does anyone here want to have a go at decoding Book of Revelation? Why not have a go at decoding it! Its not a big book, you can read it in about an hour. ...

Already done by better minds than I, and over much longer than just a mere hour:


BBC: Revelation

... So it seems that the Book of Revelation is not prophesising the end of the world but is a polemic against the Roman Empire.

John frames his attack in a way that parallels other religious writings of the time and which would have made sense to early Christians.

John was telling first century Christians to galvanise themselves against compromising with Rome, and that their faithfulness would be rewarded.



Interpreting Revelation

... The Book of Revelation appears to be ambiguous, and open to many interpretations. This severely weakens the concept of biblical inerrancy and the belief that God inspired the authors of the Bible to write books free of error and ambiguity.

Unfortunately, as in so many other important Christian beliefs there is no way to harmonize the diversity of Christian belief. Even within the evangelical wing of Christianity there are many conflicting opinions about fundamental beliefs. Some suggest that believers can pray to God to seek the correct interpretation from among the beliefs that have been suggested. Unfortunately, a pilot study that we performed appears to show that a person cannot assess the will of God through prayer.

Some interpretations of Revelation have led writers to prophesy catastrophic events in their own future. Fortunately none of their predictions have ever come true. We will have to wait to see in the prophecies about our future will materialize -- particularly those involving the winter solstice in 2012. But with a 100% failure rate to date, it is difficult to place much confidence about prophecies of events in our future.



Sorry, yes those are "internet quotes", but they do nicely follow what I have seen for myself. Good to see the main points presented so clearly.

Interesting how "666" for the number of the beast (Nero) may well be in error and should actually be "616" (Caligula). Or was that number updated in the light of even greater excesses by the later Nero?... (What?! The Bible changes?)


For fabulous interpretations, there's enough ambiguity there for many more books! You could put yourself on the gravy train for life... ;-)

Keep searchin',
Martin

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Message 1267639 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 19:33:10 UTC - in response to Message 1267596.
Last modified: 4 Aug 2012, 19:35:33 UTC

Uhh......
I have no problem discerning the Lord's meanings......even if obscured by some language barriers.

The kitties don't need no stinking decoder ring.

Douglas Adams included a very significant cat 'advising' the running of our Galaxy in his writing... (HHGTTG ...)


Keep searchin',
Martin
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Message 1267665 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 20:06:20 UTC
Last modified: 4 Aug 2012, 20:11:56 UTC

Martin,
Concerning the number 666 and the emperor Nero, the evidence is really really thin!! The number 666, or 616 if you prefer, are just numbers, thats all!! And there are thousands of ways to use numbers to give you an answer equal to 666. I have seen numerous people mathematically connected to the number 666 including president Obama, the Pope, Hitler, George Bush, Gandhi, Mother Teresa and many more!

The point being, nobody has it!! Nobody has decoded the book, ever!!

Question; So how would you know if someone's interpretation of the book was correct?

Answer; You would know if they were correct if their interpretation accurately described all of the "characters" that appear in the book, without exception! Any interpretation would "fit" all the figures in the book.

From Wikipedia;
Figures in Revelation In order of appearance:

1.John of Patmos
2.The angel who reveals the Revelation of Jesus Christ
3.The One who sits on the Throne
4.Twenty-four crowned elders
5.Four living creatures
6.The Lion of Judah who is the seven horned Lamb with seven eyes
7.Four Horsemen of the Apocalypse
8.Four angels holding the four winds of the Earth
9.The seal-bearer angel
10.Seven angelic trumpeters
11.The star called Wormwood
12.Angel of Woe
13.Scorpion-tailed Locusts
14.Four angels bound to the great river Euphrates
15.Two hundred million lion-headed cavalry
16.The mighty angel of Seven thunders
17.The Two witnesses
18.Beast of the Sea having seven heads and ten horns
19.The woman and her child
20.The Dragon, fiery red with seven heads
21.Michael the Archangel
22.Lamb-horned Beast of the Earth
23.Image of the Beast of the sea
24.The False Prophet
25.Whore of Babylon
26.Death and Hades

So everybody is just guessing until someone produces an interpretation that accurately matches all the characters.

So this mystery is not solved by any means.

My personal interpretation;
The Book of Revelation is a 100% accurate description of a set of events that have happened, or are about to happen very shortly!

John.
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Message 1267695 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 21:27:41 UTC - in response to Message 1267665.
Last modified: 4 Aug 2012, 21:29:29 UTC

Martin,
Concerning the number 666 and the emperor Nero, the evidence is really really thin!! The number 666, or 616 if you prefer, are just numbers, thats all!! And there are thousands of ways to use numbers to give you an answer equal to 666. I have seen numerous people mathematically connected to the number 666 including president Obama, the Pope, Hitler, George Bush, Gandhi, Mother Teresa and many more! ...

Indeed so. Such is the game of the "Bible Code"...

Those numbers are only significant for whatever significance is placed upon them. The numerical obfuscation is analogous to using an anagram or pseudonym for a controversial or 'dangerous' name. There's also the significance placed upon "7" being 'good' and 'holy' and so "666" being the number of the beast intimates that the beast is not as good or great as "7" despite the extra "6"s going spare... And there's other ideas depending upon your interpretations.

The contemporary names of Nero and Caligula are a very good bet for the context and time of the writing...


... So everybody is just guessing until someone produces an interpretation that accurately matches all the characters.

So this mystery is not solved by any means.

Lots of twos and fours and sevens and lamb in all that lot. Similar divination as with Kubla Khan?...


My personal interpretation;
The Book of Revelation is a 100% accurate description of a set of events that have happened, or are about to happen very shortly!

Hey! You can't hedge your bets both ways!!


I still favour the interpretation of that book being the dire apocalyptic writing of a prisoner of Rome lost on a lonely island prison...

Keep searchin',
Martin
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Message 1267734 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 22:52:20 UTC - in response to Message 1267695.


I still favour the interpretation of that book being the dire apocalyptic writing of a prisoner of Rome lost on a lonely island prison...
Martin



..has anyone ever stopped to think that the bible is.....

..one of the first fictional novels to enter print a la "Dan Brown's Da Vinci Code"?
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Message 1267737 - Posted: 4 Aug 2012, 23:00:19 UTC - in response to Message 1267695.
Last modified: 4 Aug 2012, 23:10:07 UTC


My personal interpretation;
The Book of Revelation is a 100% accurate description of a set of events that have happened, or are about to happen very shortly!

Hey! You can't hedge your bets both ways!!


I still favour the interpretation of that book being the dire apocalyptic writing of a prisoner of Rome lost on a lonely island prison...

Keep searchin',
Martin

Martin,
Its good! I think we are both seeing eye to eye here. That book is heavily loaded with analogies and metaphor's that are really difficult to decode. The descriptions of "The Lamb" and "The Beast", and "The Dragon", and the "24 Elders and 4 living creatures" are very very detailed, they are immensely detailed!! This is why i think they very very accurate analogies or metaphor's for something very precise!!

Ok, i won't hedge my bets! I think the Book of Revelation is a 100% accurate description of events that are happening RIGHT NOW in the world today!

Question; How could someone "prophesy" about the future?

Answer; They can't, full stop!! But there is a big BUT here!!

This what you can do Martin. You can describe something that exists today, using an analogy, that will look exactly the same 2,000 years from now! An example would be to describe "The Giza Pyramids". Today the Giza Pyramids look almost exactly the same as they did 4,500 years ago. So i could use a metaphor to poetically describe them like this -
Metaphor for the Giza Pyramids;
"In the end times, before the return of the Gods, the great sandstone beast will crumble. The skin of the Beast will crumble like cake, and creatures (Archaeologists) will enter the belly of the beast and plunder the guts of the beast"

Now thats an example of me describing archaeologists entering the crumbling Giza pyramids and removing the treasures from inside the pyramids. Martin thats what i think all the metaphor's in the book of revelation are. They are all accurate metaphor's for events that are happening right now today. That book can be decoded! Now the Giza Pyramids thing was just an example, i don't believe they are mentioned in the Book of Revelation. But you get the point i'm making? Writing stuff like that, you can "prophesy" about the future! We know very well that the pyrimads will still be there 2,000 years from now. Nobody is going to steal the actual pyrimads. So its a safe bet to "prophesy" that people will break into the pyrimads at some stage in the future!

John.
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Message 1267818 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 7:03:28 UTC

I seriously think that poor old John had a bad trip that was so vivid he was able to remember it and write it down the next day. You have to remember that both Opium and Hashish would have been available in ancient Palestine or maybe it was too much of the local rough red.

People have predicting the "end of days" ever since Revelations was first published, particularly during the middle ages when plague and warfare were rampant.

On average there is at least one person per year claiming that they have "decoded" Revelations and Armageddon will occur on a specific date. As pointed out above, so far all of them have been wrong. Obviously, by sheer law of averages, one day, one of the doom sayers will turn out to be right.

I can just imagine that their last living act will be to put their thumbs in their ears and go "nyaah, nyaah, nyahh" at those who mocked them :-)

T.A.

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Message 1267840 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 9:32:52 UTC - in response to Message 1267737.
Last modified: 5 Aug 2012, 11:47:29 UTC


My personal interpretation;
The Book of Revelation is a 100% accurate description of a set of events that have happened, or are about to happen very shortly!

Hey! You can't hedge your bets both ways!!


I still favour the interpretation of that book being the dire apocalyptic writing of a prisoner of Rome lost on a lonely island prison...

Keep searchin',
Martin

Martin,
Its good! I think we are both seeing eye to eye here. That book is heavily loaded with analogies and metaphor's that are really difficult to decode. The descriptions of "The Lamb" and "The Beast", and "The Dragon", and the "24 Elders and 4 living creatures" are very very detailed, they are immensely detailed!! This is why i think they very very accurate analogies or metaphor's for something very precise!!

Ok, i won't hedge my bets! I think the Book of Revelation is a 100% accurate description of events that are happening RIGHT NOW in the world today!

Question; How could someone "prophesy" about the future?

Answer; They can't, full stop!! But there is a big BUT here!!

This what you can do Martin. You can describe something that exists today, using an analogy, that will look exactly the same 2,000 years from now! An example would be to describe "The Giza Pyramids". Today the Giza Pyramids look almost exactly the same as they did 4,500 years ago. So i could use a metaphor to poetically describe them like this -
Metaphor for the Giza Pyramids;
"In the end times, before the return of the Gods, the great sandstone beast will crumble. The skin of the Beast will crumble like cake, and creatures (Archaeologists) will enter the belly of the beast and plunder the guts of the beast"

Now thats an example of me describing archaeologists entering the crumbling Giza pyramids and removing the treasures from inside the pyramids. Martin thats what i think all the metaphor's in the book of revelation are. They are all accurate metaphor's for events that are happening right now today. That book can be decoded! Now the Giza Pyramids thing was just an example, i don't believe they are mentioned in the Book of Revelation. But you get the point i'm making? Writing stuff like that, you can "prophesy" about the future! We know very well that the pyrimads will still be there 2,000 years from now. Nobody is going to steal the actual pyrimads. So its a safe bet to "prophesy" that people will break into the pyrimads at some stage in the future!

John.

That is the probally the best explaination of what a metaphor is, I have ever heard.
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Message 1267885 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 12:24:32 UTC - in response to Message 1267737.
Last modified: 5 Aug 2012, 12:37:20 UTC

.....Metaphor for the Giza Pyramids;
"In the end times, before the return of the Gods, the great sandstone beast will crumble. The skin of the Beast will crumble like cake, and creatures (Archaeologists) will enter the belly of the beast and plunder the guts of the beast"

Now thats an example of me describing archaeologists entering the crumbling Giza pyramids and removing the treasures from inside the pyramids......

And therein lies the problem. Non specific metaphors are open to "interpretation". Particularly when the colloquial history used in their creation has been lost.

Without too much thinking, I was able to apply your Giza metaphor to 4 different events ranging from the fall of Babylon to the World Trade Center to the final Wall St. crash.

If you also use "sandstone" as a metaphor for something or someone strong, powerful and seemingly impregnable it takes the number of interpretations of your simple metaphor into the hundreds. The words "beast" and "creature" can also be used with a positive or negative connotation to increase the number again.

As an exercise perhaps you should post it in the Cafe and ask the crowd to contribute.

You have picked yourself a task John, I have a feeling that it's going to keep you out of mischief for quite a while. Best of luck

T.A.

P.S. The more I think about, the more interesting the idea of posting your Giza metaphor in the Cafe sounds. Please seriously consider doing so. It could be a lot of fun.

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Message 1267940 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 15:10:23 UTC

Er ...... Isn't the answer 42?

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Message 1268020 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 17:29:06 UTC - in response to Message 1267885.
Last modified: 5 Aug 2012, 17:48:26 UTC

.....Metaphor for the Giza Pyramids;
"In the end times, before the return of the Gods, the great sandstone beast will crumble. The skin of the Beast will crumble like cake, and creatures (Archaeologists) will enter the belly of the beast and plunder the guts of the beast"

Now thats an example of me describing archaeologists entering the crumbling Giza pyramids and removing the treasures from inside the pyramids......

And therein lies the problem. Non specific metaphors are open to "interpretation". Particularly when the colloquial history used in their creation has been lost.

Without too much thinking, I was able to apply your Giza metaphor to 4 different events ranging from the fall of Babylon to the World Trade Center to the final Wall St. crash.

If you also use "sandstone" as a metaphor for something or someone strong, powerful and seemingly impregnable it takes the number of interpretations of your simple metaphor into the hundreds. The words "beast" and "creature" can also be used with a positive or negative connotation to increase the number again.

As an exercise perhaps you should post it in the Cafe and ask the crowd to contribute.

You have picked yourself a task John, I have a feeling that it's going to keep you out of mischief for quite a while. Best of luck

T.A.

P.S. The more I think about, the more interesting the idea of posting your Giza metaphor in the Cafe sounds. Please seriously consider doing so. It could be a lot of fun.

Terror Australis,
Yea, the Giza pyramids metaphor is a good example of something that you can be 100% sure that someone will eventually cut into the pyramid to see what is inside it. You can't hide the pyramids, they are hugh! And knowing that people by their very nature are curious, you know someone will eventually cut into them to have a look. Remember they were sealed with no apparent entrance for thousands of years! Thats exactly what happened. Curious Archaeologists eventually did break in!

Now i could have given more thought to my "Poetic metaphor" to describe this event. I could "code" my metaphor so only particular people would understand the metaphor.

How about this;
"In the end times, before the return of the Gods, the great triangle sandstone beast will crumble. The skin of the Beast will crumble like cake, and creatures (Archaeologists) will enter the belly of the beast and plunder the guts of the beast. And four great arrows of light will penetrate the beast's heart(The Light shafts). Two beams of light will penetrate the heart of the king, and two beams of light will penetrate the heart of the queen(King's and Queen's chamber). And light will even penetrate the bowels of the Beast!(Lower chamber). And the whole world will know the time has come for the return of the Gods!"

Giza pyramids;


Now in that metaphor, the description is well coded and nobody is ever going to guess what the beast is! Not until someone eventually breaks into the pyramids and finds that they have a kings and queens chamber, with 4 light shafts, and a lower chamber way down in the bowels of the pyramid. But As soon as some Archaeologist does break in, he will find that the metaphor is a 100% perfect description of the Giza pyramids!

I think the Biblical Book of Revelation is written exactly the same way.

Your welcome to post a message in the SETI cafe about this topic if you like. I don't have the time.

John.
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Message 1268040 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 18:03:25 UTC - in response to Message 1268020.



How about this;
"In the end times, before the return of the Gods, the great triangle sandstone beast will crumble. The skin of the Beast will crumble like cake, and creatures (Archaeologists) will enter the belly of the beast and plunder the guts of the beast. And four great arrows of light will penetrate the beast's heart(The Light shafts). Two beams of light will penetrate the heart of the king, and two beams of light will penetrate the heart of the queen(King's and Queen's chamber). And light will even penetrate the bowels of the Beast!(Lower chamber)."

<graphic snipped>

Now in that metaphor, the description is well coded and nobody is ever going to guess what the beast is! Not until someone eventually breaks into the pyramids and finds that they have a kings and queens chamber, with 4 light shafts, and a lower chamber way down in the bowels of the pyramid. But As soon as some Archaeologist does break in, he will find that the metaphor is a 100% perfect description of the Giza pyramids!

I think the Biblical Book of Revelation is written exactly the same way.

Your welcome to post a message in the SETI cafe about this topic if you like. I don't have the time.

John.

I think you spoiled it :-) Your first one was a classic example of the difficulties involved in accurately deciphering the meaning of a two thousand year old metaphor, that was probably written to be somewhat obscure in its meaning to begin with.

Your second one is way too detailed. I've read Revelations a few times and none of the metaphors in it are that explicit (to my eyes anyway).

T.A.

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Message 1268052 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 18:26:22 UTC - in response to Message 1268040.
Last modified: 5 Aug 2012, 18:35:07 UTC

I think you spoiled it :-) Your first one was a classic example of the difficulties involved in accurately deciphering the meaning of a two thousand year old metaphor, that was probably written to be somewhat obscure in its meaning to begin with.

Your second one is way too detailed. I've read Revelations a few times and none of the metaphors in it are that explicit (to my eyes anyway).

T.A.

TA,
You got to be kidding me!

The Beast in Revelation 13 has;
7 heads
10 horns
each head a blasphemous name
resembled a leopard
feet like those of a bear
mouth like that of a lion
heads of the beast have a fatal wound, but its healed
Has something to do with the number 666
And the dragon had given authority to the beast

Now in my opinion, that is a very very detailed description! Just like my Giza pyramids metaphor, i think that is describing something very precise! And nobody is going to decode it until we find something that EXACTLY fits that description, even if it is a metaphor!

And to top that off, thats just the description of one of the beasts in revelation. All the other characters are described just like that one. They are all described in massive detail!

If we are living in the so called "End times", before the Gods return, someone should be able find someone or something, or some set of events that ACCURATELY fit the descriptions of the characters in the book. If we can't find that, then we have not yet entered the End times. It will happen at a future date, if the book is correct. Its possible it's going to happen a thousand years from now.

John.
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Message 1268060 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 18:45:20 UTC - in response to Message 1268052.

It is indeed a detailed description but of what ?

Your metaphor was easily recognisable as a pyramid but just how do you interpret

7 heads
10 horns
each head a blasphemous name
resembled a leopard
feet like those of a bear
mouth like that of a lion
heads of the beast have a fatal wound, but its healed
Has something to do with the number 666
And the dragon had given authority to the beast


Please keep me posted on this. I'm interested but may ask some dumb questions. You can PM me if you like

T.A.

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Message 1268065 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 18:57:22 UTC - in response to Message 1268060.
Last modified: 5 Aug 2012, 19:01:48 UTC

It is indeed a detailed description but of what ?

Your metaphor was easily recognisable as a pyramid but just how do you interpret
7 heads
10 horns
each head a blasphemous name
resembled a leopard
feet like those of a bear
mouth like that of a lion
heads of the beast have a fatal wound, but its healed
Has something to do with the number 666
And the dragon had given authority to the beast


Please keep me posted on this. I'm interested but may ask some dumb questions. You can PM me if you like

T.A.

Yea, you see now we are getting to the real nitty gritty detail, and this is important! The description is incredibly detailed! Massively detailed. And if you read revelation, there is even more detail about that particular beast.

Well for starters, i think its really unlikely that its an actual living creature. The 7 heads would cause problems as we see with Siamese twins. So its unlikely its a real animal.

Many people suggest that particular beast in revelation 13 is "The catholic church" with the Pope as the head of the church and with their head quarters in the Vatican. The Vatican is an independent "state" inside the city of Rome. But the Vatican controls all its own finance and governing power. Its possible that the Vatican is the Beast. But i don't think so myself. I think its something else.

It could be describing a nuclear sub-marine!

John.
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Message 1268072 - Posted: 5 Aug 2012, 19:25:35 UTC
Last modified: 5 Aug 2012, 19:40:48 UTC

Ok, lets try the nuclear sub-marine theory for the Beast in revelation 13;

This is the description;

The Beast out of the Sea
7 heads
10 horns
each head a blasphemous name
resembled a leopard
feet like those of a bear
mouth like that of a lion
heads of the beast have a fatal wound, but its healed
Has something to do with the number 666
And the dragon had given authority to the beast


Firstly, the Beast in revelation 13 is described as "The Beast out of the Sea". This fits a sub-marine perfectly!

The 7 heads could be nuclear warheads on the sub-marine.

The 10 horns could be missiles on the sub.

As many people know, solders and marines have a habit of writing names on bombs they are going to drop. When the Enola Gay bombed Hiroshima in WW II, they named the bomb "Little boy". So the blasphemous names in revelation could be a reference to this practice of writing names on bombs. This still goes on right now today!

Maybe there is, or was, or is going to be a sub marine that "resembles a leopard"

Maybe the bears feet could be some stability fins on the sub-marine.

Mouth like a lion could be the launch tubes for the nukes.

The healed fatal wound could be some damage the sub-marine received and they "welded" the damaged steel to "Heal the wound".

This particular sub-marine would probably have the number 666 on the side of the sub. It might be its naval registration number.

And the Dragon might be the government of the country that controls the sub-marine and the king, prime minister or president would have to "give authority to the beast" to launch its deadly load of nuclear weapons.

USS Hawkbill (SSN-666);
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Hawkbill_(SSN-666)



John.
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Message boards : Politics : Decoding the Biblical Book of Revelation

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