An argument for the existence of God: Second Pass...

I'm doomed -- losing hair too, so I'll be domed as well. The Sumerians will never forgive me.

Thank you. You appear to be able to understand me. Thats all that is needed.

Oh gosh, now you've gone and done it good and proper ....

I wish it to be officially declared here now that "The People's Liberation Front of Judea" do not recognise the existence of any Gods.

____________
The Kite Fliers

--------------------
Kite fliers: An imaginary club of solo members, those who don't yet
belong to a formal team so "fly their own kites" - as the saying goes.

I wish it to be declared here and now that nor do the "Revolutionary Tooting Popular Front"

Perhaps a few of you should go and reread the first post in this thread?


The Revised Drake Equation

Indeed, this isn't really a debate anyway (and hasn't been from the start), just a Monty Python style argument -- and most of the past several posts have been compliant with the Monty Python style.

Deviations from subject will be tolerated, so long as they are within the context of the "debate"

We have kept within the request.

Perhaps a few of you should go and reread the first post in this thread?


The Revised Drake Equation

As for Drake's equation, I think Michael Crichton probably had it right:

Michael crichton wrote:

The problem, of course, is that none of the terms can be known, and most cannot even be estimated. The only way to work the equation is to fill in with guesses. And guesses—just so we’re clear—are merely expressions of prejudice. Nor can there be “informed guesses.” If you need to state how many planets with life choose to communicate, there is simply no way to make an informed guess. It’s simply prejudice.

What does it have to do with any meaningful scientific study?

As a result, the Drake equation can have any value from “billions and billions” to zero.

I see you're back at the Drake Equation. What do you think it shows?

Would 200 million be in the realm of Hyer-reals?

The Drake equation has infinite uncertainty in all of the guesses at the components.

Most people who applied it early on predicted many civilizations in the Galaxy. So I am with Fermi--- where are they ??

I expect that if we knew and wrote down all the things necessary for intelligent life and their parameter ranges that we would find that there is a very low probability when we look at how many planets that we have found meet all of them.


If what I suspect is true then there may be a few (very few) such planets in the galaxy. There would of course be a very large number in the Universe so you could conclude that such life does exist out there somewhere. Will we ever know ?? that's what we are doing here in SETI --but I remain a skeptic that I will or we will hit the Lottery jackpot.

I still buy my ticket almost every week.

The Drake equation has infinite uncertainty in all of the guesses at the components.

Most people who applied it early on predicted many civilizations in the Galaxy. So I am with Fermi--- where are they ??

I expect that if we knew and wrote down all the things necessary for intelligent life and their parameter ranges that we would find that there is a very low probability when we look at how many planets that we have found meet all of them.


If what I suspect is true then there may be a few (very few) such planets in the galaxy. There would of course be a very large number in the Universe so you could conclude that such life does exist out there somewhere. Will we ever know ?? that's what we are doing here in SETI --but I remain a skeptic that I will or we will hit the Lottery jackpot.


I still buy my ticket almost every week.

Computer buffs are well versed in the GIGO scenario, but isn't Seti@Home based around Drake?

It showed that Drake pumped garbage in and got a whole load of garbage back out and in the process a whole load of people fell for the result.

Computer buffs are well versed in the GIGO scenario, but isn't Seti@Home based around Drake?

How can we estimate the number of technological civilizations that might exist among the stars? While working as a radio astronomer at the National Radio Astronomy Observatory in Green Bank, West Virginia, Dr. Frank Drake (currently on the Board of the SETI Institute) conceived an approach to bound the terms involved in estimating the number of technological civilizations that may exist in our galaxy. The Drake Equation, as it has become known, was first presented by Drake in 1961 and identifies specific factors thought to play a role in the development of such civilizations. Although there is no unique solution to this equation, it is a generally accepted tool used by the scientific community to examine these factors.

Besides illuminating the factors involved in such a search, the Drake Equation is a simple, effective tool for stimulating intellectual curiosity about the universe around us, for helping us to understand that life as we know it is the end product of a natural, cosmic evolution, and for making us realize how much we are a part of that universe. A key goal of the SETI Institute is to further high quality research that will yield additional information related to any of the factors of this fascinating equation.

The Drake equation has infinite uncertainty in all of the guesses at the components.

Most people who applied it early on predicted many civilizations in the Galaxy. So I am with Fermi--- where are they ??

I expect that if we knew and wrote down all the things necessary for intelligent life and their parameter ranges that we would find that there is a very low probability when we look at how many planets that we have found meet all of them.

If what I suspect is true then there may be a few (very few) such planets in the galaxy. There would of course be a very large number in the Universe so you could conclude that such life does exist out there somewhere. Will we ever know ?? that's what we are doing here in SETI --but I remain a skeptic that I will or we will hit the Lottery jackpot.

I still buy my ticket almost every week.