My worthless non-GPU adventure


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Message 1239233 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 1:59:01 UTC
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 2:19:56 UTC

I crunch only with CPU's as I have no "crunching" rigs built, nor do I even do any gaming, and do not have any GPU's around here to use. (eventually I'll buy a couple cheapies and make a budget cruncher, but that's besides the point)

I mainly run seti on my server "nano" at around 40% give or take. Using just the one machine I've peaked out my RAC at around 2500.

I've decided today, to try to up my RAC to as MUCH as I can, just for fun. I still have to throttle, so optimized apps are of no use here.

But what I do have available to use is 14 threads of Intel goodness.
So My lineup has changed from "nano" running at (about) 40%, and producing a max of 2500 RAC to:

"nano" 3.2GHZ 8 thread Xeon, @70%
(the sluggish)"Minsys" 3.4GHZ 2 thread P4 @60% (this thing has a questionable proc and bad cooling, so that's all I'm pushing it)
and last but not least "satelliteS2" 2.7Ghz 4 thread i5 @70%.

I'm hoping to slightly beat 7000 RAC with this setup.

I will only run like this for a few weeks, and then I will be going back to a pretty minimal contribution unfortunately (I like my machines quiet and not overworked ;-)), until I build my dream design of a budget economy cruncher. :-) (wait til you see my $-RAC value, and electric-RAC value when I do that... <big grin>)

(Now if I could only get some AP units in the mix. I'm starting to forget what they look like...)
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Message 1239243 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 2:12:38 UTC

Just wondering why you think optimised applications are of no use. They will work regardless of whether or not a CPU is throttled and they should be more efficient per clock/time-slice/whatever-measure-of-time-you-want-to-use. I'm not saying you have to use the optimised applications, but your reason for not doing so doesn't seem to make sense for me.
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Message 1239249 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 2:18:19 UTC - in response to Message 1239243.
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 2:22:19 UTC

Just wondering why you think optimised applications are of no use. They will work regardless of whether or not a CPU is throttled and they should be more efficient per clock/time-slice/whatever-measure-of-time-you-want-to-use. I'm not saying you have to use the optimised applications, but your reason for not doing so doesn't seem to make sense for me.


I've heard from others that optimized apps don't do much for throttled systems. If there would still be a noticeable improvement then perhaps I'll start taking steps to do so, but that means more learning (and I do enough of that all day on my own).

Another concern I have is heat. Do optimized apps produce more heat? Or perhaps less because they are "optimized"? (Then again it really doesn't matter because I'll just throttle my temps to taste. :-))

So I guess it's time to learn about optimized apps for Linux... (Probably won't bother with my windows laptop, it'll only be running boinc for a few weeks)
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Message 1239273 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 3:50:04 UTC - in response to Message 1239249.

non tech explaination: opti apps do more work per clock cycle and do not cause any signifigant rise in temps
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Message 1239276 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 4:01:42 UTC - in response to Message 1239273.

non tech explaination: opti apps do more work per clock cycle and do not cause any signifigant rise in temps

+1
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Message 1239278 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 4:16:57 UTC

I'd suggest giving it a try for a few days, xclusive. Whereas it might not have benefited much for others' throttled systems, it might be different for you.

Yeah, heat was about the only other thing I could think of, but the throttling should already keep temperatures down for you. But if you're asking for a performance-to-TDP ratio analysis, again, I can only guess that you'll have to try it for yourself.
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Message 1239279 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 4:21:41 UTC

I am using optimized apps on my Linux box, only CPU. I wanted to install the AP 6 app, but it came down with a 7z compression factor. How do you inflate this?
Tullio
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Message 1239280 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 4:34:45 UTC - in response to Message 1239279.

I too crunch CPU only. I use the optimized apps. I recommend them.
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Message 1239281 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 4:39:54 UTC - in response to Message 1239279.
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 4:54:51 UTC

I am using optimized apps on my Linux box, only CPU. I wanted to install the AP 6 app, but it came down with a 7z compression factor. How do you inflate this?
Tullio


http://www.thegeekstuff.com/2010/04/7z-7zip-7za-file-compression/




Now, does someone wanna point me to the "installing optimized apps in Linux for dummies" thread/page?

And are the apps safe with only certain version etc.? I am running 7.0.28 on everything currently...

[O/T, I see a lot of faces in here that aren't around too much.... Is that what it takes to get you people in here, a big outage!??? :-D]
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Message 1239360 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 8:47:52 UTC - in response to Message 1239279.
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 8:52:23 UTC

Actually, VLARs *DO* produce more heat. The moment one VLAR is being processed, CPU temps go up for additional 5 degrees C on my computers. Especially the crappy notebook where it goes from normal 80 to almost 90 when processing one or more VLARs (with optimized apps.).
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Message 1239380 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 10:36:18 UTC - in response to Message 1239360.
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 11:13:37 UTC

Actually, VLARs *DO* produce more heat. The moment one VLAR is being processed, CPU temps go up for additional 5 degrees C on my computers. Especially the crappy notebook where it goes from normal 80 to almost 90 when processing one or more VLARs (with optimized apps.).


Actually on my AMD Athlon(tm) 64 Processor 3500+ @ 2325 MHz, stock AMD cooler
I don't see a difference.

But on my ATI GPU (AMD Radeon HD 6570 1GB DDR3 - ASUS EAH6570/DI/1GD3(LP))
there is difference - highest temp with VHARs:

This graph is with Optimized apps using "100% CPU time" & GPU:
TThrottle - GPU Mixed AR (Edit).png
http://prikachi.com/images/756/4839756F.png


This computer:
http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/show_host_detail.php?hostid=4832843


This (somehow long) discussion was about Linux opt apps (links, Instructions.txt, use chmod +x ...):
http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=66123


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Message 1239385 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 11:01:06 UTC
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 11:03:32 UTC

Boinc has its own settings to control cpu use and heat !
Just use BOINC`s own `preferences` setting, something like :- `on multi processors use at most 50% cpu`
And use optimized app`s
It works well here.

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Message 1239391 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 11:35:55 UTC - in response to Message 1239385.
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 12:25:07 UTC

Boinc has its own settings to control cpu use and heat !
Just use BOINC`s own `preferences` setting, something like :- `on multi processors use at most 50% cpu`
And use optimized app`s
It works well here.


That setting has a pending bug that messes up cache. To run BOINC temperature controlled it's far more advisable to use TThrottle

edit: windows OS only - no idea if it runs under wine, but I doubt it.
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Message 1239392 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 11:46:43 UTC - in response to Message 1239281.

Thanks, I got 7zip from SuSE. Now I have installed ap 6 and am hoping to get a WU, but they are rare. I have ap 5 installed on my Solaris VM, by Dotsch.
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Message 1239403 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 12:23:20 UTC - in response to Message 1239281.

Now, does someone wanna point me to the "installing optimized apps in Linux for dummies" thread/page?

And are the apps safe with only certain version etc.? I am running 7.0.28 on everything currently...

[O/T, I see a lot of faces in here that aren't around too much.... Is that what it takes to get you people in here, a big outage!??? :-D]


The apps work perfectly with any BOINC version.

BOINC and app are two distinct things. The apps distributed by the various projects are designed to do specific things - find signals pointing to ET or pulsars, run mathematical algorhthms, do in silico folding of proteins, run simulations of climate etc. etc. whatever somebody thought of and put into code.
BOINC provides the infrastructure within which the apps run. It contacts the project servers to request and report work, it schedules which tasks to run when or when not to run at all, it keeps statistics etc.

Boinc itself again divides into two things - the client (the boinc.exe) and the Boinc manager - that the GUI most of us use.

So actually you have at least three things running at any time - boinc.exe - the actual client doing the work. Boinc Manager - the graphical interface to easily tell the client how you want it to run. The applications - usually as many as you have cores. [there is also boinctray.exe - that's the programm that looks for mouse/keyboard activity for the 'only run if inactive' setting - on Windows I'm not sure that one is on Linux as well]

Linux install for dummies? By definition, somebody running Linux is a geek ;)
Somebody was working on writing a Linux installer - there is a very experimental one in Alpha.

download link has changed since the thread BilBg posted:

packages
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Message 1239409 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 12:53:44 UTC - in response to Message 1239392.
Last modified: 1 Jun 2012, 12:54:37 UTC

I have ap 5 installed on my Solaris VM, by Dotsch.
Tullio

Astropulse_v5 was superceeded by Astropulse_v505 at least a year ago, and now Astropulse_v505 has been superceeded by Astropulse_v6,
you won't get any Astropulse_v5 or v505 Wu's any more, (the last v505 task is out there getting crunched by someone at the moment - see the Server Status page)
you'll only be able to get Astropulse_v6 tasks once you're updated your Solaris VM with an Astropulse_v6 app.

Claggy

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Message 1239415 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 13:02:49 UTC - in response to Message 1239385.

Boinc has its own settings to control cpu use and heat !
Just use BOINC`s own `preferences` setting, something like :- `on multi processors use at most 50% cpu`
And use optimized app`s
It works well here.

I did something similar on my i7 before I upgraded from the stock heatsink. Except I use the cc_config option to specify the number of CPUs to 4. Later I found running 4 tasks on that machine it produced a RAC very near my other i7 boxes, with the same i7-860 CPU, that run 8 tasks at once.

As far as non-GPU machines being worthless I am currently running 1 GPU. An old GT 8500. With my position by RAC being ~80 and position by credit ~130 I wouldn't say non-GPU machines are worthless.
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Message 1239435 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 13:58:12 UTC - in response to Message 1239409.

Yes, when available by Dotsch.
Tullio
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Message 1239464 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 15:10:57 UTC - in response to Message 1239380.


This (somehow long) discussion was about Linux opt apps (links, Instructions.txt, use chmod +x ...):
http://setiathome.berkeley.edu/forum_thread.php?id=66123


Bill, thanks for that. I already see the process doesn't look too bad, I'll get over to arkayn's site a little later and start getting things in order. :o)

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Message 1239467 - Posted: 1 Jun 2012, 15:16:53 UTC - in response to Message 1239403.

Now, does someone wanna point me to the "installing optimized apps in Linux for dummies" thread/page?

And are the apps safe with only certain version etc.? I am running 7.0.28 on everything currently...

[O/T, I see a lot of faces in here that aren't around too much.... Is that what it takes to get you people in here, a big outage!??? :-D]


The apps work perfectly with any BOINC version.

BOINC and app are two distinct things. The apps distributed by the various projects are designed to do specific things - find signals pointing to ET or pulsars, run mathematical algorhthms, do in silico folding of proteins, run simulations of climate etc. etc. whatever somebody thought of and put into code.
BOINC provides the infrastructure within which the apps run. It contacts the project servers to request and report work, it schedules which tasks to run when or when not to run at all, it keeps statistics etc.

Boinc itself again divides into two things - the client (the boinc.exe) and the Boinc manager - that the GUI most of us use.

So actually you have at least three things running at any time - boinc.exe - the actual client doing the work. Boinc Manager - the graphical interface to easily tell the client how you want it to run. The applications - usually as many as you have cores. [there is also boinctray.exe - that's the programm that looks for mouse/keyboard activity for the 'only run if inactive' setting - on Windows I'm not sure that one is on Linux as well]

Linux install for dummies? By definition, somebody running Linux is a geek ;)
Somebody was working on writing a Linux installer - there is a very experimental one in Alpha.

download link has changed since the thread BilBg posted:

packages


Thanks Ladyl. ;-) I can live without an installer. I was just under the impression there may have been more to it then swapping some files and editing configs. But there's not, so I'm all set. :-). Now all that's left is to just "do it"... At some point today.

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