The subject of UFOs


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OzzFan
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Message 1262499 - Posted: 20 Jul 2012, 11:48:54 UTC - in response to Message 1262379.

And not even a good fake at that. Looks like it was written by a young author who failed Editorial Creative Writing classes.

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Message 1262725 - Posted: 20 Jul 2012, 22:26:39 UTC

Another problem with UFO's is this - If aliens really did appear in the Sky's, they could hide by simply adding a big flashing red beacon to the underside of the UFO. If they have a flashing red beacon on the bottom of their UFO, then nobody would pay any attention to them because it would just look like any other aeroplane in the sky. In effect they would be hiding in plain sight.

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Message 1262767 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 1:19:38 UTC
Last modified: 21 Jul 2012, 1:20:05 UTC

@ William & Ozzfan,

Yeah man not me but you people have elected 2 ufo guys in 1976, 1980, 1984 as your president and now debunk them how dare you!! ;P
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OzzFan
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Message 1262772 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 1:29:44 UTC - in response to Message 1262767.

I really don't understand your hang-up about former US Presidents and UFOs. You seem to think that we "protect" them from criticism because they are former Presidents - yet I've said repeatedly that it doesn't matter who you are, you're not immune from delusion or being fooled by UFO Conspiracy theorists, so I really don't understand your comments at all - beyond the fact that your f---ing crazy.

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Message 1262775 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 1:34:28 UTC - in response to Message 1262256.

You need to watch a UFOologist Dr. Woods called the Encylopedia of Flying daucers. This guy come up with an original UFO Recovery and Disposal even how to create a cover for the crash. This manual is original in all respects and contridicts everything the airforce knows about flying saucers includeing recovery of both live and dead alien species. They have had communication with aliens since 1953. Project Grudge was started to study green fireballs over Los Alamos,Whitesands, and other secure areas from 10-30 reports or more a month. Eisenhower brought up the Military machine out of control and he wanted ufoshot down onsight. From 1953 on till today the air force has only done dis-information campaign that was Blue Books existance at any cost to hide , obstuct, deny all information cocerning UFOs. Place all information above top secret so reserchers cant recover any information. Ronald Regan did his ET speech and all of a sudden he was brought into the loop and he signed a executive order placeing all photos, videos, documentation above top secret. So now infromation can be destroyed or classed as security requies to make it inaccessible. Now the airforce has denied UFOs for 60 years and all alone they have discovered 37 species and over a hundred different models of UFOs some are interdiminsial. Betty and Barny Hill were picked by beings from the Beta Rticli sytem. Under Hyponosis Betty drew a star chart of the Glise system 29 lightyears away. So all the people that think that they are fake must be reminded of 30000 sightingsa month on average occurs. Funny how the airforce denys that UFOs exist and yet a 1999 manual tells how to recover and disposal od all UFO crash sites and teams worldwide are on standby worldwide to recover UFOs at all costs.

www.tube.com the encycopedia of flying saucers

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Message 1262778 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 1:39:07 UTC
Last modified: 21 Jul 2012, 1:40:50 UTC

Ozzfan you elected ufo guys as public officials not me try to understand that and now even a ufo senator Dennis Kusinich is still seating senator.

I am only supporting given factual phenomenons but all you trying hard is witch hunting.
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Message 1262780 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 1:42:02 UTC - in response to Message 1262778.

Ozzfan you elected ufo guys as public officials not me try to understand that and now even a ufo senator Dennis Kusinich still seating senator.


Since when does electing officials who believe in UFOs mean anything? If I only voted for officials that believed 100% as I do, I wouldn't be voting for anybody. Just because someone believes in UFOs, ghosts or God doesn't mean they have to be kicked out of office.

I am only supporting given factual phenomenons but all you trying hard is witch hunting.


You have only offered names of people who believe in UFOs. You have not provided any factual, observable evidence to believe that UFOs have actually been visiting our planet.

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Message 1262782 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 1:46:43 UTC - in response to Message 1262775.
Last modified: 21 Jul 2012, 2:39:23 UTC

You need to watch a UFOologist Dr. Woods called the Encylopedia of Flying daucers. This guy come up with an original UFO Recovery and Disposal even how to create a cover for the crash. This manual is original in all respects and contridicts everything the airforce knows about flying saucers includeing recovery of both live and dead alien species. They have had communication with aliens since 1953. Project Grudge was started to study green fireballs over Los Alamos,Whitesands, and other secure areas from 10-30 reports or more a month. Eisenhower brought up the Military machine out of control and he wanted ufoshot down onsight. From 1953 on till today the air force has only done dis-information campaign that was Blue Books existance at any cost to hide , obstuct, deny all information cocerning UFOs. Place all information above top secret so reserchers cant recover any information. Ronald Regan did his ET speech and all of a sudden he was brought into the loop and he signed a executive order placeing all photos, videos, documentation above top secret. So now infromation can be destroyed or classed as security requies to make it inaccessible. Now the airforce has denied UFOs for 60 years and all alone they have discovered 37 species and over a hundred different models of UFOs some are interdiminsial. Betty and Barny Hill were picked by beings from the Beta Rticli sytem. Under Hyponosis Betty drew a star chart of the Glise system 29 lightyears away. So all the people that think that they are fake must be reminded of 30000 sightingsa month on average occurs. Funny how the airforce denys that UFOs exist and yet a 1999 manual tells how to recover and disposal od all UFO crash sites and teams worldwide are on standby worldwide to recover UFOs at all costs.

www.tube.com the encycopedia of flying saucers


Is there any corroborating evidence of anything in that "documentary" other than some Dr.'s claims?

As for drawing star charts under hypnosis, hypnosis only reveals what the mind believes to be true. So if you've convinced yourself that something happened, then you believe it happened, regardless if the events did not occur. [Edit] Here's a good overview on a de-mystified review of the Hill's claims. Point blank: their claims were false. The psychiatrist that examined the Hills concluded that the entire story was fabricated by Betty, and only through hypnosis was she able to convince her husband that he had experienced something too, even though he claimed he did not experience anything initially or even months later. It wasn't until "therapy" that he started echoing his wife's story.

And as far as all the reported sightings of UFOs, what about all the reported sightings of ghosts? Or vampires? Or the loch ness monster? Do the reportings make the claims more valid? How about some actual evidence and not just claims?

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Message 1262784 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 1:57:52 UTC
Last modified: 21 Jul 2012, 2:01:50 UTC

Ozzfan you are believing that quantum state exists that only few physicists in america observed that in the lab under electron microscope but you fiercefully debunk tens of military personnel plus few publicly trusted politicians' observation claim as anti-scientific something. Which makes you real crazy individual.
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Message 1262785 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 2:02:43 UTC - in response to Message 1262784.
Last modified: 21 Jul 2012, 2:30:00 UTC

Ozzfan you are believing that quantum state exists that only few physicists in america observed that in the lab under electron microscope but you fiercefully debunk few military personnel plus few publicly trusted politicians' observation claim as anti-scientific something. Which makes you real crazy individual.


Yes, because other scientists will peer-review the quantum findings of physicists and would debunk their work if it were false.

The same is applied to the UFO conspiracy theory. Under peer-review, it is nothing more than bogus claims. Anyone can claim they believe UFOs have been visiting planet Earth, but it takes facts to confirm the belief. Otherwise, the belief is nothing more a belief, and not a fact.

If trusting peer-review is crazy then I'm a looney. However, I think most people would say believing that a large number of claims + lack of evidence is a symptom of delusion.

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Message 1262790 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 2:39:06 UTC - in response to Message 1262782.

The doctor is a document specialist he has done all documentation verification for the military. He has anaylised handwriting from a hand written noter to a general quote" I belive we have both manmade and extraterrirestrial Ufos" why would the director of skunkworks write that if he didnt know something. He has one of two original copies of the UFO recovery and disposal manual both from 1999 and two different sourses.

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Message 1262795 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 2:46:48 UTC - in response to Message 1262790.

The doctor is a document specialist he has done all documentation verification for the military. He has anaylised handwriting from a hand written noter to a general quote" I belive we have both manmade and extraterrirestrial Ufos" why would the director of skunkworks write that if he didnt know something. He has one of two original copies of the UFO recovery and disposal manual both from 1999 and two different sourses.


Sure, he believes he knows something, but where is his corroborating evidence? Do other documentation specialists agree with his findings?

All I'm seeing here is that because someone is intelligent and connected with the US Government/military, that their claims somehow hold more weight. Again, intelligent people making claims does not mean they are immune from delusion.

Stop looking at who is making the claim and what their credentials are and start looking at the evidence.

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Message 1262796 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 2:47:40 UTC - in response to Message 1262360.

The energy requirements of most every powerplant that scientists and engineers are experimenting with are monsterous and would require storage tanks on a planetary scale. Maybe Dark Matter and Dark energy are the answer if we ever discover their true nature.


You are right, advances with new fuel sources would undoubtedly need to be developed. But we also can't forget how big the first computers used to be way way back in the good 'ol days :D

Back in the early days of computers they knew that ways to make them smaller and faster was only a matter of time and that doing so wouldn't break any of the laws of physics. On the other hand creating a repository (read battery) for energy storage can only be miniaturized so far before coming up against the wall of physical impossibility. I've seen estimates that the energy needed to create a wormhole, should they prove to be possible, would entail harnessing the complete output of a sun sized star. The same is true for star drives that encapsulate a spacecraft and then move space around it. The ability to manipulate energy at that level is thousands of years off, if possible at all.


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Message 1262799 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 2:51:58 UTC - in response to Message 1262772.

you should read alot more before you critize me. Im not crazy and have done research on UFOs as a hobby most of my life. Until recently the whole thing smeels like a hoax but reperible people have put their lives on the line saying this is true in front of congress nothing more since 1986 and congress didnt do anything because they themselves could not recover lost altered or destroyed documentation or photgraphs unless a need to know existed. Prove that Dr Woods is a liar hes been in f\ront of congress 3 times to get answers. Whay he has discovered is a complete contridiciton to everything the airforce has said to congress and presidents and the public. People should go to prison over this but so much is destroyed and a TRILLION dollar expense doesnt have an answer. Prove to me thats being crazy. Hell they had a program to put nuclear engines in bombers and make it work then scrap 10 years of research at the tune 110 million dollars with no repercussions. Im crazy as hell if I dont look at some this objectively.

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Message 1262802 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 3:00:19 UTC - in response to Message 1262070.

You know it was Hyneck that come up with the "swamp Gas "saying to explain UFOs before years of stuff he couldnt explain he became a UFO advocate after spending years on blue book denying their existance. There are quite a few astronomers that have seen anomolies on telescopes that defied explanation.

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Message 1262803 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 3:02:45 UTC - in response to Message 1262799.

you should read alot more before you critize me. Im not crazy and have done research on UFOs as a hobby most of my life. Until recently the whole thing smeels like a hoax but reperible people have put their lives on the line saying this is true in front of congress nothing more since 1986 and congress didnt do anything because they themselves could not recover lost altered or destroyed documentation or photgraphs unless a need to know existed. Prove that Dr Woods is a liar hes been in f\ront of congress 3 times to get answers. Whay he has discovered is a complete contridiciton to everything the airforce has said to congress and presidents and the public. People should go to prison over this but so much is destroyed and a TRILLION dollar expense doesnt have an answer. Prove to me thats being crazy. Hell they had a program to put nuclear engines in bombers and make it work then scrap 10 years of research at the tune 110 million dollars with no repercussions. Im crazy as hell if I dont look at some this objectively.


You are going about all this backwards. It doesn't matter how reputable someone is. They have to prove their claims. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof. He believes he's found contradictions because he has fallen into the same trap so many other intelligent people fall into: he gets caught up in the claims instead of letting the data lead him to the truth.

If you really were looking at this objectively, you wouldn't be focused on who is making the claim and what their reputation is. You'd be looking specifically at their claims and asking what evidence do they have that makes any of it true.

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Message 1262804 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 3:04:46 UTC - in response to Message 1262802.
Last modified: 21 Jul 2012, 3:25:26 UTC

You know it was Hyneck that come up with the "swamp Gas "saying to explain UFOs before years of stuff he couldnt explain he became a UFO advocate after spending years on blue book denying their existance. There are quite a few astronomers that have seen anomolies on telescopes that defied explanation.


For the billionth time, it doesn't matter who is making the claim or who they work for. Look at the evidence, or more specifically the lack thereof. There's still quite a few things in this Universe that we don't understand or can't fully explain, but an astronomer finding some anomaly on a telescope isn't proof positive of alien visitations.

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Message 1262806 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 3:07:56 UTC - in response to Message 1262772.

Lets look at presidents that were denyed access Eisenhower and Jimmy Carter. The other presidents that knew lied to congress about what they knew or how they felt about the subject. Nixon knew about them. Reagan was brought in the loop and did an executive order to hide any ufo information would denied to the public unless a need to know arises. Johnson was informed about a series of UFO incidents in Veitnam. More presidents know about this than you know and alot of detail.

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Message 1262809 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 3:12:06 UTC - in response to Message 1262806.

You know that half the ufos reported could be ours. They dont get shot down world wide.

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Message 1262810 - Posted: 21 Jul 2012, 3:13:40 UTC - in response to Message 1262806.
Last modified: 21 Jul 2012, 3:41:57 UTC

Lets look at presidents that were denyed access Eisenhower and Jimmy Carter. The other presidents that knew lied to congress about what they knew or how they felt about the subject. Nixon knew about them. Reagan was brought in the loop and did an executive order to hide any ufo information would denied to the public unless a need to know arises. Johnson was informed about a series of UFO incidents in Veitnam. More presidents know about this than you know and alot of detail.


Denied access to what? Topic secret government research into the UFO phenomenon? I have no doubt the government conducts such research, but the fact that they classify their research as top secret doesn't mean that they are hiding alien visitations. I also have no doubt that these research teams are smart enough and objective enough to realize the truth of a situation and attempt to explain it to people, but the average laymen such as the Hills, without any knowledge of science at all, think the explanation bogus, even though most of the Hill's story has been refuted and shown to be an elaborate fabrication. And those who are smart enough to know better, upon further investigation are found to be delusion, mentally ill, or simply not well versed in areas outside their expertise so they make up the rest knowing that their "reputation" will make them seem like they know something that others are hiding (outright liars).

I don't understand how you can say that you're looking at anything objectively then turn around and make statements as outlandish as this. You have no way of knowing anything classified - you only have claims from other people who doubtfully have the right level of access. Again I ask: where is the evidence of these claims? How do these people supposedly know what the President is aware of or not? What makes the claims true?

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