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Profile Chris SProject donor
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Message 1191715 - Posted: 5 Feb 2012, 12:03:12 UTC

Never mind the Falklands, more worrying to the Brits is the insistence of Scotland wanting to withdraw from the Union, and become an independent Country. If it happens we would still be called the UK, as it stands for the United Kingdom of Great Britain & Northern Ireland. But Great Britain which currently includes England, Wales and Scotland, simply wouldn't be so great as before.

The ramifications of this proposed move will be rumbling on for some time to come, with typical lurid headlines. Mind you, many still believe they eat babies north of Watford .....

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Message 1191753 - Posted: 5 Feb 2012, 16:01:41 UTC - in response to Message 1191715.

Gee you'd think that after more than a thousand years of war and conquest the Scots would finally get used to their overlords. NOT!!!

FREEDOM!!!!
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Message 1191758 - Posted: 5 Feb 2012, 16:14:01 UTC

Gosh, with enough global climate change, Scotland could achieve as an independent nation the well being and status of Ireland.....

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Message 1191774 - Posted: 5 Feb 2012, 18:18:18 UTC - in response to Message 1191758.

Gosh, with enough global climate change, Scotland could achieve as an independent nation the well being and status of Ireland.....


Absolutely........& totally stuffed due to the Euro!
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Message 1191776 - Posted: 5 Feb 2012, 18:22:46 UTC

Absolutely........& totally stuffed due to the Euro!


And no doubt expecting to be bailed out by the EU if they go bust .....

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Message 1191783 - Posted: 5 Feb 2012, 18:46:14 UTC - in response to Message 1191753.

Gee you'd think that after more than a thousand years of war and conquest the Scots would finally get used to their overlords. NOT!!!

FREEDOM!!!!


Freedom from what? The Scots have had their own laws since the formation
of the Union with England. Too, they have had more representation in the
British parliament than either England, Wales or Northern Ireland. If
Scotland leaves the union then like the UK it will become a member state
of Europe and in time will have to give up this right to make it's own laws.
It will, in time, then have a true overlord, the ECM and the Lords of Brussels.
There is no logic in Scotland leaving the union, only their politicians seem
to see logic in it. The last poll on this issue went against the Politicians
for the population in Scotland generally sees no logic in it at all. So it's
down to the logic as seen by the Politicians. No, they don't see logic they
only sense power here. But to temporarily lord it over 8 million Scots these
politicians are prepared to give up lording it over 64 million Britains as
many of them have done as UK Prime Ministers over many centuries. Gosh! our
current and previous prime Ministers are both Scottish in decent, what more
does Scotland want!! The problem here is that leaving the Union is being
promoted by tuppenny-bit politicians who don't have the ability to make things
happen for themselves in the UK parliament so try to make things happen for
themselves in the second rate tier of politics, namely the Scottish Assembly.







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Message 1191786 - Posted: 5 Feb 2012, 19:19:33 UTC

I like Scotland, and I like the Scottish people. I've been to Edinburgh and loved it, and I'm going to Glasgow this spring, and looking forward to it. Unfortunately they have a bunch of crap politicians who pander to the extremists.

I was privileged a few weeks ago to have had a ticket to the visitors gallery at the House of Commons. That day they debated the Daylight Savings Bill and it sadly got filibustered. Who was the the prime culprit? That well known Scottish windbag Angus MacNeil.

They are welcome to him.

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Message 1191918 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 7:57:36 UTC
Last modified: 6 Feb 2012, 7:58:38 UTC

That day they debated the Daylight Savings Bill and it sadly got filibustered. Who was the the prime culprit? That well known Scottish windbag Angus MacNeil.


Proof I say that these Scottish politicians don't actually wont independence
for Scotland but just wish to threaten us all with to see what extra money
they can wangle out of this union. They could easily here have voted for the
rest of the UK to have this Daylight saving bill but opted out themselves.
Why did they not do this, because as second rate politicians the're both dumb
and also stupid too and when faced with a golden opportunity to show common
sense over an issue they blow it. The Scots represent about 15% of the UK
population but feel they should be the deciding factor on most things regarding
the UK as a whole. They loose this influence if they leave the union so you
can bet your last dollar on the politicians there never going the whole
hog and taking independence. They can't anyway for they would see 1 million
Scots cross the boarder to live in the UK they would suffer a brain-drain.
All know that Scotland can not survive without the generous subsidese they
receive from the UK purse. They will not get this from Brussels if they leave
the UK union. Also they don't own all the North Sea oil, only two tenths of it,
for the other eight tenths falls into English waters. Time we called Scotlands
bluff on this independence issue and I suspect also the Scottish population
too would like to call this bluff on their politicians.
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Message 1191937 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 10:55:20 UTC

To be fair, the Scottish view was if that bill went through, it would mean that up in the North, it wouldn't get light until 10am in the morning, which they said was unacceptable. A not unreasonable point. It caused a bit of a fuss because the change was widely supported on both sides of the House, and was also receiving Government support and backing.

Moreover the Bill had written into it a provision that a trial had to be carried out first to the satisfaction all sides before it became enshrined in law. It must also be said that it wasn't all Scotland, a number of other MP's were against it as well. As far as I know it will be brought in again by another MP as a Private Members Bill in the the next Parliamentary session.

I don't think it would have been practical for business or commerce to have had Scotland being 1 hour different to the rest of the UK. It has to apply to all or none. But Scotland has always as been banging the drum for more independence, and the 1998 Scotland Act gave them their own Parliament. It makes sense to have Devolved Assemblies like Wales and Northern Ireland, but Scotland wants more.

All we are really seeing here is Alex Salmond and the SNP just banging on a bit harder, due to a recent surge in popularity.

The Scottish National has welcomed the findings of the Panelbase poll for the Sunday Times and Real Radio Scotland – which puts support for independence at 47 per cent, compared to 53 per cent opposition – and finds that support for the SNP is at a high of 50 per cent. An Ipsos MORI poll last week put SNP support at 49 per cent.

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Message 1191997 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 16:59:16 UTC

Here's a point to ponder....

Should Scotland succeed in gaining independence & Wales followed suit, that would leave England as an independant nation - Therefore & I hope quite legal, all 3 countries would no longer be bound by the EU as they were admitted as the United Kingdom.

If this actually happens, it would be nice to know if the trough loving horses (oops sorry, politicians) would hold referendums to gain admittance to the EU - Or would I be dreaming.......
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Message 1192000 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 17:17:51 UTC

I don't know if Scotland will gain full independence, I think the odds are against it but who knows. It is being suggested that If Scotland does split then England and Wales would have to re-apply for admission to the EU on a revised basis. But I doubt there would be s special referendum upon that, the government would simply regard it as restoring the Status Quo.

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Message 1192012 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 18:02:13 UTC
Last modified: 6 Feb 2012, 18:54:34 UTC

Would be a bit of a laugh if Scotland did vote to leave the union then finally
leave. Claiming independence from one union only to fall under the eventual
full control of another, namely the ECM. Then later only for the UK to leave the
ECM and gain it's total independence from them. As history always shows, put
the control and running of your countries in the hands of your politicians
and see them finally wreck for you....wake-up Scotland, the grass
is not greener on the other side as your politicians wish for you to believe!
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Message 1192031 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 19:48:38 UTC

There are a number of ways of running countries. You can have a Dictatorship, which is fine if you happen to be in with the Dictators in-crowd, not so good if not. You can have a Military Junta, where if you disagree you get shot, and it only lasts until the next coup anyway. Or you can have single party Communist run countries which aren't much fun to live in either, or you can have a country run by revered religious leaders.

In the civilised West we prefer to have our countries run by democratically elected representatives of the people, also called Politicians. Most politicians are Members of a certain political party, and the most popular party gets to govern. If we didn't have that system be would be back in the Middle Ages with feudal Barons, Lords of the Manor, and serfs.

If people don't like their politicians they have regular elections where they can choose to vote them out, which also applies to local Councillors running local Government. The Scots regularly get a thistle stuck up their sporran now and again, I'm not taking too much notice of it.

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Message 1192078 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 22:04:54 UTC - in response to Message 1191997.

Heck, then England could petition to be part of the US -- more than one way to eliminate the evil of the monarchy and National Health in one play. <g>



If this actually happens, it would be nice to know if the trough loving horses (oops sorry, politicians) would hold referendums to gain admittance to the EU - Or would I be dreaming.......

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Message 1192092 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 22:52:12 UTC - in response to Message 1192031.

If we didn't have that system be would be back in the Middle Ages with feudal Barons, Lords of the Manor, and serfs.

Kinda funny when you consider the 2 houses of british parliament are the house of Lords and the house of commons. Not as bad as the dark ages but still that glimmer of the good old days
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Message 1192110 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 23:40:25 UTC

@BarryAZ -

more than one way to eliminate the evil of the monarchy and National Health in one play.

Sorry I can't accept that. There is nothing evil about the Queen or the Monarchy. And I would rather have the NHS than Medicare or Medicaid, thank you very much.

@Skildude -
Not as bad as the dark ages but still that glimmer of the good old days

C'mon get real! Lords in the 21C are positions of honour, not positions of feudal anarchy. But you know that very well, so you are just being mischievous :-)

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Message 1192111 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 23:45:58 UTC - in response to Message 1192110.

You did notice the trailing <g> --- figured the comment might wind someone up though <smile>

@BarryAZ

Sorry I can't accept that. There is nothing evil about the Queen or the Monarchy. And I would rather have the NHS than Medicare or Medicaid, thank you very much.



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Message 1192115 - Posted: 6 Feb 2012, 23:50:19 UTC

You did notice the trailing <g> --- figured the comment might wind someone up though <smile>


Yes of course I did, but you are being a bit naughty on the 60th Anniversary so I wasn't going to let you get away with it. And I am sure you wouldn't have expected me to either :-)

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Message 1192137 - Posted: 7 Feb 2012, 1:26:41 UTC - in response to Message 1192115.

Oooh - I just love it when a Brit includes a sentence with naughty bits <g>

But let us go all traditional, bring back a Catholic England - you need a Stuart.



Yes of course I did, but you are being a bit naughty on the 60th Anniversary so I wasn't going to let you get away with it. And I am sure you wouldn't have expected me to either :-)

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Message 1192150 - Posted: 7 Feb 2012, 3:49:37 UTC

My ancestors were of Scotch/Irish lines but I am still at a loss to comprehend in this day and age the urge to break away from Great Britain. Afterall the four entities that make up Great Britain are stronger together than they ever could be separately. Just think what a mess the USA would be if it were 50 independent countries.
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