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Profile Gary Charpentier Crowdfunding Project Donor*Special Project $75 donorSpecial Project $250 donor
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Message 1183107 - Posted: 6 Jan 2012, 4:41:23 UTC - in response to Message 1182649.  

If a serious approach to the revenue side (federal taxes as a piece of GDP are at their lowest point since 1950), joined with a serious approach of the expenditure side, there might be a chance. But for now, in the 'I'm right, you're wrong' mode of politics, all we have is one side saying it is 100% expenditures, and the other side saying it is 25% expenditures and 75% revenue. There is no middle ground, and thus, lacking either a Democrat domination (not going to happen) or a TeaPublican domination (I don't see that happening either), we won't get anything done. Now, if compromise and governance were not four letter words, perhaps we'd get something done short of a dictatorship.

The idiots we have now who refuse to cut spending at all unless taxes go up are idiots. The idiots we have now who refuse to raise "taxes" at all are idiots. (I think they are willing to raise revenue, it just has to be called a user fee not a tax.)

In any case this Mexican Standoff has to end. The country defaults and becomes a slave to Red China if it doesn't.

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Message 1183118 - Posted: 6 Jan 2012, 5:34:16 UTC - in response to Message 1183106.  

Ah yes, eliminate the 16th (I believe it is) Amendment -- and do so via.... oops the Senate get's a piece of that decision and a super-super majority at that.

As long as we are at it, let's reestablish property requirements and eliminate the vote for women. We simply must return to the good old boy days.

Consider this, the states are subject to special interest bickering and are even less (if that is possible) capable of resisting it.




This is perhaps why more than anything else, the Senate should not be elected by the people, but should be elected by the state, as it originally was. Stop the identical special interest bickering of the house and senate and substitute an entirely different set of special interest bickering in the senate. When they are bought for different types of things, those ideas that are good for everyone may get through.


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Message 1183119 - Posted: 6 Jan 2012, 5:36:47 UTC - in response to Message 1183107.  

I think we agree here -- there is plenty of idiocy to go around.

I like the idea of a user fee for folks making $1M or more <smile>.


The idiots we have now who refuse to cut spending at all unless taxes go up are idiots. The idiots we have now who refuse to raise "taxes" at all are idiots. (I think they are willing to raise revenue, it just has to be called a user fee not a tax.)

In any case this Mexican Standoff has to end. The country defaults and becomes a slave to Red China if it doesn't.

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Message 1183132 - Posted: 6 Jan 2012, 7:09:58 UTC - in response to Message 1183107.  

By the way, there was a cut in spending -- sequestration will kick in if the standoff continues.

Further, if (and I know this might be a nightmare scenario for you) the Teapublican candidate for dictator doesn't win the office formally known as President, then on the tax side there will be a raise (or rather a return to the pre Bush II tax levels). I suspect in that scenario, the TeaPublicans just might try to be their own 'voices of reason' by suggesting a dfferent range budget cuts in exchange for something other than the total elimination of the 2001 tax cuts.

Oh, and regarding China, well for the US, the major problem with the budget deficit is demographic (the recession of course amplified the problem with major short/intermediate term 'deficit enhancement') -- China actually will be facing an even more serious demographic problem -- as a function of their 'one-child' enforcement for over 20 years. Their population is on the cusp of rapid aging -- along the lines of Europe and Japan. Folks in the west need to evaluate what the combination of one child families along with the preference of those one child families for boys means for a country which, notwithstanding its rapid economic growth, is still a quite poor country (the rural hinterlands of China have hundreds of millions of quite poor people).



The idiots we have now who refuse to cut spending at all unless taxes go up are idiots. The idiots we have now who refuse to raise "taxes" at all are idiots. (I think they are willing to raise revenue, it just has to be called a user fee not a tax.)

In any case this Mexican Standoff has to end. The country defaults and becomes a slave to Red China if it doesn't.

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Message 1183138 - Posted: 6 Jan 2012, 7:53:06 UTC

Teapublican candidate for dictator


Sounds Good to Dullnando.

DictateToMeDullnando

May we All have a METAMORPHOSIS. REASON. GOoD JUDGEMENT and LOVE and ORDER!!!!!
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Message 1183220 - Posted: 6 Jan 2012, 14:57:37 UTC - in response to Message 1183132.  

Oh, and regarding China, well for the US, the major problem with the budget deficit is demographic (the recession of course amplified the problem with major short/intermediate term 'deficit enhancement') -- China actually will be facing an even more serious demographic problem -- as a function of their 'one-child' enforcement for over 20 years. Their population is on the cusp of rapid aging -- along the lines of Europe and Japan. Folks in the west need to evaluate what the combination of one child families along with the preference of those one child families for boys means for a country which, notwithstanding its rapid economic growth, is still a quite poor country (the rural hinterlands of China have hundreds of millions of quite poor people).

Yes all those boys and no girls. Sounds like they are raising an army to invade and get killed off. I wonder if they even offer a wife to every soldier that returns ...


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Message 1183534 - Posted: 7 Jan 2012, 18:18:52 UTC - in response to Message 1183465.  

Guy, it looks like we are more in agreement than not, aside from your epithet regarding Obama. After all, our President lacks the skin tone to be other than a socialist or dictator I suppose (at least in the view of some of the fair skinned bunch) <smile>
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Message 1183536 - Posted: 7 Jan 2012, 18:22:44 UTC

Guy, regarding election of Senators -- given how manipulated the state districts are, that results in state legislators being even more extreme (right or left) than we see in Congress. (I know, how could they be more extreme than what we have there -- but they are).

I live in Arizona, where over half the legislature lacks college education -- and find that to be quite disconcerting. This is a legislature which approves concealed carry of weapons on school grounds...... by students.
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Message 1183549 - Posted: 7 Jan 2012, 19:14:58 UTC - in response to Message 1183465.  

Gary Charpentier quote "Okay, I'll bite. What countries are on any precious metal standard today? Are their economies in good shape?"

Okay, you tell me what country currently on a fiat currency is not accelerating into hyperinflation? (Sort of a trick question since everyone in the modern world is using a fiat currency because there is such a huge immediate, short-term gain to be rewarded with when switching to a fiat currency.) And what is the 100% solution to hyperinflation every time it has been tried? You don't have to go back very far in history. Usually people ignore news like this.

Quoting Ben Bernanke on monetary policy is like quoting the wolf on lamb policy.

So your answer is none. And you think Dr. Bernanke has no idea of good monetary policy. Okay. I bet you think horses are the way to go because they emit less greenhouse gas than a car.


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Message 1183626 - Posted: 8 Jan 2012, 0:20:35 UTC - in response to Message 1183611.  

No -- Arpaio is a professional demogogue - laws mean very little to him -- which sort of sets a bad example as sheriff. If there was justice, he'd serve in his own jails -- and not the soft ones he has set up for those who contribute to his political coffers, but the nasty ones for those who don't.

Further, if he, incarcerated, should lather a bit about the injustice of it all, he should be consigned to the special control chairs he has his lackeys use for those who don't behave.


Barry in Arizona,

Well, I'm not surprised to find out we're not too far apart in our thinking. I like the way Arpaio thinks, do you? Green baloney, pink underwear....


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Message 1183633 - Posted: 8 Jan 2012, 0:36:42 UTC

Guy,

Dr. Bernanke is a politician? Well, I do see where he ran for school board once, but somehow I don't think that makes him a politician at the level you seem to claim. Of course if you want to call him an academic, that I'd agree with, or are you saying that the academic class is the political class?

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Message 1183634 - Posted: 8 Jan 2012, 0:38:06 UTC

Guys, lets keep AZ politics out of the USA thread. Start an AZ thread if you want to discuss it further.


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Message 1183639 - Posted: 8 Jan 2012, 1:10:33 UTC - in response to Message 1183634.  

My apologies Gary -- and a fair point it is. One perhaps tangent note, the AZ state budget actually managed a surplus this year. They did it in part by a way perhaps suggested for the Federal budget -- by denying healthcare coverage to about 100K poor folks previously covered under state/federal combined programs.

Actually saved the Fed budget some dollars, because of the state change, the US denied something like $200M matching funds to the state.

Another way the state saved money -- reducing support for education, not only K thru 12, but also to universities. There are plenty of folks in Congress advocating Federal cuts to education as well.

So perhaps a model for at least some folks in Congress to consider.

Anyway, the only reason I persist (for this one message) in mentioning the great state of AZ is to present their approach to budget balancing.
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Message 1183959 - Posted: 9 Jan 2012, 5:08:44 UTC - in response to Message 1183755.  

Guy,

Dr. Bernanke is a politician? Well, I do see where he ran for school board once, but somehow I don't think that makes him a politician at the level you seem to claim. Of course if you want to call him an academic, that I'd agree with, or are you saying that the academic class is the political class?


He was appointed by a politician, that makes him a politician. (That's how I see it.)

Warning: Do not use as an ice cream topping.


Using that logic my local beat police officer is a politician, the Chief is appointed by a politician, and thus the Chief is a politician; the Chief appoints the senior management, thus the senior management are politicians; the senior management appoint lower levels of management, etc, etc. Madness.
I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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Message 1183975 - Posted: 9 Jan 2012, 7:05:58 UTC - in response to Message 1183959.  
Last modified: 9 Jan 2012, 7:06:37 UTC

Guy,

Dr. Bernanke is a politician? Well, I do see where he ran for school board once, but somehow I don't think that makes him a politician at the level you seem to claim. Of course if you want to call him an academic, that I'd agree with, or are you saying that the academic class is the political class?


He was appointed by a politician, that makes him a politician. (That's how I see it.)

Warning: Do not use as an ice cream topping.


Using that logic my local beat police officer is a politician, the Chief is appointed by a politician, and thus the Chief is a politician; the Chief appoints the senior management, thus the senior management are politicians; the senior management appoint lower levels of management, etc, etc. Madness.


Well, Bobby, the term 'politics', while it does have several meanings involving government, it is a bit more inclusive than that.


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/politics

meaning 5 a: the total complex of relations between people living in society

The term 'politician' is a bit more narrowly defined


http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/politician

meaning 1: a person experienced in the art or science of government; especially : one actively engaged in conducting the business of a government

Now then, the Federal Reserve is essentially a corporation with some rather strong ties to the Federal Government of the USA.

'The Fed' has a .gov URL:
http://www.federalreserve.gov/


The seven members of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System are appointed by the US President and confirmed by the US Senate, just like, for instance, Secretary of State. Is Ms. Clinton NOT a politician??

Now then, Dr. Bernanke is, essentially, the Chairman of the Board of 'the Fed'. The Board members of regular, publicly traded corporations (for example, IBM, ExxonMobile, AT&T...) are elected to their positions, as is the Chairman, with the voters ultimately being the corporate stockholders. They are most definitely political positions, responsible for the government of the corporation. In a regular, publicly traded Corporation, the Chairman and the rest of the Board are politicians.

No matter which way you slice it, Dr. Bernanke, Chairman of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System *IS* a politician.
https://youtu.be/iY57ErBkFFE

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Don't blame me, I voted for Johnson(L) in 2016.

Truth is dangerous... especially when it challenges those in power.
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Message 1184084 - Posted: 9 Jan 2012, 17:28:50 UTC - in response to Message 1183975.  

meaning 1: a person experienced in the art or science of government; especially : one actively engaged in conducting the business of a government


Thus we are all politicians to some degree rendering the term useless. Clearly the Chairman of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System is a political appointment, though if the term "politician" it to be useful epithet, I'd say it's a bit more open to debate whether any particular incumbent of that office is a politician to the same extent as, say, the Secretary of State. To put it another way, is the recipient of a political appointment an ex-officio member of the political class?

On the question of semantics, I find it odd that people are reticent to explain how another is meant to interpret their words, seems to me that this is a recipe for confusion.

I think you'll find it's a bit more complicated than that ...

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