Damn the oil speculators........


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Profile Bob DeWoody
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Message 1145696 - Posted: 27 Aug 2011, 5:40:26 UTC
Last modified: 27 Aug 2011, 5:41:02 UTC

I would support some form of control over the price of oil, coal and natural gas as a strategic commodity and therefore it should be outside the day to day fluctuations of the stock and commodities markets. But who would be in charge and who would they have to answer to?
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Message 1145739 - Posted: 27 Aug 2011, 8:28:36 UTC

I think Bob is right. I have always supported the premise that basic life neccessities in a country should be provided on a non profit basis as a social provision. Gas, water, electric, telephone, solid and liquid fuels, transport etc. In the UK most of it has be de-nationalised and privatised.

The excuse was that it encouraged competition. Ok, the nationalised industries were hugely inefficient, but they worked, and you didn't have customer service going out of the window, nor shareholders creaming off all the money leaving nothing for re-investment.

It was a cash strapped government selling off the family silver to raise money, which they can never now afford to buy back. Oil and oil products prices should be regulated by government control and not subject to fluctuating profit margins.

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Message 1145866 - Posted: 27 Aug 2011, 16:16:11 UTC - in response to Message 1145739.

All energy and strategic assets, which to my mind, includes, public transportation and water supply should never be in the hands of private companies. These are the assets of a nation, not some grubby little man in a 'pin-striped suit! I'm pretty sure that I've stated this in this forum, before and I'll keep on saying it. We've all seen what happens when the 'money men' get things wrong....we all pay and things stay the same for them!



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Message 1145903 - Posted: 27 Aug 2011, 16:59:56 UTC

Last year, when I went back to Devon for a holiday, there were large tankers full of crude oil, just anchored in Lyme Bay and in other places around the South-West coast of the UK. Prices at the pumps were going down and these tankers were just sitting there, waiting for stocks to run low, and the price to go up. Its not governments, tax and conflict that cause the huge increases in fuel costs - it is 'speculators'. It always has been. The same people who find ways to not pay tax, whilst living lives of luxury, expecting everyone else to pay tax to subsidise their 'write-offs'. I got wise to them, years ago and, frankly even with my 'extended RAF vocabulary', words fail to adequately describe these people! My understanding is, their actions are called 'capitalism' and they are aided by governments throughout the World, because they are corrupt and they 'feed' off all of us. Every last stinking one of them. Strong words, perhaps, but when did you ever see a national politician get on a bus?



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Message 1145950 - Posted: 27 Aug 2011, 18:41:22 UTC

oh fella's, sorry we can't bother the rich...or their money...because they are the ones creating jobs!! (what jobs?)

we have to pony up ourselves and sacrifice for the good of the nation...
if that means taking great-grandma out of the nursing home because medicare and social security have been gutted...

see with out tax breaks the oil companies cannot exist on their meager multi billion dollar profits...they can't explore for new oil or build new refineries...without tax breaks...and we as good americans have got to support them...or we won't be able to drive around in our huge gas guzzling cars!!

and we have to start taxing the bottom 50% of the population...
families of four that make $25,000 a year and pay NO taxes....because we can't
tax the top 2% that are making billions of dollars a year...because we are still waiting for them to create jobs!!!

http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/thu-august-18-2011/world-of-class-warfare---the-poor-s-free-ride-is-over?
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Message 1145966 - Posted: 27 Aug 2011, 19:33:52 UTC

Last year, when I went back to Devon for a holiday, there were large tankers full of crude oil, just anchored in Lyme Bay and in other places around the South-West coast of the UK.


Hi Iona, my family home is on Lyme bay, so I know exactly what you mean. Although a lot of shipping shelters there because of rough weather in the channel.

Strong words, perhaps, but when did you ever see a national politician get on a bus?


Norman Tebbit was famously told to get on his bike once, and that clown Boris Johnson occasionally uses his. But yes, I broadly agree with you.
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Message 1146188 - Posted: 28 Aug 2011, 2:36:56 UTC

Wow. Just wow.
You really want regulation?
That stance flies in the face of the stances you take on so many other issues.
Sure, blame it on Obama. Riiight. (Not that we could say politicians of either US party aren't rich.)

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Message 1146217 - Posted: 28 Aug 2011, 5:31:04 UTC - in response to Message 1146188.

sad but true W actually set in motion the elimination of certain speculation(people that had no oil holdings or businesses involved in any way with oil) on Oil during his last few years in office. It had a nice chilling effect on speculator. Unfortunately, like most pond scum they seem to have found another means to survive off the very thing they were banned from
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Message 1146352 - Posted: 28 Aug 2011, 17:37:06 UTC

pond scum?
like used car salesmen?
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Message 1146428 - Posted: 28 Aug 2011, 20:04:58 UTC

like used car salesmen?


Where can you find some unused car salesmen. The people, not the cars !

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Message 1146440 - Posted: 28 Aug 2011, 20:22:25 UTC

In Portugal the situation is similar as in the UK. We had all energy companies nationalized and then in the name of competitivity everything was privatized.
Guess what? Prices are all the same around the service providers and everyone says that there are no cartel practices. Same with the price of petrol or gas, doesn’t matter if the price of crude is more or less stable, prices at the pump keep rising, and once again by magic in all the providers, at the same hour and in the same amount… Funny I’m paying now more by gallon or liter of fuel when the price of crude was at 145 us per barrel.
One day, mr and miss tax payer will explode, because all this companies are acting shameless with the government support. I feel helpless and somehow just want to puke.
These are some of the situations that give me doubts about democracy. It seems something is rotten in our system, and the smell comes from the chamber where the politicians and the government work.

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Message 1146490 - Posted: 28 Aug 2011, 22:26:24 UTC

"because all this companies are acting shameless with the government support."

because they bought the politicians!!!
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Message 1146537 - Posted: 29 Aug 2011, 2:54:56 UTC - in response to Message 1146217.

sad but true W actually set in motion the elimination of certain speculation(people that had no oil holdings or businesses involved in any way with oil) on Oil during his last few years in office. It had a nice chilling effect on speculator. Unfortunately, like most pond scum they seem to have found another means to survive off the very thing they were banned from

Really? This does not sound like something George W. Bush would do. Please provide links or some sort of elaboration.
I would think regulating things such as stem cell research was more up his alley.

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Message 1146585 - Posted: 29 Aug 2011, 4:58:14 UTC - in response to Message 1146537.

To be honest, there are so many antiBUSH websites that getting a real quote that isn't an embarrassing one is pretty hard.
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Message 1146612 - Posted: 29 Aug 2011, 5:56:24 UTC

I am that I am said the burning Bush.

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Message 1146614 - Posted: 29 Aug 2011, 6:02:16 UTC - in response to Message 1146537.

sad but true W actually set in motion the elimination of certain speculation(people that had no oil holdings or businesses involved in any way with oil) on Oil during his last few years in office. It had a nice chilling effect on speculator. Unfortunately, like most pond scum they seem to have found another means to survive off the very thing they were banned from

Really? This does not sound like something George W. Bush would do. Please provide links or some sort of elaboration.
I would think regulating things such as stem cell research was more up his alley.


I was not aware the commodity exchange had stopped listing oil.
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Message 1146623 - Posted: 29 Aug 2011, 8:48:30 UTC - in response to Message 1146440.
Last modified: 29 Aug 2011, 9:12:51 UTC

Cartels, monopolies, Trusts, restraint of fair trade and price-fixing have nothing to do with democracies.

These are all banned. Teddy Roosevelt may have been the last president to enforce actions against these illegal situations. Now the cartels and monopolies are international and the PACs and Lobbyists bribe the legislature with their "Campaign Contributions" and hence escape regulation. If there is no police force nor enforcement there is Chaos. Sort of like a football game with no rules.

Unfortunately, democracy requires regulation and enforcement of rules. We tend to over-regulate and gum up the works for essentials and fail to regulate important things for which Congress is paid to turn the other way.

We also implement policies (Ethanol, subsidies, oil depletion, etc) that favor special interests to the detriment of the society at large.

Sometimes I think a benevolent dictatorship is the way to go. Very few benevolent dictators that are smart enough to chart a valid course can be found however. At least in a democracy the scoundrels can be replaced with new scoundrels. These new folks may then take a little while to corrupt.

Someone said "Democracy is a terrible form of government except that there is nothing better"

Actually the US is not a democracy--we are nominally a Federal Republic. To which I would say--a Federal Socialist Republic--is more correct.

Perhaps we are really a Bribeocracy or at best an Incompetancy.

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Message 1146627 - Posted: 29 Aug 2011, 9:11:36 UTC
Last modified: 29 Aug 2011, 9:16:23 UTC

sad but true W actually set in motion the elimination of certain speculation(people that had no oil holdings or businesses involved in any way with oil) on Oil during his last few years in office. It had a nice chilling effect on speculator. Unfortunately, like most pond scum they seem to have found another means to survive off the very thing they were banned from


I don't think this is correct. I am quite sure that you can buy oil futures if you so desire even if you do not take delivery of the contract for your own use.

Tripling the margin requirements and prosecuting front-running Market Makers and Wall Street Insiders would go a long way to fixing the problem with oil. There will always be a problem with oil due to the fact that it is International in it's production and market manipulation and therefore, largely beyond our control. Add to this the fact that a lot of it is in politically unstable and unfriendly regions and you have ample incentive to try to reduce usage and to boost development of your own resources. We do have the Markets here on our shores and a lot of the crooks "is us" to paraphrase a marsupial philosopher.

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