'What-if' an advanced ET were to notice Earth?...

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Message 1149298 - Posted: 5 Sep 2011, 19:19:32 UTC

Just a question which may have been posted by others in the past but I'm unaware of since I'm new to this board:

Some of the pulses detected by Astropulse couldn't be caused by EMPs from nuclear wars in distant planets? Obviously one cannot readily differentiate them from other naturally occurring pulses yet they could be an admittedly sad manifestation of intelligent life out there. I don't know what the effective radiated power would be in the segment of the spectrum we are tuning in but I would imagine is quite large.

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Message 1149363 - Posted: 5 Sep 2011, 21:31:25 UTC - in response to Message 1145378.  

The distances between stars are to vast, unless those aliens have mastered warmhole traveling, or other exoctic means of propulsion; higly doubtfull that aliens ever visited Earth or ever will. The " what if, or you never know " scenarios simply do not aplly. Lets apply physics and astronomy when talking about ET visiting Earth. Like saying the aliens helped the Egyptians, Astecs, and Incas in building their pyramids, that is called, bad astronomy. Much more probable that SETI will capture ETI radios signals. The identification of habitable planets with life will happen with tools such as Keppler space telescope, and other telescopes.
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Message 1150211 - Posted: 8 Sep 2011, 21:40:59 UTC

BTW, my SETI@HOME project just picked up a Gaussian pulse with a score of 4.2....:O
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Message 1150259 - Posted: 9 Sep 2011, 0:19:19 UTC - in response to Message 1150211.  

BTW, my SETI@HOME project just picked up a Gaussian pulse with a score of 4.2....:O

you mentioned this on another thread. No need to spam. Your results will get their review just not by us. If the result is anything it will be added to the millions of other results in the data base


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Message 1154293 - Posted: 21 Sep 2011, 1:04:36 UTC

In the 1950'S a guy flying a Sea Fury fighter between Goulbourn and Nowra in NSW Aust took some gun camera film of a "thing" which was clocked on radar, departing the scene at 1400mph, which was NOT attainable by "then" aircraft in service use.
I suppose he had a "vision", like dream at 20,000 feet doing 450mph.
There were 2 of those "things" and they were tracked on a 277 radar site.
I looked at the pic of the things on the lintel, and it looked OK to me, along with the other images. Like the "Varamas"
Are we sure that Ezekiel was a nutter,or do these things??? make a 50 year round trip every 50 years to see how we are doing.
If I were a "advanced" Space guy the last place I'd want to visit would be here.
If you were to imagine what people doing long space trips looked like, they would not be like us. At least 30% of our size, saves space inside vehicles, reduces load levels, fixed populations,no baby boomers, reproduction by cloning, and long sleeps during trips.
We need to start reducing our size, or we will never get off this falling apart brick.
We have about 1 million years before the planet starts rolling about.VBG.
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Message 1154297 - Posted: 21 Sep 2011, 1:16:35 UTC - in response to Message 1154293.  

In the 1950'S a guy flying a Sea Fury fighter between Goulbourn and Nowra in NSW Aust took some gun camera film of a "thing" which was clocked on radar, departing the scene at 1400mph, which was NOT attainable by "then" aircraft in service use.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sound_barrier
By the 1950s, new aircraft designs started to routinely "break" the sound barrier.

And what part of secret government program ...

Just like the Aurora Aircraft (classified no such thing) that the Caltech Seismology laboratory tracked every time it flew back to Area 51 via Southern California from the Pacific Ocean Test Area.
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Message 1155057 - Posted: 22 Sep 2011, 23:36:00 UTC

Scanning through Project Bluebook I begin to wonder if we already have. Is it possible the nuclear end to world war two got their attention? In the 1950’s there were enough sightings for the government to investigate with some interesting results. That may be due to media coverage bringing it to every ones attention or it may be there were more sightings so the media reacted but the increase in sightings had another cause. Possibly two large nuclear bursts getting every ones attention? Which is cause and which is effect? I don’t want to rule out either case but I find the timing interesting.
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Message 1155111 - Posted: 23 Sep 2011, 2:37:01 UTC - in response to Message 1154293.  

Just like the B17th stealth plane, during its development in the late 70's to 80's, people leaving around area 51 would think that they saw a UFO. Just an earthly plane. UFOs are stuff fantasy, no substance in reality or science.
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Message 1156172 - Posted: 26 Sep 2011, 2:44:57 UTC

Frequenting these message boards, I am of the impression that those people running the Seti@home project do not believe in UFO's, that we are possibly being visited, that UFO's are crafts or beings of some sorts.

Rather they are looking for a signal coming to us through space, originating from a distant solar system possibly having planets, or if not so, a signal coming from somewhere in space itself.

But UFO's generally are not known to be producing signals. Also they are regarded as being fast moving objects.

Using Google Toolbar in my Internet Explorer web-browser I put in the words "Type 4 civilization".

There was some stuff I came across a couple of days ago which related to the propulsion technologies which might be used by different types of civilizations.

Perhaps "Level" is a better word than "Type" in this context?

One of the web-pages discussing this in some detail is this one:

http://www.weirdwarp.com/2009/07/alien-civilization-types-from-1-to-7/ .

You may be able to find other web-pages of interest as well from the search criteria.
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Message 1156208 - Posted: 26 Sep 2011, 7:52:08 UTC

So what do you consider a basis in reality or science to mean? When an object is both seen by pilots and recorded on radar moving at extreme speed and maneuvering in ways considered to be impossible even in theory, it is by definition an unidentified flying object. Physical and scientific evidence that something was there has been found in several investigations. Are you saying radar and pilot reports are all being faked? Are you saying that the investigators in project bluebook are incompetent, or the evidence they collected fictional? I am certain a large number of UFO reports are fakes or something quite ordinary in our world that is just not understood by the people seeing it. Scientific progress is made through gathering and analyzing data. To class all UFO reports and associated evidence as fiction is not a scientific approach at all. It is very human, but not very scientific.
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Message 1156246 - Posted: 26 Sep 2011, 11:59:45 UTC - in response to Message 1156208.  

Collecting and analyzing data is about repeatable results in a controlled environment. Every scientist will tell you that eye witness reports are the most fallible of all evidence.

The problem with the scientists at Project Bluebook is that the only information they had to go off of was eye witness reports, making all of their data unsubstantiated, circumstantial, and questionable at best.
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Message 1156415 - Posted: 26 Sep 2011, 20:31:16 UTC
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Repeatable results in a laboratory when possible, absolutely. When not possible then you are stuck analyzing what data you can get. I agree that eye witnesses can be unreliable, but not all of them all the time. The investigators at project bluebook worked with what they had but it was more than just eyewitnesses. Each person must decide which evidence they will accept and which evidence they will not. It is just as unwise to accept everything as it is to exclude everything. If you accept only what can be reproduced under controlled conditions theories like evolution and the big bang theory must be false? Or did they reproduce it and I haven’t heard about it? If you exclude all witnesses as unreliable we may as well stop having history classes in school or prosecuting crimes that were not caught on video. Wait, videos are all fake? I would like to see at least some effort on the part of the scientific community to help UFO hunters obtain more useful data. Most UFO hunters are regular people with cameras. If there has been any effort to help UFO hunters develop equipment that will provide better or more useful data I am not aware of it but I applaud their efforts. My theory is that some of these unidentified objects are alien in origin. I will collect data as I am able and keep trying to prove that theory. If you have a different theory I invite you to do the same.
Between us we can hopefully identify all of them and find out.
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Message 1156422 - Posted: 26 Sep 2011, 21:00:18 UTC - in response to Message 1156415.  

If you accept only what can be reproduced under controlled conditions theories like evolution and the big bang theory must be false?


There's a reason why they're still classified as theories and not submitted as fact. At least with theories like evolution and the big bang, we have observed many things that have brought us to this conclusion. These observations can be seen by anyone with the right tools and is not limited to being in the right place at the right time.

If you exclude all witnesses as unreliable we may as well stop having history classes in school or prosecuting crimes that were not caught on video.


I never said to exclude all witnesses. I simply said they are unreliable and no way to base conclusions off of.

Wait, videos are all fake?


Some are. Those that are not are often grainy and of questionable quality to the point that the object(s) on camera can really be anything. Every time I've seen a video held to critical scrutiny, they simply don't hold up.

I would like to see at least some effort on the part of the scientific community to help UFO hunters obtain more useful data. Most UFO hunters are regular people with cameras. If there has been any effort to help UFO hunters develop equipment that will provide better or more useful data I am not aware of it but I applaud their efforts. My theory is that some of these unidentified objects are alien in origin. I will collect data as I am able and keep trying to prove that theory.


Scientific instruments are developed out of need. When Galileo created the first telescope, he did so out of need. His invention became useful to others who built upon his idea to make it better.

If other scientists actually felt there was merit in the claims, they would be clamoring to help be the one to discover another race. The mere fact that no one is knocking down doors in this age old area of interest should speak volumes of the credibility of the claims.

If you have a different theory I invite you to do the same.


My only conclusion is that based upon the lack of credible evidence, I see no reason to believe aliens have visited us, or are currently visiting us. I would like to find out whether they even exist or not by running SETI@Home as the only plausible way I can contribute to the scientific process of discovery.
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Message 1156472 - Posted: 27 Sep 2011, 0:09:04 UTC
Last modified: 27 Sep 2011, 0:13:29 UTC

I think Hans Lippershey would disagree with you about Galileo inventing the telescope considering he offered the invention to the military in 1608 and was the first to seek a patent. Galileo did make considerable improvements to the device and was the first to use it to explore the heavens in 1609. What need did Galileo have other than to satisfy his curiosity or to explore the unknown, to learn? In general you are correct however, we do not put resources into developing technology we do not need and the most useful will be the most used.
I do submit my belief that there are aliens coming to earth as theory and it is based on many observations that anyone can make. For example 6000 years of recording the same style of object flying through the air. Anyone with the equipment can go to any of these caves all over the world and carbon date them and compare the images. You seem to believe witness reports are not sufficient to give credibility to physical evidence that is not conclusive. I on the other hand consider the same evidence to give credibility to the witness statements.
As far as mainstream science knocking down doors to help my first thought is of Columbus but I think a better example is Wesley H. Ketchum M.D. of Hopkinsville Kentucky, USA. in the early 20th century.
Dr. Ketchum was a prominent doctor in Kentucky who had gained the reputation as a miracle worker. He had repeatedly diagnosed and treated cases that had baffled the scientific community. He did this not once or twice but time and time again, all verifiable through his patients and records. In July of 1910 Dr. Ketchum was asked to submit a paper for the September meeting of the American Association for Clinical Research to be held in Boston. In this paper Dr. Ketchum explained that he was able to diagnose and treat these baffling cases by consulting with a psychic named Edgar Cayce and it was actually Cayce who made the diagnosis and determined treatment which was then administered by Dr. Ketchum. Dr. Ketchum’s astounding record of success suddenly meant nothing. Soon after his paper became public the majority of doctors in Christian County Kentucky went to the court house in Hopkinsville and demanded Dr. Ketchum’s license to practice medicine be revoked. Dr. Ketchum’s results were beyond question and he was able to recreate those results for anyone’s scrutiny. Yet Dr. Ketchum and Cayce and their acomplishments are ignored by mainstream science. I consider this not a failing in Dr. Ketchum or Cayce but rather a failing in us. When confronted with something not possible by our understanding we discount it rather than working to expand our understanding to explain it. Dr. Ketchum repeatedly provided verifiable results and rather than beating down his door to help him, they shunned him.
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Message 1156480 - Posted: 27 Sep 2011, 0:52:34 UTC

Dr Ketchum and Edgar Cayce does make for very interesting reading.
Edgar Cayce's predictions tended to flounder post 1945.
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Message 1156509 - Posted: 27 Sep 2011, 3:07:26 UTC - in response to Message 1156472.  
Last modified: 27 Sep 2011, 3:29:58 UTC

I think Hans Lippershey would disagree with you about Galileo inventing the telescope considering he offered the invention to the military in 1608 and was the first to seek a patent.


Mea culpa.

I do submit my belief that there are aliens coming to earth as theory and it is based on many observations that anyone can make. For example 6000 years of recording the same style of object flying through the air. Anyone with the equipment can go to any of these caves all over the world and carbon date them and compare the images.


People have taken the same data and come to different conclusions. Where does it benefit them to simply deny all available evidence as proof of aliens? If there's a more logical explanation, then that is likely the most accurate one.

You seem to believe witness reports are not sufficient to give credibility to physical evidence that is not conclusive. I on the other hand consider the same evidence to give credibility to the witness statements.


Which is all the more reason why your conclusions will always remain skeptical and fail peer review. It is a given that primitive man couldn't explain the world around him, but that doesn't mean what he saw had to be other-worldly. Primitive man also thought that an eclipse of the sun was brought about by an evil demon swallowing the Sun. They thought if they jeered enough at this evil being, that it would leave. When the moon eventually passed, as it would naturally do, primitive man would believe that it actually had an effect on the outcome. They would then write down their experience, and likely depict the moon more as a beast than simply a circular object.

As far as mainstream science knocking down doors to help my first thought is of Columbus


That's because Columbus was trying to seek funding for a trip around a flat world as believed by the many uneducated masses during the time... but many mathematicians hundreds of years prior knew from observation and rough calculations that the Earth was round. It just wasn't very popular.

However, as we are in the era of knowledge and science, I would think that with all the scientists in the world, the landscape is quite different from Columbus.

Dr. Ketchum was a prominent doctor in Kentucky who had gained the reputation as a miracle worker. He had repeatedly diagnosed and treated cases that had baffled the scientific community. He did this not once or twice but time and time again, all verifiable through his patients and records. In July of 1910 Dr. Ketchum was asked to submit a paper for the September meeting of the American Association for Clinical Research to be held in Boston. In this paper Dr. Ketchum explained that he was able to diagnose and treat these baffling cases by consulting with a psychic named Edgar Cayce and it was actually Cayce who made the diagnosis and determined treatment which was then administered by Dr. Ketchum. Dr. Ketchum’s astounding record of success suddenly meant nothing. Soon after his paper became public the majority of doctors in Christian County Kentucky went to the court house in Hopkinsville and demanded Dr. Ketchum’s license to practice medicine be revoked. Dr. Ketchum’s results were beyond question and he was able to recreate those results for anyone’s scrutiny. Yet Dr. Ketchum and Cayce and their acomplishments are ignored by mainstream science. I consider this not a failing in Dr. Ketchum or Cayce but rather a failing in us. When confronted with something not possible by our understanding we discount it rather than working to expand our understanding to explain it. Dr. Ketchum repeatedly provided verifiable results and rather than beating down his door to help him, they shunned him.


Yeah, I've read about Edgar Cayce and the man was a verifiable fraud. His "verifiable" evidence was from people who no more than a 9th grade education, and was always second-hand tales to boost his popularity.

Even if he weren't, our understanding of medicine hasn't really taken off until the last 50 years or so. Fooling a bunch of "scientists" from the early 20th century isn't that impressive.

Most of us already know that there's no such thing as psychics or prophets. But there sure are scam artists and profits.

In fact, it was no failure on our part at all. It was a bright moment in history whenever we shun fraudsters and scam artists like Cayce.
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Message 1156519 - Posted: 27 Sep 2011, 3:32:07 UTC

My point exactly, thank you.
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Message 1156605 - Posted: 27 Sep 2011, 12:10:07 UTC - in response to Message 1156519.  

No problem. Glad I can help straighten you out and use a little more critical thinking. Might prevent you from getting snookered in the future.
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