For the folks who belive mars can have life.

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Profile Bob DeWoody
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Message 1143477 - Posted: 21 Aug 2011, 15:47:42 UTC

I think it is commonly agreed that even bacteria are considered "life". No evidence of intelligence or communication ability is required.
Bob DeWoody

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Message 1143484 - Posted: 21 Aug 2011, 16:04:06 UTC

Is a virus life? Remember they need some other cell to reproduce.

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Message 1143485 - Posted: 21 Aug 2011, 16:06:14 UTC - in response to Message 1143477.  
Last modified: 21 Aug 2011, 16:07:07 UTC

I think it is commonly agreed that even bacteria are considered "life". No evidence of intelligence or communication ability is required.

But bacteria do communicate. Remarkably so amongst themselves...


As a glib comment for categorising "life", I'd list:

  • Self replication
  • Adaptability for and/or modification of the immediate environment



However, that list allows such as an entire forest to be "life" rather than just individual trees or the individual cells of trees.

Add criteria for describing what is a "lifeform"?


Further thoughts?

Keep searchin',
Martin


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Message 1143875 - Posted: 22 Aug 2011, 16:05:29 UTC
Last modified: 22 Aug 2011, 16:06:14 UTC

Hello.
Most biologists say that a Virus isn't a lifeform. Because a Virus don't have an own Metabolism (another criteria for life) and they need another cell to reproduce. Also they have only DNA OR RNA (for example retroviral viruses). All other lifeforms on earth have both DNA and RNA.

another criteria for life is evolution

Bakteria communicate via chemical signals. For example N-Acyl Homoserine Lactones (AHL), so they can measure the denistiy of the cell population.
Bacteria even can "communicate"/interact with high developed cells, like human cells- so they can outwit/trick the human immune system (sometimes)
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Message 1144105 - Posted: 22 Aug 2011, 23:21:43 UTC - in response to Message 1143875.  

what about fire. it replicates and spreads. it adapts to the fuel presented to it


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Message 1144423 - Posted: 24 Aug 2011, 3:54:01 UTC - in response to Message 1143321.  

Just trying to emphasize what common chracteristics nature might apply to the development of life in the cosmos. If there is out there inteligent life in the Milky Way, then that life might have common physical traits with humans. Eyes, legs for locomotions, would make sense for inteligent life being motioneless,etc.
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Message 1144511 - Posted: 24 Aug 2011, 9:47:29 UTC - in response to Message 1144423.  

Just trying to emphasize what common chracteristics nature might apply to the development of life in the cosmos. ...

For large mobile organisms, symmetry appears to be very important.

And then there seems to be a very small selection of "body plans" upon which all variants are based or have evolved from.

For some alternate ideas, James Cameron plausibly extended the body plan ideas a little in Avatar.


And whatever happened to the "Framsticks" experiment? What (artificial) creatures evolved from that?

Keep searchin',
Martin

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Message 1145276 - Posted: 26 Aug 2011, 5:22:39 UTC - in response to Message 1144511.  

Perhaps the process of evolution, natural selection, might be same in planets with conditions for life, as here on Earth.
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Message 1145326 - Posted: 26 Aug 2011, 9:55:28 UTC - in response to Message 1145276.  
Last modified: 26 Aug 2011, 9:55:53 UTC

Perhaps the process of evolution, natural selection, might be same in planets with conditions for life, as here on Earth.


It should be . That's why we need to sift thru Mars and see what happened there a long time ago.

As of now we have no evidence of life anywhere else. This has tremendous bearing on the future of scientific thought and religious doctrine (dogma?).
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Message 1145436 - Posted: 26 Aug 2011, 16:35:44 UTC - in response to Message 1145276.  

Perhaps the process of evolution, natural selection, might be same in planets with conditions for life, as here on Earth.


I think so too. Evolution is characteristic for life.
And the evolution on earth had shown us that nature often finds the same solution for the same problem. Wings had been invented by birds, insekts and mammals, independent from each other. --- Convergent evolution ---
If there is a planet with similar conditions like our home plantet., nature might invent the same morphologic structures there.
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Message 1146333 - Posted: 28 Aug 2011, 16:52:09 UTC - in response to Message 1145326.  

Not so sure about the feasability for life in Mars, if there was life in Mars, microbial life perhaps; recently has been suggested that Jupiter positioning stunted the growth of Mars, rendenring it steril. Jupiter acted as a destroyer of life in Mars but helped Earth for the development of life.

this is not related, whoever here is in the eastern seabord, hopefully all are okay due to hurricane Irene.
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Message 1147105 - Posted: 30 Aug 2011, 5:32:16 UTC

It is still not conclusive that no life exists on Mars. If there was life at some time in the past on Mars and it has now vanished I think it is the loss of it's magnetic field and not any influence from Jupiter that wiped out living things.

There is talk of life in Europa and it's a heck of a lot closer to Jupiter than Mars is.
Bob DeWoody

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Message 1147286 - Posted: 30 Aug 2011, 22:49:07 UTC - in response to Message 1147169.  

I think it's pretty much agreed that there has not been, or isn't now, any other life like us humans anywhere in the Solar System. Whether there was or is any microbial life remains to be seen.

I think you are right. But I haven't seen any posts in this thread claiming or speculating that intelligent life other than what claims to be here on earth is present anywhere else in this solar system. But it is the claim of most astro-biologists that even if Mars or Europa is found to support even pond scum then life must abound throughout the universe. Not that it will ever make any difference to us here on earth.
Bob DeWoody

My motto: Never do today what you can put off until tomorrow as it may not be required. This no longer applies in light of current events.
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Message 1147416 - Posted: 31 Aug 2011, 7:55:08 UTC - in response to Message 1147286.  

I believe that given conditions here on Earth or a warm water ocean, life will develop. If Mars had such conditions then we will find evidence of life or life itself on Mars. This will be decided if we ever get around to doing a proper job of exploration there.

All speculation of course. But I hope to at least see the answer for Mars before my time here has passed.
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Message 1147422 - Posted: 31 Aug 2011, 9:00:20 UTC - in response to Message 1147416.  

Mars Science Laboratory "Curiosity" should launch this fall and arrive at Mars in August 2012. So let's cross our fingers.
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Message 1147621 - Posted: 31 Aug 2011, 19:45:35 UTC - in response to Message 1147533.  

then life must abound throughout the universe.


But not as we know it Jim.


A phenomenal amount of money is being and has been spent on space exploration.
What an embarrassment if all we find in the future is just one planet that has life on it.......in the form of a "mushroom". No, there's got to be something thing out there, a planet with an atmosphere so protecting the planets surface from extreme radiation. With an atmosphere although poisonous to us and other life on Earth is able to support some form of organic growth, at least.
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Message 1147745 - Posted: 1 Sep 2011, 0:21:49 UTC - in response to Message 1147621.  

A phenomenal amount of money is being and has been spent on space exploration.
What an embarrassment if all we find in the future is just one planet that has life on it.......in the form of a "mushroom". ...

There would be no 'embarrassment' at all. Such a find would be startling!


In Science there is no 'right' or 'wrong' or any room for prejudice. There is only the observed Truth.

Keep searchin',
Martin

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Message 1147813 - Posted: 1 Sep 2011, 4:22:27 UTC - in response to Message 1142322.  

The one thing that life on Earth teaches: if there is liquid water, life will find a way.


Where ever water has existed on earth, life has always found a way. If bacteria can thrive is arsonic then it can live on Mars. Either NASA is looking in the wrong spots, or we are being told the wrong things while they discover life. There are rivers UNDER the Amazon river, nearly as big as the Amazon itself...OVER 6,500 FEET below the Amazon. So if water can flow freely, under the Amazon, and we already know life can exist in total darkness, then why not on Mars?

If you ask me, all these major discoveries regarding life lately, is going to lead up to an announcement by NASA that some form of life exists on Mars. Every time they say there is a huge Mars announcement, they have stopped short of saying they found life every time. I think it's just a matter of time before they actually announce it. And i don't mean aliens.

Jupiter's moon Europa and Saturn's Enceladus and maybe even Mars, are probably the best candidates for actual primitive life in our solar system. Be it jellyfish or fish or whatever. Titan is a good candidate too, but more on a bacterial level.
"By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God's command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible". Hebrews 11.3

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Message 1147847 - Posted: 1 Sep 2011, 8:04:31 UTC

Regarding how much money is being spent on the exploration of space. I read once that western women (Europe and North America) spend more money on make up and beauty supplies in one year than the entire NASA budget and that Revlon has about ten times the profits of all the aerospace companies combined.
Bob DeWoody

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Message 1147874 - Posted: 1 Sep 2011, 10:40:39 UTC - in response to Message 1147847.  
Last modified: 1 Sep 2011, 10:47:15 UTC

Doubt that Revlon exceeds even Boeing in revenue or earnings.

Boeing roughly 3.6 Billion per year and Revlon 1.3 Billion most recently.
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