GE 0% tax on multi billion profit


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Profile Orgil
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Message 1092157 - Posted: 1 Apr 2011, 5:07:19 UTC
Last modified: 1 Apr 2011, 5:56:40 UTC

My guess is all corporations escape tax but GE is revolutionizing the tax escape art?!

Plus the GE CEO is Obama's innovation chief consultant, so innovation of what?!

http://money.cnn.com/2010/04/16/news/companies/ge_7000_tax_returns/?iid=EAL

Since GE and many like corporations are involved with multi nations this case very likely must concern most Seti members from different nations. Plus it is very likely that the corporations from all G8 or G20 countries have very similar tax position as GE.
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Message 1092176 - Posted: 1 Apr 2011, 7:11:15 UTC - in response to Message 1092157.

The primary reason for tax laws is to raise revenue, but another valid reason is to further practices that are important to the country, like mortgage tax breaks, or charitable contributions. GE is able to pay no taxes because they got Congress to agree to breaks for programs that Congress agreed were beneficial to the country. It's the other side of the spending coin: that government can reduce a payer's tax bill as an incentive for companies and individuals to do what the legislature thinks should be done, but can be done better by the private sector (either industry or citizens or sometimes both).

Rarely do taxpayers (either individual or corporate) get tax breaks as large as their expenditures for the projects/activities that generate the tax break. For example, people get a deduction for mortgage interest, but it translates into a reduction of taxes that is only a fraction of what they pay in interest to the mortgage company or bank. (If you donate $100 to SETI@home you may reduce your taxes by $28 to $33, depending on your tax bracket). It's the same for GE, who are getting a tax break because they are spending money on some project that the government wants them to do, but their payout is usually much greater than the tax break, and the country gets another power plant or wind farm or some such project.

Don't blame GE for doing what Congress is encouraging them to do.

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Message 1092181 - Posted: 1 Apr 2011, 7:36:05 UTC - in response to Message 1092176.

Actually GE takes its biggest tax break because it headquarters out of the country.

All corporations deduct the cost of doing business (pretty much any legitimate expense.. unlike personal income) and are taxed based only on PROFIT.

My contention is that any money GE makes in the USA should be taxed before it leaves the borders. That would greatly increase the amount of capital to be re-invested within the USA. Enough of these shell games.
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Message 1092183 - Posted: 1 Apr 2011, 8:19:53 UTC - in response to Message 1092176.
Last modified: 1 Apr 2011, 8:59:25 UTC



....

Don't blame GE for doing what Congress is encouraging them to do.


Maybe you are right that corporations do serious mega orders from government periodically and for that they deserve to keep billions of dollars of tax for themselves. But in case of USA there are thousands of public school teachers being laid off for every few months and serious duty public workers being laid off in large numbers due to related reason everyone is aware. Plus GE is (or any other corp) kind of tech flagship corp according to mainstream marketing campaigns.

But typical google search finds out that like any other corporation GE was not clean from its financial books to technical performance reliability issues throughout its history.

http://www.businessweek.com/2000/00_50/b3711013.htm

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/business/s_637423.html

So as any typical G8 or G20 corporation GE seemingly constantly hurts its own public interest (maybe in a way that this kind of practice relates to fulfillment of country's political strategy interest that usually ignored in the media). Relating to this, corporations from emerging eastern countries are quickly adopting their belowed western mentor corporations examples every day.
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Message 1092365 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 1:58:18 UTC - in response to Message 1092181.

Actually GE takes its biggest tax break because it headquarters out of the country.

Really?!

So their headquarters isn't at:
General Electric Company
3135 Easton Turnpike
Fairfield, Connecticut 06828

Could have fooled Jeffrey R. Immelt, Chairman of the Board, General Electric Company

http://ir.10kwizard.com/download.php?format=PDF&ipage=7438579&source=329

You owe GE an apology.

Full disclosure, I am a shareholder of GE.
You can be happy to know the $0.56/share I get after GE's income tax is then taxed on my personal income taxes before I get to spend it in the USA. Don't you worry, it is getting well taxed in America.

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Message 1092372 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 2:31:59 UTC

• GE International headquarters, Brussels

They do not seem to like to publicize much. Source:
http://www.gepowercontrols.com/eu/resources/literature_library/product_brochures/downloads/We-are-GE-in-Europe.pdf
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Message 1092503 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 5:12:47 UTC - in response to Message 1092372.

Your post and this thread was originally about GE, not GE International. What's with the bait-and-switch?

Anyway, everything I said about US tax policy is correct: GE is doing nothing but taking advantage of legitimate tax laws, just as you do when you take a tax deduction. A big company like that would attract a lot of attention from federal prosecutors if they were doing something illegal.

You know, if you donated enough to charities, had a large enough mortgage deduction, and took advantage of certain tax incentives you might not pay any taxes either. I just read about a couple that is getting a $54K tax credit due to their adoption of five children.

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Message 1092580 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 11:15:55 UTC
Last modified: 2 Apr 2011, 11:40:39 UTC

What usual common sense understand is either GE or of those usual corporations are pretty much legalized mafias that loot billions of local tax duty money and through international sophisticated money laundry process locate their loots all over the world plus Swiss mass looted money storage "banks" namely UBS and etc...

Well in Japan that is called Yakuza but in other G7 countries that is called Corporation.

There is another interesting finding might be like:

Corporation + Money = Swiss bank

but:

Swiss bank + Money = laying off teachers and/or bad test scores for children

The latest proof is the Gadhafi Corporation is in some trouble and allegedly some $33 billion froze all over the world in the past 10 days.
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Message 1092586 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 11:31:00 UTC - in response to Message 1092503.

Um.. NYSE=GE. What bait and switch?

I never claimed GE was violating existing laws. Just that it is doing wrong.

GE is far from alone in this. Fix the tax laws, reduce additional spending moderately and the US economy gets back on track.
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Message 1092642 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 14:54:08 UTC - in response to Message 1092372.
Last modified: 2 Apr 2011, 15:08:26 UTC

• GE International headquarters, Brussels

They do not seem to like to publicize much. Source:
http://www.gepowercontrols.com/eu/resources/literature_library/product_brochures/downloads/We-are-GE-in-Europe.pdf

http://ir.10kwizard.com/download.php?format=PDF&ipage=7438579&source=329
Page 20, Item 2
Item 2. Properties
Manufacturing operations are carried out at approximately 219 manufacturing plants located in 38 states in the United States and Puerto Rico and
at approximately 230 manufacturing plants located in 40 other countries.

You managed to confuse a subsidiary with the owner.
[edit]
Pop yourself down to Exhibit 21 starting on page 248 where you will see they are a 100% owned subsidiary.
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Message 1092711 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 17:38:14 UTC - in response to Message 1092586.
Last modified: 2 Apr 2011, 18:09:16 UTC

Oh, soft-one, my "bait-and-switch" remark was just tweaking your nose a little.

I didn't imply GE was doing anything illegal either, I am saying GE does what Congress (through the tax code) encourages it to do. So are you interested in getting rid of the homeowner's mortgage deduction too? That one doesn't encourage building wind farms, it just helps people, who might not otherwise be able to afford it, buy a house. Doesn't that scenario sound familiar?

Furthermore, tax deductions are only a portion of what the company or individual spent on the thing that got them the deduction, and the more people or companies spend (on things that are supposed to be good for the country), the faster the economy grows, so are you in favor of slowing the recovery? What you are suggesting has wider implications than you seem to be taking into consideration.

[Edit]: I like your comment about reducing spending moderately--$61 billion for this fiscal year (~1.8% of budget) seems moderate to me. But then what spending is cut becomes a difficult question.

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Message 1092725 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 18:24:59 UTC - in response to Message 1092711.
Last modified: 2 Apr 2011, 18:25:12 UTC

This is easy to fix. If we just tax the rich, we can solve our budget problems. Here's how:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=661pi6K-8WQ

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Message 1092730 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 18:40:19 UTC - in response to Message 1092711.

I support the homeowner deduction(on a first and primary home) UNDER THE CURRENT TAX STRUCTURE. There are (obviously) many other deductions and credits that can be addressed first.

I am still at a loss to how these poor corporations are "overtaxed" while paying 0%.

Paying taxes in the country they are earning the money seems fair.

Furthermore, income tax should tax a companies income. Not what they did not manage to spend.


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Message 1092735 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 19:03:34 UTC - in response to Message 1092503.

Your post and this thread was originally about GE, not GE International. What's with the bait-and-switch?

Anyway, everything I said about US tax policy is correct: GE is doing nothing but taking advantage of legitimate tax laws, just as you do when you take a tax deduction. A big company like that would attract a lot of attention from federal prosecutors if they were doing something illegal.

You know, if you donated enough to charities, had a large enough mortgage deduction, and took advantage of certain tax incentives you might not pay any taxes either. I just read about a couple that is getting a $54K tax credit due to their adoption of five children.

I'd say that a couple who adopt 5 special needs children is deserving of a tax break. They are doing an immense service to society and we should help them anyway we can.

GEs tax refund was rather larger, and I don't think it made as dramatic a difference to the lives of those who received it. Just piling more tax payers money on people who don't need it.
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Message 1092751 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 19:52:58 UTC - in response to Message 1092735.

GEs tax refund was rather larger, and I don't think it made as dramatic a difference to the lives of those who received it. Just piling more tax payers money on people who don't need it.

Who received it? The employees they hired with it? The people who bought a home with a mortgage financed by it? The lower cost of the green energy wind turbines they made? The R&D people who lowered the carbon emissions of their jet engines? Just who received it?

As to how much tax, did you read the amount in tax they did pay? Did you see it was north of $1 Billion dollars?


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Message 1092763 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 20:41:44 UTC - in response to Message 1092735.

I'd say that a couple who adopt 5 special needs children is deserving of a tax break. They are doing an immense service to society and we should help them anyway we can.

GEs tax refund was rather larger, and I don't think it made as dramatic a difference to the lives of those who received it. Just piling more tax payers money on people who don't need it.

I agree the tax break to the couple that adopted five kids was a good thing; but you cite nothing that GE did for their tax breaks that was evil, or not even such a good idea. Nor do you acknowledge that to get those "breaks" GE had to invest in some "thing" to get the break, and they would have spent more to get the break than the deduction which resulted from it, thus boosting the economy.

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Message 1092764 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 20:46:07 UTC - in response to Message 1092763.

I would consider lobbying to get those tax breaks qualfies as "evil".

I would say if you are paying nothing yet receiving great benefits from a country, that too is "evil".


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Message 1092766 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 20:51:18 UTC - in response to Message 1092730.
Last modified: 2 Apr 2011, 20:55:17 UTC

I support the homeowner deduction(on a first and primary home) UNDER THE CURRENT TAX STRUCTURE. There are (obviously) many other deductions and credits that can be addressed first.

I am still at a loss to how these poor corporations are "overtaxed" while paying 0%.

Paying taxes in the country they are earning the money seems fair.

Furthermore, income tax should tax a companies income. Not what they did not manage to spend.



So, since corporate tax rates are lower in most of the developed OECD countries vice the United States, maybe GE should just sell their windmills and other products to every other country and not to the U.S.? Not to mention, our currency is being devalued by the day which makes it less attractive on sales vice currencies of other developed countries. What is the incentive for GE to do any business here given they're a multinational company? Maybe Boeing will take a cue and move offshore where it can produce jetliners at a lower cost with GE jet engines produced overseas too. Then we can have another couple hundred thousand people on unemployment. Now that's progress!

But, where will we get our windmills for wind energy from then?

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Message 1092772 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 21:39:35 UTC - in response to Message 1092764.

I would consider lobbying to get those tax breaks qualfies as "evil".


Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.


Whatever you say.

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Message 1092774 - Posted: 2 Apr 2011, 21:48:39 UTC - in response to Message 1092766.

Keith, we still have people here to buy things. As long as that exists there will be people to sell things. If profits that are made here get taxed here, I am fairly certain they will continue to make profits here. If not, we can move forward without them. The Walmart argument of "give us big breaks or we will not build our store in your town" is dead. So is the rest of the "I am going to take my ball and go home" mentality. Please do.
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