Status / Credit (Nov 03 2010)

Message boards : Technical News : Status / Credit (Nov 03 2010)

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Author	Message
Matt Lebofsky Volunteer moderator Project administrator Project developer Project scientist Send message Joined: 1 Mar 99 Posts: 1383 Credit: 74,079 RAC: 0	Message 1045846 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 18:39:10 UTC
	Quick update during our mega-outage. All the bureaucracy is behind us - new servers have been ordered days ago, just waiting on those to arrive and doing major database cleanup/etc. in the meantime. To that end, among other things we've been trying to drain all the outstanding workunits/results as much as possible, but in a sane, orderly fashion. I just turned on the file delete/database purge processes, but only after granting all pertinent credit to users/hosts/teams (regardless of overdue/wingman status). I'm talking about 3,290,000 results were credited over the past 24 hours. I may have to do this granting again once this first round of cleanup is over. - Matt ____________ -- BOINC/SETI@home network/web/science/development person -- "Any idiot can have a good idea. What is hard is to do it." - Jeanne-Claude
	ID: 1045846 ·

soft^spirit Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 6374 Credit: 28,213,105 RAC: 92	Message 1045847 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 18:50:46 UTC - in response to Message 1045846.
	Not worried about credits Matt. Just do what is best to make things nice and clean. You can trickle out 2nd/3rd/4th+ issues if you want, still ready to pick them up. But most important: take good care of the project. ____________ Janice
	ID: 1045847 ·

B-Man Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 11 Feb 01 Posts: 253 Credit: 147,366 RAC: 0	Message 1045849 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 18:57:54 UTC
	If you could do the beta project soon It would be nice. 2/3 of my beta WU have now expired and I will have all expired in about 24hours. Crunching is all done but I don't want BOINC to delete them because all are expired. ____________
	ID: 1045849 ·

Claggy Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 5 Jul 99 Posts: 3906 Credit: 31,263,566 RAC: 16,334	Message 1045852 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 19:02:59 UTC - in response to Message 1045846. Last modified: 3 Nov 2010, 19:08:12 UTC
	Thanks for the update Matt, I'd also like to be able to upload and report my Beta Wu's, all which have expired now. and can you embed Beta's scheduler url in Beta's 'Down for Maintenance page' as Boinc looses the url when Beta is offline, Claggy
	ID: 1045852 ·

X-Files 27 Send message Joined: 17 May 99 Posts: 100 Credit: 107,862,964 RAC: 0	Message 1045855 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 19:12:37 UTC - in response to Message 1045846.
	To that end, among other things we've been trying to drain all the outstanding workunits/results as much as possible, but in a sane, orderly fashion. To help out in draining, maybe its a good idea to open downloads but only to fast host - meaning can return in 1 day (deadline of 1 day). This way we can have a fresh start when new server arrive. ____________
	ID: 1045855 ·

Claggy Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 5 Jul 99 Posts: 3906 Credit: 31,263,566 RAC: 16,334	Message 1045886 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 22:24:26 UTC - in response to Message 1045846.
	Thanks for Bringing the Beta site and the scheduler online, But it really is pointless if Uploads don't work, which haven't worked for about 7 weeks now, 03/11/2010 22:21:19 SETI@home Beta Test Started upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.100_1_0 03/11/2010 22:21:19 SETI@home Beta Test Started upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.115_0_0 03/11/2010 22:21:22 SETI@home Beta Test Temporarily failed upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.100_1_0: HTTP error 03/11/2010 22:21:22 SETI@home Beta Test Backing off 1 hr 59 min 16 sec on upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.100_1_0 03/11/2010 22:21:22 SETI@home Beta Test Temporarily failed upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.115_0_0: HTTP error 03/11/2010 22:21:22 SETI@home Beta Test Backing off 2 hr 22 min 50 sec on upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.115_0_0 03/11/2010 22:21:22 SETI@home Beta Test Started upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.116_0_0 03/11/2010 22:21:22 SETI@home Beta Test Started upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.117_0_0 03/11/2010 22:21:23 SETI@home Beta Test Temporarily failed upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.116_0_0: HTTP error 03/11/2010 22:21:23 SETI@home Beta Test Backing off 3 hr 50 min 14 sec on upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.116_0_0 03/11/2010 22:21:24 SETI@home Beta Test Temporarily failed upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.117_0_0: HTTP error 03/11/2010 22:21:24 SETI@home Beta Test Backing off 3 hr 7 min 51 sec on upload of 18no09aj.30208.25021.3.13.117_0_0 Claggy
	ID: 1045886 ·

Claggy Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 5 Jul 99 Posts: 3906 Credit: 31,263,566 RAC: 16,334	Message 1045904 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 23:34:47 UTC
	Thanks, All my Beta uploads have gone through and reported, Claggy
	ID: 1045904 ·

Matt Lebofsky Volunteer moderator Project administrator Project developer Project scientist Send message Joined: 1 Mar 99 Posts: 1383 Credit: 74,079 RAC: 0	Message 1045908 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 23:40:00 UTC - in response to Message 1045904.
	Thanks, All my Beta uploads have gone through and reported, Thanks for reminding us (this is something that's been constantly falling off the radar lately, obviously)... - Matt ____________ -- BOINC/SETI@home network/web/science/development person -- "Any idiot can have a good idea. What is hard is to do it." - Jeanne-Claude
	ID: 1045908 ·

Claggy Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 5 Jul 99 Posts: 3906 Credit: 31,263,566 RAC: 16,334	Message 1045909 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 23:46:26 UTC - in response to Message 1045908.
	No Problem, i have been trying to bring this to attention for weeks now, here, at Seti Beta, and on the boinc_alpha mailing list, but the right people didn't see the messages, Claggy
	ID: 1045909 ·

platium Send message Joined: 5 Jul 10 Posts: 212 Credit: 262,426 RAC: 0	Message 1045912 - Posted: 3 Nov 2010, 23:52:35 UTC
	my pc's is on all the time it can do wu's in a day so clearing any would be ok for me credits don't matter but a good start would be nice i have it set for no extra days work and will leave it like that to minimize load on start up
	ID: 1045912 ·

B-Man Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 11 Feb 01 Posts: 253 Credit: 147,366 RAC: 0	Message 1045916 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 0:45:18 UTC
	Thanks for Turing SETI BETA on. My uploads just went and are now done. I have both Main and Beta left requesting work but have it set to 0.1 day cache. Any reissues if you decide to turn it on will be turned around quick. Best of luck to the staff whatever happens Bernd ____________
	ID: 1045916 ·

Josef W. Segur Volunteer developer Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 30 Oct 99 Posts: 4111 Credit: 993,795 RAC: 235	Message 1045930 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 2:23:51 UTC
	Does it make people feel good to get credit for work which probably now has no chance of contributing to the science? Has the project underestimated the quality of the participants? To my mind, getting credit without a corresponding increase in consecutive valid is much like having a rotten tomato thrown at me versus having a fresh vine ripened tomato handed to me. It was probably inevitable that the project would need to cancel some work to make the transition to the new servers cleaner, but my vote if we had been asked would have favored no credit for unresolved work. I bring this up to get others' opinions, in the hope that "I may have to do this granting again once this first round of cleanup is over." will be handled differently. Joe
	ID: 1045930 ·

Gary Charpentier Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 11732 Credit: 5,969,877 RAC: 0	Message 1045935 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 3:01:30 UTC - in response to Message 1045904. Last modified: 4 Nov 2010, 3:19:45 UTC
	Thanks, All my Beta uploads have gone through and reported, Claggy Ditto. Thanks. [edit]I'm also one who had (past tense) the http errors too, so that is fixed. ____________
	ID: 1045935 ·

Gary Charpentier Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 25 Dec 00 Posts: 11732 Credit: 5,969,877 RAC: 0	Message 1045937 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 3:18:54 UTC - in response to Message 1045930.
	Does it make people feel good to get credit for work which probably now has no chance of contributing to the science? Has the project underestimated the quality of the participants? To my mind, getting credit without a corresponding increase in consecutive valid is much like having a rotten tomato thrown at me versus having a fresh vine ripened tomato handed to me. It was probably inevitable that the project would need to cancel some work to make the transition to the new servers cleaner, but my vote if we had been asked would have favored no credit for unresolved work. I bring this up to get others' opinions, in the hope that "I may have to do this granting again once this first round of cleanup is over." will be handled differently. Joe Not sure how else it can be done. If the Database to do the checks against isn't there ... what do you propose, grant no one credit? The science isn't lost. I'm sure the work units aren't going to evaporate. The issue is that the database got corrupted to the point that keeping track of who had what fell apart for granting credit. Especially considering the ghost issue where there may never have been a wingman, in other words it lost track of who had work units.[1] Is waiting four or five months to get credit correct? I'm sure they know which work is questionable and it will be re-issued after things are back up so no science gets lost. In any case it isn't that many cobblestones in the big picture. [1] Actually it thought it sent work to the computer, but the computer never got it for whatever reason. Has to time out which could be a couple months. Then get re-issued. Then wait for crunch. Then check if they match. If they don't match, send it out again. Having that happen can eat up half a year and then add in a month's down time. Not a big issue for those that look at total credit, but it makes those that look at RAC go crazy. ____________
	ID: 1045937 ·

Uli Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 6 Feb 00 Posts: 9313 Credit: 4,805,942 RAC: 3,012	Message 1045938 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 3:24:41 UTC
	Sniff... My BetaWus have reported as well. ____________ Pluto will always be a planet to me. Cash Donation Specialist
	ID: 1045938 ·

Gatekeeper Send message Joined: 14 Jul 04 Posts: 887 Credit: 176,240,267 RAC: 6,452	Message 1045946 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 4:22:26 UTC - in response to Message 1045930.
	Does it make people feel good to get credit for work which probably now has no chance of contributing to the science? Has the project underestimated the quality of the participants? To my mind, getting credit without a corresponding increase in consecutive valid is much like having a rotten tomato thrown at me versus having a fresh vine ripened tomato handed to me. It was probably inevitable that the project would need to cancel some work to make the transition to the new servers cleaner, but my vote if we had been asked would have favored no credit for unresolved work. I bring this up to get others' opinions, in the hope that "I may have to do this granting again once this first round of cleanup is over." will be handled differently. Joe Joe, I'd really like to see this question moved to NC where I'm sure it'd be an interesting thread in its own right. Perhaps a mod could assist? Personally, while a case could be made for not crediting unverified work, I would hate to see the (in many cases) thousands of hours of work that I, and other crunchers, have given to this project get completely wiped out. There's more to it, of course, but I'll save it for another response in a better place.
	ID: 1045946 ·

soft^spirit Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 6374 Credit: 28,213,105 RAC: 92	Message 1045950 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 4:55:12 UTC - in response to Message 1045930.
	Joe, I am presuming it is being done for their own ease. As far as the RAC credit.. don't care, don't care, and oh yeah don't care. If it does not make their job easier, I am quite happy with no credit at the moment too. But... I will take a side order of "whatever" with it. ____________ Janice
	ID: 1045950 ·

WinterKnight Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 18 May 99 Posts: 8128 Credit: 21,302,174 RAC: 11,403	Message 1045958 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 5:59:24 UTC
	Matt, What should we do with tasks that are still in the process of downloading?
	ID: 1045958 ·

James Sotherden Send message Joined: 16 May 99 Posts: 7589 Credit: 25,341,743 RAC: 37,448	Message 1046005 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 15:50:54 UTC Last modified: 4 Nov 2010, 15:51:40 UTC
	Im with soft^spirit on this. They could have done whatever they wanted with the credit. BUT maybe the guys just wanted to say a silent Thank You to all the fine people who have stuck by them through these down times and all the great folks who made it possible to get two new servers. PS I do expect pics of the new servers though:) ____________
	ID: 1046005 ·

Chris S Volunteer tester Send message Joined: 19 Nov 00 Posts: 28934 Credit: 7,793,964 RAC: 14,687	Message 1046017 - Posted: 4 Nov 2010, 16:54:51 UTC
	PS I do expect pics of the new servers though:) What? I'm gonna insist upon it! :-)) ____________ Damsel Rescuer, Kitty Patron, Uli Fan, Julie Supporter, CAMRA ES99 Admirer, Raccoon Friend, IFAW, PETA, 5% Badge
	ID: 1046017 ·

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Message boards : Technical News : Status / Credit (Nov 03 2010)