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Profile Eric Rojas Chiong
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Message 1029098 - Posted: 28 Aug 2010, 1:48:01 UTC

Hello,

Does anybody know when NASA etc. is going to Europa and collect samples (Biological microorganism/microbes)? Notwithstanding the mission next year with a 5 year trip to Jupiter. That would be awesome like finding H20 on Mars. Also, Microbes plus 2 - 3 Billion years of Charles Darwin Theory of Evolution equals near HomoSapiens right, I believe is the reason why we are looking at this range of the Electromagnetic Spectrum, "The H20" Hole.

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Message 1029480 - Posted: 29 Aug 2010, 18:01:56 UTC - in response to Message 1029098.
Last modified: 29 Aug 2010, 18:16:23 UTC

If you mean a sample return mission I do not believe they are doing one,if you mean a sample collection and examination on site and then report ala Mars my probable Guess is 15/20 years takes a long time to get these things funded and then built also the launch window has to be just right for such a dedicated project.And it aint gonna be cheap!Just checked here http://www.jpl.nasa.gov/missions/index.cfm?type=Future and no sample missions are planned.
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Profile Eric Rojas Chiong
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Message 1029953 - Posted: 31 Aug 2010, 13:53:17 UTC - in response to Message 1029480.
Last modified: 31 Aug 2010, 14:09:11 UTC

I understand the financing issue but the launch window might disappear with the new ion engines-but then again thats also a financing issue. By the way, I am more interested in Europa than Mars. Watching Stephen Hawkings video about it makes sense-about having underground oceans due to thermal imaging technology as well as the gravitational forces between Jupiter and Europa. I mean, as a surfer (surf waves in the ocean), one of the best time to surf when there is no swell (caused by earthquakes or winds) is when the moon (Earth moon) is full - due to gravitational forces - Tidal forces between Earth and the Moon. Every surfer on this planet (Earth) knows that.

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Message 1034747 - Posted: 20 Sep 2010, 4:36:22 UTC - in response to Message 1029480.

Yes, I understand its not gonna be cheap. As far as the Launch window, well from what I understand, the new Ion engines is going to replace the "slingshot gravitational effect" method of traveling through space. I think they're really are building a Star Trek "Enterprise" type space craft which means launch windows would not be a factor anymore. As far as discovering what ever kind of species up on Europa, well, that news is going to be even bigger than Galileo telescope and how it change how we as humans look at the Universe. Earth is not at the center of the Universe. If they discover life (including microorganism) on those moons, most of all the stories of Alien (E.T./Ancient Astronauts etc) abductions is not only possible, but just became a reality. On this planet it took 2 to 3 billion years of evolution to where we are today.

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Message 1036745 - Posted: 28 Sep 2010, 23:36:31 UTC

erc1surf,
I agree with you. Forget Mars, we have sent loads of rover's and stuff to Mars. We badly need to get down into the possible liquid water ocean's that might exist on Europa or Enceladus.

I just find it difficult to imagine large bodies of liquid water on Europa or Enceladus that are complete sterile with zero life living in the water. If there is liquid water on Europa or Enceladus, i bet its full of life swimming around!

John.
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Message 1038250 - Posted: 2 Oct 2010, 10:56:41 UTC
Last modified: 2 Oct 2010, 11:18:34 UTC

Are these moons heated from the core by internal atomic reactions like our Earth. If not, the liquid may be frozen all the way down.. Do we know that the surface of Europa is frozen water ? It may be methane or carbon dioxide. Anybody know ?

The tidal forces from the massive planet may be enough to crack the ice even if it is many miles thick or solid all the way down to the core.

Since life abounds in the Arctic/Antarctic oceans at near freezing temperatures, I agree with Johnnie that if there is water it would very likely have life. Without sunlight though to power plankton, there would probably need to be hot fissures in their sea floor to provide the energy to start a food chain.

Profile Eric Rojas Chiong
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Message 1041332 - Posted: 11 Oct 2010, 22:45:24 UTC - in response to Message 1038250.

Yes, You and Johnny are probably correct. I watched a video about the ocean underneath the ice on Europa from Stephen Hawkings. They used thermal imaging to see the variances of heat within the underground ocean during a given cycle. There definitely is water (H20) underneath the ice on Europa. The surface of Europa is made out of frozen H20 not methane like Titan based on the frequencies from the Keck Observatory. Even the Griffith Park Observatory in Los Angeles kind of hint there's water underneath the ice. As far as living things, I think discovering microorganism is enough evidence to make ExtraTerrestrials or Ancient Astronauts very real and not Sci-Fi. The theory from NASA is microorganism plus (Charles Darwin-Origin of Species) 2 - 3 Billion years of evolution equates to intelligent life - like Homo Sapiens (Biologically). Here's the problem, if NASA, ESA, the Chinese, Russia etc. confirms and validates microorganism on Europa and others, there would be a social chaos specially within the Christian community just like the period when Charles Darwin published the book of "Origin of Species" during the 1800's. Either way, I still think there is life out there, getting to them is another story though.

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Message 1041334 - Posted: 11 Oct 2010, 22:47:58 UTC - in response to Message 1036745.

By the way, as far as life on Europa, I believe they are going to be in a form of bioilluminescence. They glow in the dark, maybe. Kind of like in the movie Abyss in the 90's. That means no ice fishing on Europa and others.

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Message 1041336 - Posted: 11 Oct 2010, 22:51:48 UTC - in response to Message 1041332.

Yes, You and Johnny are probably correct. I watched a video about the ocean underneath the ice on Europa from Stephen Hawkings. They used thermal imaging to see the variances of heat within the underground ocean during a given cycle. There definitely is water (H20) underneath the ice on Europa. The surface of Europa is made out of frozen H20 not methane like Titan based on the frequencies from the Keck Observatory. Even the Griffith Park Observatory in Los Angeles kind of hint there's water underneath the ice. As far as living things, I think discovering microorganism is enough evidence to make ExtraTerrestrials or Ancient Astronauts very real and not Sci-Fi. The theory from NASA is microorganism plus (Charles Darwin-Origin of Species) 2 - 3 Billion years of evolution equates to intelligent life - like Homo Sapiens (Biologically). Here's the problem, if NASA, ESA, the Chinese, Russia etc. confirms and validates microorganism on Europa and others, there would be a social chaos specially within the Christian community just like the period when Charles Darwin published the book of "Origin of Species" during the 1800's. Either way, I still think there is life out there, getting to them is another story though.


Very interesting. I am not sure that 2 or 3 billion years would constitute intelligent life though. If that asteroid hadn't hit the Yucatan 65 million years ago, we wouldn't be here. There is a lot of pure chance that goes along with the correct conditions.

Steve
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Message 1041947 - Posted: 14 Oct 2010, 2:58:04 UTC - in response to Message 1041336.

Hi,

True, if it wasn't for the asteriod (Chicxulub Crater, Mexico) hitting the earth 65 million years ago, the dinosaurs would still be here today and probably would still dominate the earth. However, early mammals have already begun there development (evolution) during the Jurrasic period as well before the asteriod arrived in Mexico based on fossil findings (Wikipedia). As far as the "rate of evolution" of mammals, inc humans, some scientist might even say we probably would have evolved much faster considering that we can build tools to protect us from the dangers of the dinosaurs. For example, we could have built barriers and or even a "looking glass" (Telescope) to spot the T-Rex coming instead of looking at planets like Galileo did. The competition for scarce resource would have increase the rate of evolution for mammals, inc. humans. Instead of 2 - 3 billion years, it would have probably be only 1 - 2 billion years with competition of scarce resource from dinosaurs. Unfortunately, though human history is human history. By the way, Galileo didn't invent the telescope. Galileo just knew how to use it.

Eric

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Message 1041952 - Posted: 14 Oct 2010, 3:19:07 UTC - in response to Message 1041336.

Hi again,

One of the best movie like "Close Encounters of the 3rd Kind" Steven Spielberg(30 years ago), is "Contact" with Jodie Foster (1997). I am currently watching re-runs of "Contact" right now. The other good movie is "Mission to Mars" (2000), especially in the end of the movie where the Ancient Astronaut (E.T.) shows the development of life (evolution) on this planet. There is a bug though, I believe it was the microorganism that came from comets and asteriods that spurred life and not a space ship from Ancient Astronauts.

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Message 1046416 - Posted: 6 Nov 2010, 3:18:29 UTC

This seems like a great idea for NASA to launch. But it would be far too expensive. Also, keep in mind, if some other intellegent life form is on any planet, we might not be able to find it because they do not have/need oxygyn, or anything that humans, and earth creatures need.

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Message 1055635 - Posted: 13 Dec 2010, 14:45:59 UTC - in response to Message 1041952.

If you liked the movie "Contact" do yourself a favour and read the book!
It was written by Carl Sagan and as far as I know it was his only fictional piece.
Dr. Sagan was uniquely qualified to write this and through the use of characters
is able to put a face on the debate pro and con and other related issues.
It was very well written, covers a lot of concepts in very easy terms and provokes thought and discussion. The movie although entertaining does not do it justice at all.

Profile Eric Rojas Chiong
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Message 1057702 - Posted: 19 Dec 2010, 4:40:51 UTC - in response to Message 1055635.

I was refering to the Mission to Mars movie.

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