Personally, I thought that was hilarious.

Andy has the right to free speech. He can yell anything he wants at his basement wall, or take out a full page ad in the New York Times, and anything in between. He can even push the limits a little bit at events like Kerry's. But as soon as he gets out of hand, enough to raise the ire of security, he's done for.

Having worked with Military Police and been responsible for the safety of others, no security officer, police officer, SP, MP, et cetera would in their right mind would allow him to keep going. Mostly because they're human and it isn't worth their career and possibly their freedom if Andy happens to be the nutjob that gets through and harms the person you are charged with protecting.

Given that for the most part, both UK and the US do not allow you to resist arrest, cranks like Andy just open the door for the cops to tase the crap out of them. Why? Because no one can predict their next move, and it is part of police responsibility to subdue their arrestees.

Oh, but hey, you guys should be thrilled. Why? Because this is an example of the gov't force you are always insisting be initiated upon others. Stop paying your taxes and it's just a matter of time before they come for you.

---

Cordially,
Rush

elrushbo2@theobviousgmail.com
Remove the obvious...

"DON'T TAZER ME, BRO!!" --- :-P

---

Founder of BOINC team Objectivists. Oh the humanity! Rational people crunching data!
I did NOT authorize this belly writing!

I saw the video and have an opinion that the guy messed up.

He may have had a point, though I wasn't listening to the audio carefully, but tried too hard and is now trying to make himself a martyr.

Although the venue didn't look all that important, he could have done much better waiting his turn and not yelling. He'll get resisting as well, IMHO.

Gotta work within the construct peacefully or play the fool and wear the black hat. Public opinion is everything. Presentations must cater to this social fact.


Thank you for posting and sharing your thoughts.

Respectfully,

Ѫ ʎɐɹƃɹɯ ϡ


.

Ѫ ʎɐɹƃɹɯ ϡ, (Ed. query: how do you pronounce your handle, by the way)?

There's no address in your note, but I presume you're addressing me. There is nothing (yet) in the law which rescinds the right of the citizen to free speech, and gives police the right to assault. With all due respect, you are mistaken. The fact of the use of the Taser for enforcement of the law, in itself proves the State has run afoul of the Constitution's guarantees of freedom of speech and assembly, and freedom from unreasonable search and seizure (in the case of Andrew Meyer, of his person). Farewell First and Fourth Amendments: You were the prime guarantors and setters of the
standard for civil rights.

It took a Civil War to force through civil rights for all Americans. It will take a second civil war to undo the Fascist usurpation of State power, of which the treatment of Andrew Meyer is but a symptom.

Samizdat

Personally, I thought that was hilarious.

Andy has the right to free speech. He can yell anything he wants at his basement wall, or take out a full page ad in the New York Times, and anything in between. He can even push the limits a little bit at events like Kerry's. But as soon as he gets out of hand, enough to raise the ire of security, he's done for.

Having worked with MPs and been responsible for the safety of others, no security officer, police officer, SP, MP, et cetera would in their right mind would allow him to keep going. Mostly because they're human and it isn't worth their career and possibly their freedom if Andy happens to be the nutjob that gets through and harms the person you are charged with protecting.

Given that for the most part, both UK and the US do not allow you to resist arrest, cranks like Andy just open the door for the cops to tase the crap out of them. Why? Because no one can predict their next move, and it is part of police responsibility to subdue their arrestees.

Oh, but hey, you guys should be thrilled. Why? Because this is an example of the gov't force you are always insisting be initiated upon others. Stop paying your taxes and it's just a matter of time before they come for you.

Exactly!

---

https://youtu.be/iY57ErBkFFE

#Texit

Don't blame me, I voted for Johnson(L) in 2016.

Truth is dangerous... especially when it challenges those in power.

Personally, I thought that was hilarious.

Andy has the right to free speech. He can yell anything he wants at his basement wall, or take out a full page ad in the New York Times, and anything in between. He can even push the limits a little bit at events like Kerry's. But as soon as he gets out of hand, enough to raise the ire of security, he's done for.

Having worked with Military Police and been responsible for the safety of others, no security officer, police officer, SP, MP, et cetera would in their right mind would allow him to keep going. Mostly because they're human and it isn't worth their career and possibly their freedom if Andy happens to be the nutjob that gets through and harms the person you are charged with protecting.

Given that for the most part, both UK and the US do not allow you to resist arrest, cranks like Andy just open the door for the cops to tase the crap out of them. Why? Because no one can predict their next move, and it is part of police responsibility to subdue their arrestees.

Oh, but hey, you guys should be thrilled. Why? Because this is an example of the gov't force you are always insisting be initiated upon others. Stop paying your taxes and it's just a matter of time before they come for you.

The police don't arrest people here for trying to ask questions of politicians. They shouldn't have tried to arrest him in the first place.

..and I disagree totally with MajorKong's assessment of the situation. He had his hand up to show he was not fighting. That was quite clear...and his girl friend wasn't the only one expressing horror at the situation.

---

Reality Internet Personality

The police don't arrest people here for trying to ask questions of politicians. They shouldn't have tried to arrest him in the first place.

I've seen video firsthand at Bishopsgate that begs to differ. And I've seen police here act far more aggressively than those cops did when they felt there was a threat. Big deal.

As far as what they should have decided and when, since they were responsible for Kerry's safety, that was their decision and their decision alone. That you might have decided differently were you responsible for his life is of no relevance.

..and I disagree totally with MajorKong's assessment of the situation. He had his hand up to show he was not fighting. That was quite clear...and his girl friend wasn't the only one expressing horror at the situation.

It doesn't matter. The law is clear and most countries are unequivocal about it. You do not have the right to resist arrest and the police do have the right, in fact the legal duty, to use physical force to subdue those that they arrest.

If Andy feels he was wrongly arrested and subjected to excessive force, a judge will make that decision. The only "right" he had at that point was to go limp.

Isn't gov't force grand?

---

Cordially,
Rush

elrushbo2@theobviousgmail.com
Remove the obvious...

The police don't arrest people here for trying to ask questions of politicians. They shouldn't have tried to arrest him in the first place.

He wasn't arrested for trying to ask questions. Plenty of students that day asked plenty of questions. I think claiming that this was the cause of his arrest obfuscates the facts of his own culpability.

..and I disagree totally with MajorKong's assessment of the situation. He had his hand up to show he was not fighting. That was quite clear...and his girl friend wasn't the only one expressing horror at the situation.

@ Simon Wiesenthal, from your initial posting at the top of this thread:

Given the generally low level of sociopolitical consciousness round these SAH parts, it's not surprising to me that no thread, till now, has mentioned University of Florida at Gainesville police' Tasering student

I take it to mean that since others didn't share your enthusiasm over this issue that warrants them being considered as people with 'low levels of sociopolitical consiciousness' ?

FYI, although no thread was made specifically over this attention seeking clowns antics it was talked about in the SETI Cafe 2 or 3 days ago. Try the 'Myths, Legends, Conspiracies' thread.

I still get a chuckle out of this clod's, "DON'T TAZER ME, BRO!!" line though.

And if 2 or 300 other students had behaved as him and not like civilized questioners what kind of forums would we have nationwide then? Perhaps these forums would just turn out to be YouTube video comedies but you seem to regard this immature professional stuntster as a martyr so that might suit your interests.

---

Founder of BOINC team Objectivists. Oh the humanity! Rational people crunching data!
I did NOT authorize this belly writing!

You have a very rose coloured view of the 60s my friend.

So you have heard the term 'flower child' before... ;)

---

It may not be 1984 but George Orwell sure did see the future . . .

Actually Rush, your namesake thinks the guy was a lunatic and got what he deserved.

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Actually Rush, your namesake thinks the guy was a lunatic and got what he deserved.

Pah!
Of course: Andrew Meyer deserved to be tasered and jumped upon by these half a dozen of cops -- just like everyone else who has a different opinion than the mainstream and dares to express it deserves to be muzzled, threatened, beaten up, tasered, arrested, even shot down! - Not!
Such a treatment shows how tyrannic that system has become.

In my opinion there are way to few "Andrew Meyer"s in the schools, universities, on public meetings in general!

Do you remember "Dead Poet Society"? That teacher Keating is a model how all teachers & principals should be: "Now in my class you will learn to think for yourselves again. ... No matter what anybody tells you, words and ideas can change the world."
Who of the students, of the young people, of the people in general actually do think for themselves? Not really many do. Most people muzzle themselves, don't even dare to think in other ways than shown by the more influent ones; which has been described as the spiral of silence.

---

Account frozen...

OK...my 2 bits. Andrew Meyer acted like rabble rousing idiot that got what he deserved. Two points......
1. If he had acted in a civil manner, he could have asked his questions and expected a response (assuming time had not run out, which was inferred in some posts). He may have received the typical political non-response, but a response just the same. Instead, he chose to act like a lunatic, and got the response accorded someone acting like a lunatic.
2. At such point that it was apparent that those sponsoring the open forum were not going to put up with his shenanigans and insisted that he leave, he could have cooperated with the enforcement personnel and left peacefully, even if he wanted to keep shouting his objections all the way out. That certainly would have accorded him a bit more positive press that the result he obtained. And probably kept his sorry butt from being tased or batoned.

---

"Freedom is just Chaos, with better lighting." Alan Dean Foster

Thorin and Simon. Although normally I am loathe to post anything about stuff like this, I am going to make an exception in this case.

First of all. Mr. Meyer is well known for pulling stupid pranks and having them broadcast on the internet. This is just another case of him doing so, but this time it got out of hand.

Second. The police were WELL within their rights to subdue Mr Meyer when he refused to remove himself from the stage after his microphone was cut off.

Third. After he was physically removed from the audience podium and taken to the back of the auditorium, he continued to struggle. He was warned several times that if he continued to struggle, he would be tasered. That is where his idiotic " DON'T TAZE ME, BRO " line came into play. The fact that while he said that, he continued to struggle means that he was TRYING to get tazered so that it could be put out on the internet just like most of the other stupid things he has done.

It would seem to me that you ( Being in Germany ) haven't had the opportunity to see the movie Jackass. I would highly suggest that you see that movie and then take another good look at that video.

The entire situation was setup by Mr Meyer for no other reason than to get some attention from the media.

There are many people in this country who would be willing to do almost anything for their ( to paraphrase Andy Warhol ) 15 minutes of fame.

This is not a case of " police brutality ". He was not removed simply for asking questions. He was removed because of his conduct. The questions he asked had nothing to do with his being hit with the taser/stun gun. His continued struggles ( even after being warned about the consequences several times ) is what got him the treatment.

One thing about this country is that people are free to say what they want to say ( within reason, of course ). BUT....under NO circumstances are you allowed to be a threat to any important politician or public figure. Just because Mr Kerry's importance may be somewhat debatable does not mean that Mr Meyer could give even a hint of being a threat to Senator Kerry. Once he lunged ( even to simply get away from the officers ) in the general direction of Senator Kerry, he became a possible threat to the Senator's safety. The police acted in the way they were TRAINED to act. They were there to protect the Senator. That is exactly what they did.

Also....six ( or however many there was as the time he got tasered ) officers may have seemed to be excessive, but you must keep in mind that certain illegal drugs ( PCP/Angel Dust being the best example ) in this country have the effect of giving people a lot more strength than they would normally have because the drug effects the body's ability to feel pain and therefore the limits of it's endurance. The police had no way of knowing if Mr Meyer was under the influence of one of those drugs, so there was no way for them to be absolutely sure that Mr Meyer would not have been able to get away from only 1 or 2 officers.

In conclusion..the police acted exactly as they SHOULD have. There was nothing wrong with what they did under the circumstances they were provided.

I am neither " left wing " nor " right wing ". There is no " spin " on my posts. I am as " middle of the road " as anyone I know. I can see things from both sides of an argument in most cases. In this case, however, there really is no argument from the other side.

I would highly suggest that you go and watch the movie I mentioned earlier. When you do, and then take a good look at the video again, you will see that this was nothing more than a call for attention by Mr Meyer.

---

Air Cold, the blade stops;
from silent stone,
Death is preordained

Calm Chaos Forums : Everyone Welcome

OK...my 2 bits. Andrew Meyer acted like rabble rousing idiot that got what he deserved. Two points......
1. If he had acted in a civil manner, he could have asked his questions and expected a response (assuming time had not run out, which was inferred in some posts). He may have received the typical political non-response, but a response just the same. Instead, he chose to act like a lunatic, and got the response accorded someone acting like a lunatic.
2. At such point that it was apparent that those sponsoring the open forum were not going to put up with his shenanigans and insisted that he leave, he could have cooperated with the enforcement personnel and left peacefully, even if he wanted to keep shouting his objections all the way out. That certainly would have accorded him a bit more positive press that the result he obtained. And probably kept his sorry butt from being tased or batoned.

Hate to say this in front of the others, but I agree with you.

There are 'rules' or behavioral standards at events like this. What right does he have to disrupt the event and prevent others from asking their questions? Are not all the people equally allowed to ask questions? Why should he be allowed to interrupt another person question (and perhaps answer)?

I have heard from others that even after starting to make a scene he was given the opportunity to ask his question, but instead chose to continue to rant and rave. If this is the case then he should have been removed to allow more constructive talk. And instead of leaving he chose to refuse and continue making a scene. If so, why should he be allowed to continue to do so? Why should he be allowed to stop other from having their say? For all you know the next person might have actually had a good legitimate and very important question to ask that could have changed the political structure of the country for the better but now misses out because this person's actions. Why?

---

Never surrender and never give up. In the darkest hour there is always hope.

Also....six ( or however many there was as the time he got tasered ) officers may have seemed to be excessive, but you must keep in mind that certain illegal drugs ( PCP/Angel Dust being the best example ) in this country have the effect of giving people a lot more strength than they would normally have because the drug effects the body's ability to feel pain and therefore the limits of it's endurance. The police had no way of knowing if Mr Meyer was under the influence of one of those drugs, so there was no way for them to be absolutely sure that Mr Meyer would not have been able to get away from only 1 or 2 officers.

Just ask any nurse in the emergency dept. of a hospital about what drugs do. In Aus. nurses have been assaulted by people under the effect of drugs and have been extremely difficult to control or restrain for their safety and that of others.

---

Never surrender and never give up. In the darkest hour there is always hope.

OK...my 2 bits. Andrew Meyer acted like rabble rousing idiot that got what he deserved. Two points......
1. If he had acted in a civil manner, he could have asked his questions and expected a response (assuming time had not run out, which was inferred in some posts). He may have received the typical political non-response, but a response just the same. Instead, he chose to act like a lunatic, and got the response accorded someone acting like a lunatic.
2. At such point that it was apparent that those sponsoring the open forum were not going to put up with his shenanigans and insisted that he leave, he could have cooperated with the enforcement personnel and left peacefully, even if he wanted to keep shouting his objections all the way out. That certainly would have accorded him a bit more positive press that the result he obtained. And probably kept his sorry butt from being tased or batoned.

Hate to say this in front of the others, but I agree with you.

There are 'rules' or behavioral standards at events like this. What right does he have to disrupt the event and prevent others from asking their questions? Are not all the people equally allowed to ask questions? Why should he be allowed to interrupt another person question (and perhaps answer)?

I have heard from others that even after starting to make a scene he was given the opportunity to ask his question, but instead chose to continue to rant and rave. If this is the case then he should have been removed to allow more constructive talk. And instead of leaving he chose to refuse and continue making a scene. If so, why should he be allowed to continue to do so? Why should he be allowed to stop other from having their say? For all you know the next person might have actually had a good legitimate and very important question to ask that could have changed the political structure of the country for the better but now misses out because this person's actions. Why?

Why is it that you hate to say that in front of others? Thank you for doing so.
Mr. Meyer's actions show such a lack of respect for anybody other than himself and his own agenda (whatever the heck that might be), that I don't know how anybody could take the moron seriously.
If you want intelligent people to listen to what you have to say, then you must voice your opinions in an intelligent manner. Not like a total moron. And show a little respect for all the others in attendance, not like you are the only person in the world who has an opinion to voice.
If he wasn't just trying to direct all attention to himself, he could have done this in a sane manner. He got the response that was accorded him by his actions.
He gets no sympathy from me. Nor should he from anybody else.

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"Freedom is just Chaos, with better lighting." Alan Dean Foster

Well, look at Schäuble, Reagan, Rabin, Kennedy and all the other countless victims. There are always two sides.

Pah!
Of course: Andrew Meyer deserved to be tasered and jumped upon by these half a dozen of cops -- just like everyone else who has a different opinion than the mainstream and dares to express it deserves to be muzzled, threatened, beaten up, tasered, arrested, even shot down! - Not!
Such a treatment shows how tyrannic that system has become.

In my opinion there are way to few "Andrew Meyer"s in the schools, universities, on public meetings in general!

Do you remember "Dead Poet Society"? That teacher Keating is a model how all teachers & principals should be: "Now in my class you will learn to think for yourselves again. ... No matter what anybody tells you, words and ideas can change the world."
Who of the students, of the young people, of the people in general actually do think for themselves? Not really many do. Most people muzzle themselves, don't even dare to think in other ways than shown by the more influent ones; which has been described as the spiral of silence.

Thank you for the link Zwerg.I wonder how many people read that and thought about it.

I have found the whole tenor of this thread chilling. From what I saw of video clip, nothing that Andrew Meyer did would seem to warrant the reaction that he received.

I have found the whole tenor of this thread chilling. From what I saw of video clip, nothing that Andrew Meyer did would seem to warrant the reaction that he received.

That's because you aren't/weren't responsible for keeping Kerry alive and uninjured.

Those that are, err on the side of caution because the worst that happens is that Andy learns a lesson and the rest of us get hilarious video.

Those that err the other way don't last very long and they aren't doing their jobs.

There's no happy medium here because the risks are too high if you are mistaken about Andy being harmless.

---

Cordially,
Rush

elrushbo2@theobviousgmail.com
Remove the obvious...

Of course: Andrew Meyer deserved to be tasered and jumped upon by these half a dozen of cops -- just like everyone else who has a different opinion than the mainstream and dares to express it deserves to be muzzled, threatened, beaten up, tasered, arrested, even shot down! - Not! Such a treatment shows how tyrannic that system has become.

Did the people at MoveOn that took out a full page ad in the NYTimes get tasered? Did all those fools that were demonstrating in Jena get tasered? No one walked up to Andy and tasered him out of the blue, they tasered him because he was resisting arrest. He has freedom of speech, but he does not have the right to be heard, or the right to disrupt the proceedings, or anything similar.

That you would have handled it differently is of no concern, because you were not responsible for Kerry's safety and did not have to make those decisions.

In my opinion there are way to few "Andrew Meyer"s in the schools, universities, on public meetings in general!

What a delight those would be. Everyone screaming over everyone else, no one like Kerry or anyone else ever bothering to attend, the endless and hollow cry of the impotent screeching at the impotent. Lovely.

Who of the students, of the young people, of the people in general actually do think for themselves? Not really many do. Most people muzzle themselves, don't even dare to think in other ways than shown by the more influent ones; which has been described as the spiral of silence.

This is their choice, they are free to choose this way, and they have every right to, no matter what you happen to think about it.

---

Cordially,
Rush

elrushbo2@theobviousgmail.com
Remove the obvious...

Pah!
Of course: Andrew Meyer deserved to be tasered and jumped upon by these half a dozen of cops -- just like everyone else who has a different opinion than the mainstream and dares to express it deserves to be muzzled, threatened, beaten up, tasered, arrested, even shot down! - Not!
Such a treatment shows how tyrannic that system has become.

In my opinion there are way to few "Andrew Meyer"s in the schools, universities, on public meetings in general!

Do you remember "Dead Poet Society"? That teacher Keating is a model how all teachers & principals should be: "Now in my class you will learn to think for yourselves again. ... No matter what anybody tells you, words and ideas can change the world."
Who of the students, of the young people, of the people in general actually do think for themselves? Not really many do. Most people muzzle themselves, don't even dare to think in other ways than shown by the more influent ones; which has been described as the spiral of silence.

Thank you for the link Zwerg.I wonder how many people read that and thought about it.

I have found the whole tenor of this thread chilling. From what I saw of video clip, nothing that Andrew Meyer did would seem to warrant the reaction that he received.

I think it's quite a bit funny that in the name of 'free speech' he's defended....and the Iranian Mullahs as well....

It's a bit sad really when half of the 'Gang of 30' have been instructed to have me blocked '.

Yet you CONTINUE to post in my threads yet won't address me directly.

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Founder of BOINC team Objectivists. Oh the humanity! Rational people crunching data!
I did NOT authorize this belly writing!