Death Penalty...right or wrong?


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Message 608470 - Posted: 25 Jul 2007, 16:27:48 UTC

Some pervert kidnapped and raped and murdered a little girl on July 4th. He is a convicted level 3 offender and now they are finding connections to many more...Why should this animal live? Does ANYONE actually believe a person in jail sits and feels the least bit guilty about what they have done? They don't, they are not eaten with guilt so why keep them alive? Try and give a real answer and not one you heard someone else like your preacher use...
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Message 608594 - Posted: 25 Jul 2007, 20:50:29 UTC

Simple really,

People dont care enough about what goes on as long as it doesn't affect themselves. Those who do care enough usually are the ones saying "Killing is wrong, there are other ways" This is why there is no Death penalty in many places.

Personally I belive anyone who is a repeat offender needs some other treatment than jail since obviously jail didn't work.

2 Choices that I can think of...

1. Criminal concentration camp. Make them work to continue living, if they kill themselves then its no big loss.

2. Death penalty.

I honeslty would rather see the first one of the two because then if its done right could make a little money for other things such as catching more criminals, more schools, etc.

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Message 608643 - Posted: 25 Jul 2007, 22:23:56 UTC - in response to Message 608594.

Simple really,

People dont care enough about what goes on as long as it doesn't affect themselves. Those who do care enough usually are the ones saying "Killing is wrong, there are other ways" This is why there is no Death penalty in many places.

Personally I belive anyone who is a repeat offender needs some other treatment than jail since obviously jail didn't work.

2 Choices that I can think of...

1. Criminal concentration camp. Make them work to continue living, if they kill themselves then its no big loss.

2. Death penalty.

I honeslty would rather see the first one of the two because then if its done right could make a little money for other things such as catching more criminals, more schools, etc.

~BoB


I like option #1 better also. At least they could pay back society a bit...Be a good deterrent also.
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Message 608686 - Posted: 26 Jul 2007, 0:07:05 UTC

I think only if a rapist, a child rapist, a murderer is to total 100.0000000000% proved guilty by all possible scientific means, with absolutely 0.00000000000% probability that this person can NOT have done it, then death penalty is right. But if there is even the tiniest possibility for a doubt, then it should be life sentence...
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Message 608689 - Posted: 26 Jul 2007, 0:12:13 UTC - in response to Message 608643.

Simple really,

People dont care enough about what goes on as long as it doesn't affect themselves. Those who do care enough usually are the ones saying "Killing is wrong, there are other ways" This is why there is no Death penalty in many places.

Personally I belive anyone who is a repeat offender needs some other treatment than jail since obviously jail didn't work.

2 Choices that I can think of...

1. Criminal concentration camp. Make them work to continue living, if they kill themselves then its no big loss.

2. Death penalty.

I honeslty would rather see the first one of the two because then if its done right could make a little money for other things such as catching more criminals, more schools, etc.

~BoB


I like option #1 better also. At least they could pay back society a bit...Be a good deterrent also.


In all honesty I think all criminals who offend at any size who would normally goto jail should goto a criminal concentration camp. Of course not all would go there for life but it would still teach them a lesson or 3. (or at least I hope so for their sake)

~BoB
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Message 608717 - Posted: 26 Jul 2007, 0:58:41 UTC

Personally, I would much rather be sentenced to death than be forced to spend the rest of my life tucked away in a ten by ten cell with a guy named Bubba...

'Give me liberty or give me death'... ;)
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Message 608722 - Posted: 26 Jul 2007, 1:07:08 UTC - in response to Message 608686.

I think only if a rapist, a child rapist, a murderer is to total 100.0000000000% proved guilty by all possible scientific means, with absolutely 0.00000000000% probability that this person can NOT have done it, then death penalty is right. But if there is even the tiniest possibility for a doubt, then it should be life sentence...

I would agree with that also, DNA got this guy. So he makes a deal to tell where the body is and gets life. Just like they did the Green River Killer. I always thought I was a bit liberal but this is getting ridiculous.
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Message 608723 - Posted: 26 Jul 2007, 1:08:02 UTC - in response to Message 608717.

Personally, I would much rather be sentenced to death than be forced to spend the rest of my life tucked away in a ten by ten cell with a guy named Bubba...

'Give me liberty or give me death'... ;)

You would be amazed at how adaptable you really are...IMO
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Message 610232 - Posted: 28 Jul 2007, 0:10:30 UTC

We punish killers because killing is the ultimate crime.

But to punish them by killing?
Surely that is committing the same crime? Becoming like the killer?

Deterrent:
The USA has the death penalty, the countries of western Europe don't.
Which has the higher murder rate? It's the USA. This suggests the death penalty is not a deterrent. In fact maybe it goes the other way, serving to brutalise society and devalue life. Or whatever theory you like the facts are there to be seen.

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Message 610364 - Posted: 28 Jul 2007, 2:51:39 UTC - in response to Message 610232.
Last modified: 28 Jul 2007, 2:52:37 UTC

We punish killers because killing is the ultimate crime.

But to punish them by killing?
Surely that is committing the same crime? Becoming like the killer?

Deterrent:
The USA has the death penalty, the countries of western Europe don't.
Which has the higher murder rate? It's the USA. This suggests the death penalty is not a deterrent. In fact maybe it goes the other way, serving to brutalise society and devalue life. Or whatever theory you like the facts are there to be seen.

Yep that is it...My step-Daughter witnessed a guy stab a guy at a party and the guy died, she testified and we were notified a few months ago that after 3 years he is getting out. No wonder our murder rate is so high. In Europe he would have done real time. Here it is a slap on the wrist. The mother of the child should be able to choose how this animal dies!
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Message 611014 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 13:01:27 UTC

My personal opinion on capital punishment is that it is wrong because I think that there are NO circumstances under which any indivudal (or the state, for that matter) has the right to terminate or severely restrict the life of another indivdual. For that reason, I also oppose long jail sentences, although I can't think of any alternative punishment ATM, either.

On the other hand, I often think that for some crimes, there is no more appropriate punishment. When I hear of certain crimes, I'd sometimes even like to kill the criminal myself, despite knowing that I don't have the right. Well, perhaps I'm just too emotional to deal with these kinds of crime...

In the end, I think that the emotional approach is the wrong one, because I still think that capital punishment can never coexist with the individuals' fundamental rights and the notion of a state protecting these rights.

Which has the higher murder rate? It's the USA. This suggests the death penalty is not a deterrent.


I think that this has more to do with the rather easy access to guns in the USA. You know, most killings probably happen when intense emotions are involved, and I don't think that the killers can think about their punishment.
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Message 611044 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 13:50:42 UTC - in response to Message 610232.

We punish killers because killing is the ultimate crime.

But to punish them by killing?
Surely that is committing the same crime? Becoming like the killer?

Deterrent:
The USA has the death penalty, the countries of western Europe don't.
Which has the higher murder rate? It's the USA. This suggests the death penalty is not a deterrent. In fact maybe it goes the other way, serving to brutalise society and devalue life. Or whatever theory you like the facts are there to be seen.


Worldwide Per Capita Murder Rates

You may be surprised that the USA is NOT #1.

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Message 611075 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 15:11:14 UTC - in response to Message 611044.

You may be surprised that the USA is NOT #1.


He was comparing the USA against states of Western Europe. While the USA are number 24 on your list, the first country of Western Europe is number 33 (Portugal), which has just slightly more than half the murder rate of the USA.

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Message 611208 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 17:52:00 UTC - in response to Message 611014.

My personal opinion on capital punishment is that it is wrong because I think that there are NO circumstances under which any indivudal (or the state, for that matter) has the right to terminate or severely restrict the life of another indivdual. For that reason, I also oppose long jail sentences, although I can't think of any alternative punishment ATM, either.



I feel once someone has taken anothers life,all bets are off and they then are subject to the same terms they show other life. Why should they have rights they don't actually believe in except when conveniant? All life is sacred, untill you take one, then it becomes easier....
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Message 611210 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 17:58:33 UTC

The death penalty is barbaric
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Message 611214 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 18:11:50 UTC - in response to Message 611210.

The death penalty is barbaric

So is locking people in Cages...But I wouldn't want them still on the streets. War is barbaric but we still seem to fight them. Most countries in the World are still barbaric...That is a part of living and dying. If you take a life in anger yours should be subject to the family of the one you took. That would be fair but then life ISN'T fair....
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Message 611314 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 20:37:32 UTC
Last modified: 29 Jul 2007, 20:40:44 UTC

I know I will be disagreed...

But in my opinion, persons who destroy a life or a soul just because they want - I explicitly mean murderers(*) and rapists - don't earn to have the right to be treated as humans anymore. They are monsters and the society needs to be saved against them even by taking the monster's life. An animal which kills a human is killed though animals only attack humans either because of fear or other natural, instinctive reasons - so a murderer (see footnote) also earns to be killed.

* According to the German definition, a murderer is: "whoever kills a human being out of murderous lust, to satisfy his sexual desires, from greed or otherwise base motives, treacherously or cruelly or with means dangerous to the public or in order to make another crime possible or cover it up."
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Message 611351 - Posted: 29 Jul 2007, 22:20:14 UTC - in response to Message 611214.

The death penalty is barbaric

So is locking people in Cages...But I wouldn't want them still on the streets. War is barbaric but we still seem to fight them. Most countries in the World are still barbaric...That is a part of living and dying. If you take a life in anger yours should be subject to the family of the one you took. That would be fair but then life ISN'T fair....


So that's all right then, we just respond to one form of barbarism with another? How is society to progress if we give an eye for an eye?
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Message 611435 - Posted: 30 Jul 2007, 1:22:23 UTC - in response to Message 611351.

The death penalty is barbaric

So is locking people in Cages...But I wouldn't want them still on the streets. War is barbaric but we still seem to fight them. Most countries in the World are still barbaric...That is a part of living and dying. If you take a life in anger yours should be subject to the family of the one you took. That would be fair but then life ISN'T fair....


So that's all right then, we just respond to one form of barbarism with another? How is society to progress if we give an eye for an eye?


Seems and eye for an eye has been going on as long as civilization has been around and we have progressed just fine. Maybe because the law of nature survival of the fittest no longer applies we need to take care of some ourselves. I can't see paying for a Monster to have it easy in jail...And they get used to it...That is why so many reoffend just to go back.
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Message 611437 - Posted: 30 Jul 2007, 1:22:45 UTC - in response to Message 611351.

The death penalty is barbaric

So is locking people in Cages...But I wouldn't want them still on the streets. War is barbaric but we still seem to fight them. Most countries in the World are still barbaric...That is a part of living and dying. If you take a life in anger yours should be subject to the family of the one you took. That would be fair but then life ISN'T fair....


So that's all right then, we just respond to one form of barbarism with another? How is society to progress if we give an eye for an eye?


Many seem to have forgotten our grass roots. We are animals just like all the others. It doesn't matter how advanced we are or how smart we are, we are animals. Survival of the fitest.

Its a case of apples and oranges. Apples may be better, they may think they are better but are they better? They both still grow from trees and they are still food to me.

~BoB
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