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Number crunching :
Progress?
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Author | Message |
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itenginerd Send message Joined: 1 Aug 00 Posts: 37 Credit: 39,905 RAC: 0 |
In what I remember seeing from late last week, I haven't seen the validation queue grow much at all... I would expect that we would have broken 400,000 over the weekend if it was just a function of some uploads coming in to ease the load. Granted, I could be misremembering--somebody let me know if you've got real numbers on this! 1) Are the stats pages not updating correctly? They've worked up to now, so I doubt that they're suddenly out to lunch. (Got some graphs Scarecrow?) 2) Are we actually successfully DoS'ing the UL server? What are the options to fix that, S@H staff? Where do we go from here--because it's somewhat apparent that we aren't going anywhere right now with the status quo... 366,908 results in VQ as of 16:40 UTC 12/12/05. (j) James |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20142 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
...1) Are the stats pages not updating correctly? They've worked up to now, so I doubt that they're suddenly out to lunch. (Got some graphs Scarecrow?) Yes, most of the numbers are out of date. Various back end services are disabled or otherwise not functioning while the present glitches are cleared. This also means that all current WU results are not going to time out regardless of their deadlines. 2) Are we actually successfully DoS'ing the UL server? What are the options to fix that, S@H staff? Yes, although the Boinc design is meant to avoid this. I think some assumptions on the exponential backoff numbers that is meant to avoid this are a little off... Hang in there for the next update! Where do we go from here--because it's somewhat apparent that we aren't going anywhere right now with the status quo... 366,908 results in VQ as of 16:40 UTC 12/12/05. That depends on what you can see or not. The data upload rate is increasing although it is still very erratic. Berkeley will fathom where the latest bottleneck is and produce a fix. They'll likely also add further improvements to make the Boinc system more resiliant for this type of problem. Meanwhile, we just need to chill out and watch the story unfold. There's other Boinc projects to take up the slack in the mean time. Happy crunchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
Idefix Send message Joined: 7 Sep 99 Posts: 154 Credit: 482,193 RAC: 0 |
Hi, Where do we go from here--because it's somewhat apparent that we aren't going anywhere right now with the status quo... 366,908 results in VQ as of 16:40 UTC 12/12/05.The scheduler is not responding --> These graphs are meaningless in the moment. Regards, Carsten |
Ulrich Metzner Send message Joined: 3 Jul 02 Posts: 1256 Credit: 13,565,513 RAC: 13 |
Ok, and what happens to the results i have to leave on the computer @ work, when i go into holidays on next thursday and will not return before the next year? Thanks Berkeley, for once again wasting my time and money... :/ Aloha, Uli |
Borgholio Send message Joined: 2 Aug 99 Posts: 654 Credit: 18,623,738 RAC: 45 |
Ok, and what happens to the results i have to leave on the computer @ work, when i go into holidays on next thursday and will not return before the next year? Are you the kind of person who volunteers your spare time to the Red Cross and then get pissed because you're not getting paid? You will be assimilated...bunghole! |
Ulrich Metzner Send message Joined: 3 Jul 02 Posts: 1256 Credit: 13,565,513 RAC: 13 |
Are you the kind of person who volunteers your spare time to the Red Cross and then get pissed because you're not getting paid? That's exactly the kind of answer i expected from an expert like you... Aloha, Uli |
Borgholio Send message Joined: 2 Aug 99 Posts: 654 Credit: 18,623,738 RAC: 45 |
Are you the kind of person who volunteers your spare time to the Red Cross and then get pissed because you're not getting paid? It doesn't take an expert to know what "volunteer" means. It means you donate your spare time / money / effort to a cause, without expecting any payment in return. Berkeley never forced you to donate anything. You did it of your own free will. So if you consider this a waste, it's your own dumb-a$$ fault for donating. Not Berkeley's. You will be assimilated...bunghole! |
Jord Send message Joined: 9 Jun 99 Posts: 15184 Credit: 4,362,181 RAC: 3 |
Isn't volunteering the same in Germany? How come an unforseen problem at Seti made you crunch extra for electricity and time? What time? The otherwise idle time? Or the otherwise time the computer would have been off? Which you couldn't have done by yourself, because someone from Berkeley pressured you into signing a contract that you had to crunch Seti units for all this time... am I correct? I wonder who you blame when the bus you use to go to the airport will break down, due to which you will miss your airplane. Will you blame yourself for taking the bus? Will you blame the bus driver for not continuing? Will you blame the bus company for not replacing the bus? Will you blame the company you fly with for not halting the plane until you got on (3 days late)? Will you blame the airport for not keeping your plane on the tarmac until you were on? i have to leave on the computer @ work ... Now I do wonder, how do these two relate? Is your boss demanding money from you for using the computer at work? Or are you boss? |
Ulrich Metzner Send message Joined: 3 Jul 02 Posts: 1256 Credit: 13,565,513 RAC: 13 |
unforseen? hahaha! Spare that cheerleading crap for noobs, i already know it by heart... bye, happy Xmas'n stuff Aloha, Uli |
Borgholio Send message Joined: 2 Aug 99 Posts: 654 Credit: 18,623,738 RAC: 45 |
unforseen? hahaha! Cheerleading? You mean they should have the ability to forecast server problems well in advance? You're saying they should have the magic talent to predict every crash / breakdown / power surge before they happen? You really ARE stupid. Merry Xmas? Sheesh...Santa won't even bother bring you coal. You'd be lucky if you got run over by his sleigh. You will be assimilated...bunghole! |
Whiskey Send message Joined: 5 Sep 04 Posts: 981 Credit: 640,589 RAC: 0 |
Hey, Here's a great idea. Why don't you just leave BOINC running, turn off your Monitor for a few days, get out of the house, go to the Pub, Sports Centre or do whatever you do when you are'nt staring at the Monitor and the TV. There is a life outside your house, there are people out there who have never heard of SETI, BOINC and Distributed Computing and don't give a damn about it. Join the #1 UAE Team. |
Zap de Ridder Send message Joined: 9 Jan 00 Posts: 227 Credit: 1,468,844 RAC: 1 |
One thing I can tell, wus getting reported right now. |
harald hermann Send message Joined: 21 Jun 99 Posts: 10 Credit: 170,618 RAC: 0 |
One thing I can tell, wus getting reported right now. yes you are right. only one to upload reports send but still no download |
Daniel Schaalma Send message Joined: 28 May 99 Posts: 297 Credit: 16,953,703 RAC: 0 |
Cheerleading? You mean they should have the ability to forecast server problems well in advance? You're saying they should have the magic talent to predict every crash / breakdown / power surge before they happen? You really ARE stupid. Merry Xmas? Sheesh...Santa won't even bother bring you coal. You'd be lucky if you got run over by his sleigh. I guess Matt L. lost his Carnak the Magnificent hat. Can't work magic and see into the future without one... Regards, Daniel. |
Borgholio Send message Joined: 2 Aug 99 Posts: 654 Credit: 18,623,738 RAC: 45 |
Cheerleading? You mean they should have the ability to forecast server problems well in advance? You're saying they should have the magic talent to predict every crash / breakdown / power surge before they happen? You really ARE stupid. Merry Xmas? Sheesh...Santa won't even bother bring you coal. You'd be lucky if you got run over by his sleigh. Maybe the complainers can pitch in and get him one for an early Xmas present. You will be assimilated...bunghole! |
itenginerd Send message Joined: 1 Aug 00 Posts: 37 Credit: 39,905 RAC: 0 |
<sigh> I really didn't mean my original post as flame bait. It was meant as a couple of legitimate questions. I've got E@H, which has been rock stable lately, so the current S@H problems are not a big worry. Commentary follows. @ML1: I find your reply unhelpful, and a touch condescending. I don't know if you meant it that way, but that's how I read it. Unless you think I'm a complete newbie, what you said doesn't get us any closer to a solution or in any way answer the original questions I posed. Yes, most of the numbers are out of date. Various back end services are disabled or otherwise not functioning while the present glitches are cleared. Just because the validators are off doesn't mean we can't count what's in the validator queue. Not only can I read the server status page, but I can also read the front page news, the technical news, and lots and lots of whiny, complaining, or argumentative posts in the fora on the matter. Apologies if my post came across as just one more of them--wasn't my intention. My point, which you either missed or ignored, was that if the validator queue figure is right (which it is until I hear a reason why it's wrong), it isn't increasing very quickly. Until it increases significantly, we won't be out of the woods on this outage. Hence the reference to Scarecrow's graphs from the last big outage. Yes, although the Boinc design is meant to avoid this. I think some assumptions on the exponential backoff numbers that is meant to avoid this are a little off... Hang in there for the next update! If we're waiting on a new BOINC CC release to fix this problem we're in deeeep $#!+. Unless you meant the next news update, which we will assuredly wait for. I doubt we'll hear anything useful till the Wed database downtime, though--just a hunch. The data upload rate is increasing although it is still very erratic. Let's not confuse DATA rate with UPLOAD rate. If I get half a result uploaded before the connection times out, then my traffic is raising the DATA rate (which is what Cricket measures) without changing the UPLOAD rate (which is only measured by the validator queue, afaik). One of the things I have noticed is that the first packet of many of my uploads is getting through before the connection times out. Not only does this keep a socket on the UL server open longer, it contributes useless traffic to the Cogent link. Meanwhile, we just need to chill out and watch the story unfold. There's other Boinc projects to take up the slack in the mean time. I wholeheartedly agree. Making whine was not my intention. @Idefix: I completely disagree with you for the reasons mentioned above. Just because the bottle is corked doesn't mean we don't know how much grog is in it. @Uli: While I can sympathize, just remember: we're competing for imaginary numbers. If you think Berkeley's bad, I'd hate to hear you rant about governement... 8) Frankly, nothing else in this thread is worth commenting on. VQ: 455,341 as of 00:20 UTC (j) James |
forward Send message Joined: 1 Jun 99 Posts: 53 Credit: 2,658,479 RAC: 0 |
Ok, and what happens to the results i have to leave on the computer @ work, when i go into holidays on next thursday and will not return before the next year? If you give money to the Red Cross and it loses it in a poker game, it is the same as Berkely throwing away the time you have spent working on Seti. |
Ingleside Send message Joined: 4 Feb 03 Posts: 1546 Credit: 15,832,022 RAC: 13 |
My point, which you either missed or ignored, was that if the validator queue figure is right (which it is until I hear a reason why it's wrong), it isn't increasing very quickly. Until it increases significantly, we won't be out of the woods on this outage. Hence the reference to Scarecrow's graphs from the last big outage. As also shown on the Status-page, the Transitioners is currently over 3 hours backlogged. Since it's the Transitioners job to set the NEED_VALIDATE-flag, there can currently be many reported results that still isn't added to the Validator-queue. Also, since Validator-queue is a wu-count and not result-count, it will not increase as fast "In progress" is dropping. With many backlogged result-uploads, there can be many wu with only 1 or 2 results, meaning not ready for validation, and therefore not showing-up in Validator-queue. Others is 4th result for wu already in Validator-queue. Anyway, just had a result-upload claiming speed 25KB, so it looks like things have improved. :) |
Nebby Send message Joined: 14 May 99 Posts: 54 Credit: 1,896,156 RAC: 0 |
I have seen quite a few of my results upload recently. I think we are are track for a recovery. In fact, it even looks like things are improving rapidly on my end. |
ML1 Send message Joined: 25 Nov 01 Posts: 20142 Credit: 7,508,002 RAC: 20 |
<sigh> I really didn't mean my original post as flame bait... Good and noted. @ML1: I find your reply unhelpful, ... Unless you think I'm a complete newbie, what you said doesn't get us any closer to a solution or in any way answer the original questions I posed. As far as I saw, I tried answering in kind. Sorry, no condescention was intended. Yes, most of the numbers are out of date. Various back end services are disabled or otherwise not functioning while the present glitches are cleared. There's enough of the back end services switched off or disrupted that the numbers visible to us cannot be relied upon, as noted here in this same thread. ...Until it increases significantly, we won't be out of the woods on this outage. Hence the reference to Scarecrow's graphs from the last big outage. That requires a few assumptions or a good understanding of what's happening. More than I know from here. If we're waiting on a new BOINC CC release to fix this problem we're in deeeep $#!+. Not at all. The server side stuff gets fixed to solve the immediate problem(s). Learning from the past few days, the Boinc client then gets updated some time later so that the DDOS type effects are mitigated more gracefully or some other fix is put in place. The data upload rate is increasing although it is still very erratic. Exactly, hence the words I used. Aside, there's just been a big jump up to 45Mbit/s just now. Somethings changed... Meanwhile, we just need to chill out and watch the story unfold. There's other Boinc projects to take up the slack in the mean time. Good comment to end on! Happy crunchin', Martin See new freedom: Mageia Linux Take a look for yourself: Linux Format The Future is what We all make IT (GPLv3) |
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